The 2015 Rallying Thread
Discussion
GravelBen said:
Confirmed now I see. Will be interesting to see what happens at m-sport. I think they'd be silly not to take Ostberg if they can, his experience should help them find more consistent results.
he isn't very fast though is he? But msport may well take him because of the dollar.As msport are the only team running customer cars, there appears to be a queue of drivers wanting their fix for '16. I am hoping that he is able to charge enough money from the customer teams so that he can employ someone fast, like, erm, err, Meeke maybe?
However Kubica is floating around with some cash, and Evans is steady Eddie. I can't really call it, as what are Malcolm's motivations, is it purely the dollar, or does he want to show Ford that he builds winning cars, if takes the former he ain't getting the latter. Meeke is suspiciously quiet, surely he has something warming in the fire?
I think next year is one to get through before the new 2017 cars. It's Ogier & VW to dominate again.
I can't see Ford returning officially, especially now as they have the dual programme with the Ford GT - that seems to be their global Motorsport programme. Gerard Quinn ( Ford of Europe Motorsport boss) did state they needed to see better marketing & promotion of the WRC. I don't think it is any better.
I'm sure Kubica has the funds for a drive, as for Meeke, who knows what, and were he'll be. He's been a PSA test & development driver for years - he's likely the best man for the 2017 car.
I can't see Ford returning officially, especially now as they have the dual programme with the Ford GT - that seems to be their global Motorsport programme. Gerard Quinn ( Ford of Europe Motorsport boss) did state they needed to see better marketing & promotion of the WRC. I don't think it is any better.
I'm sure Kubica has the funds for a drive, as for Meeke, who knows what, and were he'll be. He's been a PSA test & development driver for years - he's likely the best man for the 2017 car.
Ostberg can be fast on gravel, below average on tarmac. I don't know if he's ever connected that well with the Citroen, the Ford might suit his driving style better. He did beat Meeke for points this year despite missing Australia after that recce crash, but Meeke certainly performed better in latter part of the season.
I expect Meeke would prefer to stay with Citroen even if they miss a few rounds, because it puts him in a good position for 2017 (developing the new car etc). Citroen don't have any better options that I can think of either.
Evans hasn't really impressed me much this year, just the odd flash of top pace (generally on tarmac). Some of the struggles seemed due to car setup issues though, which may benefit from data-sharing with a more experienced driver like Ostberg in the team. Wilson may want to keep a Brit driver to maintain local support, and he certainly seems a fan of Evans even when he is struggling.
As said Kubica would bring sponsor money and unquestionable speed, several of his DNFs have been due to car problems but his consistency record would still be a gamble. But if Wilson wants someone to prove his frequent claims that the car is capable of rally-winning speed...
I expect Meeke would prefer to stay with Citroen even if they miss a few rounds, because it puts him in a good position for 2017 (developing the new car etc). Citroen don't have any better options that I can think of either.
Evans hasn't really impressed me much this year, just the odd flash of top pace (generally on tarmac). Some of the struggles seemed due to car setup issues though, which may benefit from data-sharing with a more experienced driver like Ostberg in the team. Wilson may want to keep a Brit driver to maintain local support, and he certainly seems a fan of Evans even when he is struggling.
As said Kubica would bring sponsor money and unquestionable speed, several of his DNFs have been due to car problems but his consistency record would still be a gamble. But if Wilson wants someone to prove his frequent claims that the car is capable of rally-winning speed...
Edited by GravelBen on Saturday 28th November 04:56
GravelBen said:
Ostberg can be fast on gravel, below average on tarmac. I don't know if he's ever connected that well with the Citroen, the Ford might suit his driving style better. He did beat Meeke for points this year despite missing Australia after that recce crash, but Meeke certainly performed better in latter part of the season.
I expect Meeke would prefer to stay with Citroen even if they miss a few rounds, because it puts him in a good position for 2017 (developing the new car etc). Citroen don't have any better options that I can think of either.
Evans hasn't really impressed me much this year, just the odd flash of top pace (generally on tarmac). Some of the struggles seemed due to car setup issues though, which may benefit from data-sharing with a more experienced driver like Ostberg in the team. Wilson may want to keep a Brit driver to maintain local support, and he certainly seems a fan of Evans even when he is struggling.
As said Kubica would bring sponsor money and unquestionable speed, several of his DNFs have been due to car problems but his consistency record would still be a gamble. But if Wilson wants someone to prove his frequent claims that the car is capable of rally-winning speed...
I thought Bob the Cube had burnt his bridges with Wilson (a spat over used parts and parts/support costs ?) hence why he set up his own team ?I expect Meeke would prefer to stay with Citroen even if they miss a few rounds, because it puts him in a good position for 2017 (developing the new car etc). Citroen don't have any better options that I can think of either.
Evans hasn't really impressed me much this year, just the odd flash of top pace (generally on tarmac). Some of the struggles seemed due to car setup issues though, which may benefit from data-sharing with a more experienced driver like Ostberg in the team. Wilson may want to keep a Brit driver to maintain local support, and he certainly seems a fan of Evans even when he is struggling.
As said Kubica would bring sponsor money and unquestionable speed, several of his DNFs have been due to car problems but his consistency record would still be a gamble. But if Wilson wants someone to prove his frequent claims that the car is capable of rally-winning speed...
Edited by GravelBen on Saturday 28th November 04:56
Either way the Cube may be good for attracting good coverage of whatever car he chooses to drive, but his results have hardly been stellar this year. I can't see a Bob/Malcolm lovefest anytime soon.
I'm with you on Evans, I thought he may have delivered some better results this season. Buuuut, I do wonder just how good the Fiesta is ? If Citroen can't produce a car to beat the Polo, I'm pretty sure M Sport will struggle.
At least Citroen know that they can/could build a Championship winning car (ok, they needed Loeb/Ogier in the mix) but their cars are formidable when kept up to date and with a decent driver behind the wheel. That Meeke dragged the car to the positions he did this season, suggests it's not too far off being competitive, likewise Meeke himself.
M Sport's successes have been been thin on the ground and they've yet to win the WRC with any car they've built to date ? Clearly Gwyndaf has an allegience to Wilson that goes back a long way, so it would be awkward for Elfyn to just walk away. But how many other budding/talented drivers have we seen fade into obscurity after spending too long at M Sport ? Elfyn should do another year with them and move on.
Ostberg has finance, Wilson likes money ..., so my guess is they'll do a deal of some sort. Hopefully Meeke will spend '16 at Citroen honing the 2017 car and doing limited rounds to keep his hand in.
Do we think Neuville will retain his seat at Hyundai next year ?
You may well be right about Bob and M-sport - but I'm pretty sure he's given the Fiesta more stage wins than any of its other drivers. Not the first time privateer drivers have got upset by their 'full WRC spec' m-sport customer cars being rather different to m-sports own cars either is it.
As for Neuville staying with or leaving Hyundai for 2017, I think that will depend very much on how the 2016 season goes. If he gets his mojo back and likes the new car me may stay, if he doesn't improve and Paddon continues his 2015 progress then Hyundai might be quite happy to see Neuville leave.
As for Neuville staying with or leaving Hyundai for 2017, I think that will depend very much on how the 2016 season goes. If he gets his mojo back and likes the new car me may stay, if he doesn't improve and Paddon continues his 2015 progress then Hyundai might be quite happy to see Neuville leave.
News from down under : we are just back from the Alpine Rally http://alpinerally.org.au/ : 430 km competetive over 2 days, over a mix of gravel from fast smooth roads to carbreaking tracks.
No pace notes, no reconnaissance, just a tuliped route chart;
No 4wd, no turbos, with a focus on Historics, including several BDG powered Escorts and a few Lotus Cortinas, for fans of British machinery.
Our trusty 1967 FIAT ended up with basically no brakes, no tyres, and running on 3 1/2 cylinders, the sump guard has multiple 5mm gouges in it, and the carbies touched and bent the bonnet (and themselves) on landing after we got airborne over a crest, but we made it to the finish again!
And the spectators behaved themselves, lit no fires, and left very little rubbish
No pace notes, no reconnaissance, just a tuliped route chart;
No 4wd, no turbos, with a focus on Historics, including several BDG powered Escorts and a few Lotus Cortinas, for fans of British machinery.
Our trusty 1967 FIAT ended up with basically no brakes, no tyres, and running on 3 1/2 cylinders, the sump guard has multiple 5mm gouges in it, and the carbies touched and bent the bonnet (and themselves) on landing after we got airborne over a crest, but we made it to the finish again!
And the spectators behaved themselves, lit no fires, and left very little rubbish
Sounds like a great event. A lot of classic and club rallies here in NZ run blind too, keeps things interesting!
Here is some in-car from a recent local club rally:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baukKReKuzY
Ostberg & Camilli for a M-Sport programme in 1026
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wr...
No word on Evans, and I'll be more than gutted if he has been fully dropped. I think he has got what it takes to mix it with the top boys, just needs that few consistent back to back results to boost the confidence I think.
Meeke will probably stay with Citroen to develop the 2017 car, he'd be daft to go chasing part drives at anyone else, unless Hyundai or VW offer him a full drive in the sister teams. Would Citroen take on 2 drivers under development roles if say Evans/Neuville became seat less?
EDIT
The team is still in discussion with Elfyn and there is potential for him to have some form of programme in 2016. News of this potential programme will be announced when known,” added the spokesperson.
http://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/november/m-sport-dr...
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wr...
M-Sport Website said:
M-Sport World Rally Team will field a mix of proven speed and raw talent as Mads Østberg and Eric Camilli take to the Ecoboost-powered Ford Fiesta RS WRCs for a programme in the 2016 FIA World Rally Championship
No confirmation of a full WRC programme for Camilli, perhaps they intend to do a similar programme as Hyundai have done with Abbring & Paddon this season.No word on Evans, and I'll be more than gutted if he has been fully dropped. I think he has got what it takes to mix it with the top boys, just needs that few consistent back to back results to boost the confidence I think.
Meeke will probably stay with Citroen to develop the 2017 car, he'd be daft to go chasing part drives at anyone else, unless Hyundai or VW offer him a full drive in the sister teams. Would Citroen take on 2 drivers under development roles if say Evans/Neuville became seat less?
EDIT
The team is still in discussion with Elfyn and there is potential for him to have some form of programme in 2016. News of this potential programme will be announced when known,” added the spokesperson.
http://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/november/m-sport-dr...
Edited by RyanTank on Monday 30th November 11:47
Edited by RyanTank on Monday 30th November 11:48
GravelBen said:
Sounds like a great event. A lot of classic and club rallies here in NZ run blind too, keeps things interesting!
Here is some in-car from a recent local club rally:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baukKReKuzY
All our event was forest roads as usual, with often only a few hundred metres between calls : in your vid the co-driver only got to open his mouth a handful of times in the whole stage!
This page is 5 km of a 46 km stage :
No vids up yet, because we only got back today, but a mate was running one of the Escorts, and has miles of in car footage.
GravelBen said:
Sounds like a great event. A lot of classic and club rallies here in NZ run blind too, keeps things interesting!
Here is some in-car from a recent local club rally:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baukKReKuzY
Ideally I'd like to see Elfyn have a full programme, if not with M-Sport then Hyundai 2 (unlikely unless Neuville is let go) or VW 2 (unlikely as they'd have filled a 4th car last season on guest drives)
But I think he'll probably be involved in the testing and development of the 2017 car with a aim to launching it as lead driver in 2017, seeing how well drivers have done with cars they've developed all along, Loeb at Citroen & Ogier at VW.
A lifeline could be thrown to Elfyn with this announcement of Bertelli setting up a team run by M-Sport, although its likely to be Kubica if rumours are to be believed.
But I think he'll probably be involved in the testing and development of the 2017 car with a aim to launching it as lead driver in 2017, seeing how well drivers have done with cars they've developed all along, Loeb at Citroen & Ogier at VW.
A lifeline could be thrown to Elfyn with this announcement of Bertelli setting up a team run by M-Sport, although its likely to be Kubica if rumours are to be believed.
A part program for Elfyn according to David Evans - http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122091
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