UK General Election 2015
Discussion
On the Europe in/out issue, considering a referendum happening and it being for out...
What could the EU and its member states do to "punish" us for voting the wrong way? Do you think they would?
Deny a common market / free trade agreement? That would harm them too, but they might still do it to make an example of us. What else could they do to harm us and/or to show other member states "this is what happens if you do that"?
What could the EU and its member states do to "punish" us for voting the wrong way? Do you think they would?
Deny a common market / free trade agreement? That would harm them too, but they might still do it to make an example of us. What else could they do to harm us and/or to show other member states "this is what happens if you do that"?
L555BAT said:
On the Europe in/out issue, considering a referendum happening and it being for out...
What could the EU and its member states do to "punish" us for voting the wrong way? Do you think they would?
Deny a common market / free trade agreement? That would harm them too, but they might still do it to make an example of us. What else could they do to harm us and/or to show other member states "this is what happens if you do that"?
Start to fall apart as other nations follow our lead? Which is arguably as likely as the storyline above.What could the EU and its member states do to "punish" us for voting the wrong way? Do you think they would?
Deny a common market / free trade agreement? That would harm them too, but they might still do it to make an example of us. What else could they do to harm us and/or to show other member states "this is what happens if you do that"?
Halb said:
Is there a list of the biggest/best bet targets for UKiPs?
Something like these maybe?http://www.channel4.com/news/ukip-farage-general-e...
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ukip-target-s...
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/oct/14/uk...
turbobloke said:
Something like these maybe?
http://www.channel4.com/news/ukip-farage-general-e...
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ukip-target-s...
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/oct/14/uk...
Excellent, yeah, ta.http://www.channel4.com/news/ukip-farage-general-e...
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ukip-target-s...
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/oct/14/uk...
turbobloke said:
Did you say Boris is on with Ed? That should be more than Steve Davis interesting.
Yes I did and Marr found them quite amusing after a well controlled start.... Like a couple of unruly children thereafter... 
I find Steve "Interesting" Davis interesting although as you well know, his game ploy is a load of Balls...
BlackLabel said:
In 2010 UKIP had an arrangement with some Tory MPs (those who were members of the 'Better Off Out' group) whereby UKIP did not put up a candidate against them (eg. Carswell, Reckless, Philip Davies, Richard Shepherd and a few others). They should have taken this a step further this time round and UKIP could have withdrawn in seats where they have little chance of winning but could cost the Tories a seat and the Tories do the same in certain other seats (like Heywood and Middleton). It would have been a win-win situation for both because as it stands there are going to be quite a few seats up and down the country where the Cons+UKIP will collectively get 40-50% of the vote yet Labour or the Lib Dems will win the seat.
The trouble with this is that it would send the signal that UKIP is basically a Eurosceptic Tory offshoot, which is a perception UKIP have worked very hard to dispel since 2010. It's also something that is far less true than it was in 2010. UKIP today is a genuinely different political entity, and leaving the European Union is one aspect of a much wider ethos which rejects the orthodox position on climate change, the ever growing state and lopsided multiculturalism. On all these issues the Tories are as much a part of the orthodoxy as Labour. The so called Eurosceptic Tories had their chance during the Maastricht debates, and were mostly found wanting.
Any pact now would have to be very specific and open to MPs of all parties if they would commit to a very specific piece of legislation forcing a fair and open referendum. Then you have to question whether once elected they would actually be committed to this. Finally, if they are, why haven't they defected to UKIP already?
AJS- said:
The so called Eurosceptic Tories had their chance during the Maastricht debates, and were mostly found wanting.
this is the bit that sticks for me...the so-called Tory eurosceptics have demonstrated they are a total bunch of spineless wets.
their lack of commitment or conviction is the reason for the decline of the Tory party in my books.
I have a lot more respect for MP's that stick to their convictions (even if I don't agree with them) than I do for the current sheep-like incumbents.
Johnnytheboy said:
I got doorstepped by the Greens this afternoon.
Nice young man in one of those middle eastern scarves and a silly hat and a fat bearded man in the kind of jumper you'd dig the garden in. Latter did the talking, boy was he persistent.
I tried to head him off by explaining that I was not an environmentalist, was a massive petrol head, and didn't want to vote for a party that would try and stop me driving everywhere as fast as I could. He effectively tried to tell me the greens were the party for the motorist.
I then tried to explain that I was a small state Tory that felt very suspicious of any party that wanted to end austerity and ban things and he still tried to say the Greens were the party for me.
In the end I said "look, I'm trying really hard to tell you to go away politely, but I'm running out of ways, if necessary I will deny climate change is happening", at which point he gave in.
Good to see the Greens are wasting canvassing time on people who will never vote for themNice young man in one of those middle eastern scarves and a silly hat and a fat bearded man in the kind of jumper you'd dig the garden in. Latter did the talking, boy was he persistent.
I tried to head him off by explaining that I was not an environmentalist, was a massive petrol head, and didn't want to vote for a party that would try and stop me driving everywhere as fast as I could. He effectively tried to tell me the greens were the party for the motorist.
I then tried to explain that I was a small state Tory that felt very suspicious of any party that wanted to end austerity and ban things and he still tried to say the Greens were the party for me.
In the end I said "look, I'm trying really hard to tell you to go away politely, but I'm running out of ways, if necessary I will deny climate change is happening", at which point he gave in.
Watched a few of the recent interviews from Labour stating alot of money will come from Bankers Bonuses, Tax Avoidance and Mansion tax (im sure more will come from elsewhere but these are good PR headlines for the 'hard working families'). Do they have any fall back plans on what happens if this money doesn't appear?
We know that if you are very rich you tend to be clever with your money and potentially easier to reduce the amount of addtional tax you need to pay.
Bankers Bonuses - Surely this will be reengineered to be paid differently and reduce the amounts paid.
Mansion Tax - This money is not going to come in right away and potentially lots being put off till you die...so does this mean a shortfall in revenue coming in
Tax Advoidance - No-one has been able to do this 100% so do they suddenly think they can enforce Amazon, Starbucks to suddenly hold there hands up and cough up millions of extra pounds each year?
We know that if you are very rich you tend to be clever with your money and potentially easier to reduce the amount of addtional tax you need to pay.
Bankers Bonuses - Surely this will be reengineered to be paid differently and reduce the amounts paid.
Mansion Tax - This money is not going to come in right away and potentially lots being put off till you die...so does this mean a shortfall in revenue coming in
Tax Advoidance - No-one has been able to do this 100% so do they suddenly think they can enforce Amazon, Starbucks to suddenly hold there hands up and cough up millions of extra pounds each year?
MGJohn said:
turbobloke said:
Did you say Boris is on with Ed? That should be more than Steve Davis interesting.
Yes I did and Marr found them quite amusing after a well controlled start.... Like a couple of unruly children thereafter... I find Steve "Interesting" Davis interesting although as you well know, his game ploy is a load of Balls...
Ended up shouting at the screen when Miliband tried to claim that the Tories are ignoring the debate on the economy and that only Labour would deliver deficit reduction.
Ed's denial that the economic state was interesting given he readily accepted that the state of the economy handed to the coalition was the fault of the banking crisis which was their fault for not regulating it correctly...
His clear denials that they'll do a deal with the SNP - if only vote-by-vote - was laughable as is the implication that the SNats won't extract a heavy price.
His constant framing of the Tories as a party of rich 'fat cat' billionaires living in mansions is pathetic.
That both Labour and Tories say they think they'll win outright majorities is unbelievable but you'd hardly expect them to say anything else.
IainT said:
MGJohn said:
turbobloke said:
Did you say Boris is on with Ed? That should be more than Steve Davis interesting.
Yes I did and Marr found them quite amusing after a well controlled start.... Like a couple of unruly children thereafter... I find Steve "Interesting" Davis interesting although as you well know, his game ploy is a load of Balls...
Ended up shouting at the screen when Miliband tried to claim that the Tories are ignoring the debate on the economy and that only Labour would deliver deficit reduction.
Ed's denial that the economic state was interesting given he readily accepted that the state of the economy handed to the coalition was the fault of the banking crisis which was their fault for not regulating it correctly...
His clear denials that they'll do a deal with the SNP - if only vote-by-vote - was laughable as is the implication that the SNats won't extract a heavy price.
His constant framing of the Tories as a party of rich 'fat cat' billionaires living in mansions is pathetic.
That both Labour and Tories say they think they'll win outright majorities is unbelievable but you'd hardly expect them to say anything else.
MG "Interesting" John has had much interest in all the GEs since Harold Wilson was successful back in October 1964.
None, not a single one has left me anywhere near so very depressed as the whole sickening run-up to this one has done.
Have I changed or has the process changed further for the worse?
One thing is a certainty... none of them have the answers because most fail to face the very serious aspects of harsh reality of the way this Nation has excelled only in getting far too many things quite simply .... WRONG!
So I now regard my vote for any of them will be a wasted vote. Thus my wasted vote will be for Nigel's party.
Currently watching BBC's Daily Politics .... Lefties rule ...
.... 
Meantime ...
..... Desperate Dave is today launching his small business Policy.
Hoo-bleedin'-Ray for that! 'Bout bluddy time! Small business may not be his Party's favourite benefactiors but they keep this nation surviving much moreso than the Tory's BIG Business paymasters.
UKIP's Suzanne Evans answering lefty luvvies loaded questions quite impressively ... as per usual. Well done that woman..
Boydie88 said:
Right, Lib Dems.
Clegg on Radio 2 now. So far a load of stuff about Lib Dems being key part to forming a coalition.
Are they actually going to hold seats? Who would vote for them after showing themselves to be completely spineless?
I see them as exactly the oppositeClegg on Radio 2 now. So far a load of stuff about Lib Dems being key part to forming a coalition.
Are they actually going to hold seats? Who would vote for them after showing themselves to be completely spineless?
They sided with the tories to help get us out of the s
t labour left us inI would happily vote Lib Dem
McWigglebum4th said:
I see them as exactly the opposite
They sided with the tories to help get us out of the st labour left us in
I would happily vote Lib Dem
It's a good point, but the supporters of them who have seen them change their mind on a few key policies surely won't stick to them?They sided with the tories to help get us out of the s
t labour left us inI would happily vote Lib Dem
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