Weather the weather

Author
Discussion

R_U_LOCAL

Original Poster:

2,680 posts

208 months

Saturday 10th January 2015
quotequote all
We have a funny attitude to the weather in the UK. We always seem to be surprised by weather which, really, is only doing what it has always done during the appropriate seasons. We also always seem to delight in the extremes of British weather - it's always the wettest April since records began, or the coldest winter since records began, or the warmest year or the windiest third Tuesday in March in a year with a 5 in it since records began - you get the idea.

There is also a perceived inability for the UK to deal with any form of weather which falls slightly outside the norm. A light dusting of snow bring "TRAVEL CHAOS" headlines, a North Atlantic storm brings "DISRUPTION TO THOUSANDS", a particularly cold night brings "DEADLY FROZEN HORROR ROADS OF FREEZING ICY DEATH" - again, you get the idea.

Part of the problem is the ever decreasing quality of news reporting in this country. Instead of reporting the facts – you know – straightforward facts about what is actually happening, the press these days want to inflate every single incident into something terrible and terrifying. I’ve always been reasonably cynical about press reporting in general, but over the last 10 years or so, the main aim of the press seems to have been trying to keep the British population in a continual state of near panic and abject fear.

So let’s start with some basic truths about the weather in the UK. We live in a temperate climate, on an island in North West Europe, susceptible to weather systems approaching from the North Atlantic. Compared with other parts of the world, none of our weather could accurately be described as “extreme”. We sometimes get hot summers, but they’re nothing like those experienced in the Sahara, for instance, or in the deserts of the South West USA. We sometimes get cold winters, but they’re nothing like the winters in Siberia or parts of Northern Canada, where average temperatures are in the minus 30s. Our wet weather cannot compare with countries which are subject to monsoons and our windy weather is nothing like as extreme as the mid-west USA during tornado season.

Our weather is a bit like a Chinese buffet – we get a mild-to-medium taster of all the available weather conditions, without actually suffering anything which could be accurately described as “extreme”.

But, having said all that, weather conditions can and do have an effect on our ability to travel and can be hazardous when driving if you don’t know what you’re doing. They sometimes need a different approach to normal everyday driving and some conditions need a carefully considered approach, so I thought I’d put together a post which includes all the weather conditions we’re likely to experience in this country and give a few short tips for each. So let’s start with:

Rain

Yes, I know – not a very extreme start, but I want to look at all the weather conditions we experience in this country, and, let’s be honest, rain is, depressingly, the most common condition we’re likely to come across in the UK.

Firstly, you need to be able to see, so keep your glass clean on the outside and the inside & replace your wipers when they start to streak.

Keep a little airflow over your windscreen at all times – my preference is to leave the A/C turned on all year round, as it dries the air inside the car and prevents windows from misting.

Don’t be tempted to wipe mist from the inside of your windows with a leather, cloth or sleeve – it will streak badly and will affect your vision. Just wait a second or two and let your heater & A/C do the work.

The amount of rain hitting the windscreen increases with your speed. Use your windscreen wipers as a guide to whether your speed is appropriate. If it’s raining very hard and you have your wipers on maximum speed, but you cannot properly see because the rain is so heavy, then slow down until your vision improves.

Use dipped headlights (but NOT fog lights) when it’s raining to make yourself more visible to other road users.

A wet road surface has less grip – we all know that – but on the road, the difference isn’t as much as you might think, as long as you’re sensible and always drive within your, and the car’s abilities.

Tyre condition is very important on a damp or wet road surface – it is the tread which removes water and allows the tyre to grip with the road surface, and as we all know, tyre grip is all important and can drastically affect your ability to accelerate, brake and corner – all the activities of driving, in fact. So make sure your tyres are good and pressures are correct.

Look out for standing water. If you keep an eye on the design of the road surface i.e. how it is designed to drain, you’ll get a clue as to where the standing water will be.

On a traditional “crown camber” road, the centre of the road is higher than the nearside and offside kerbs, so the water will drain to both edges of the road and you can expect puddles to form from both sides of the road. If the road is crown camber and the water has spread across the entire width of the road, then your best position, if there is no oncoming traffic, is right in the centre of the road, straddling the white line, as this is will be where the water is shallowest.

On a more modern road which is built with “super elevation”, the corners will be consistently banked with the corner apex at the lowest point and the outside of the bend being the highest point. In simple terms, this means that on super elevated roads, whichever direction you are travelling in, water will build up on the apex of left-hand corners. Be ready to adjust your position away from the apex and be ready to adjust your position to allow opposing drivers to do the same.

As for standing water, it can cause aquaplaning if driven through inappropriately. Aquaplaning, in simple terms, is when a “wedge” of water builds up between the front of the tyre and the road surface and the tyre tread can no longer effectively disperse all the water from under the tyre. In even simpler terms, the car effectively starts to “float” across the water and you can no longer steer, brake or accelerate. Not good.

To avoid the worst effects of aquaplaning, if you spot some standing water ahead, try to roll through it without making any driving inputs whatsoever. Lift off the throttle, don’t brake, don’t steer and roll through in a straight line. Grip will resume once you are out of the water.

Hitting standing water with the wheels on one side of the car only can cause a dramatic “pull” towards that side of the car. So if you hit a puddle on the nearside at speed, the car will pull hard to the left. Try to drive round puddles when you can, and keep your speed down & increase your grip on the steering wheel if you can’t. Don’t forget that puddles can hide potholes, so it’s never a good idea to plough through them at unreduced speed if you value your expensive alloys.

If the road appears to be flooded, do not risk driving through unless you’re absolutely sure of the depth of the water and the position of your car’s air intake. If you spot a flood, trust Reg – turn around and go the other way. You really don’t want to be one of those people in one of those pictures published by one of those newspapers. Even if it’s a 30 mile detour, take it.

During autumn, wet roads are made more slippery by the helpful addition of wet leaves and leaf mulch. This can be very slippery – look out for it and adjust your speed accordingly.

Fog

Fog is tricky – it’s effectively cloud which has dropped to ground level and it can be thick, thin, misty, patchy and usually any combination of all of these.

I posted some advice on the correct use of lights and fog lights in another thread, but it’s worth repeating here. To start with – make sure you’re at least displaying dipped headlights when it’s foggy – that should be the absolute minimum and it’s amazing how many people don’t even bother with this basic requirement.

There is a school of thought which suggests that a combination of front fog lights and sidelights is most effective in thick fog. Even the legislation allows for this, giving an exemption from dipped headlights on non-30mph limit roads if it’s foggy & you're displaying a sidelight/fog light combination.

The problem with driving in fog is that any bright light you display to the front is reflected back at you by the fog itself (or by the tiny water droplets which make up fog if you want to be technical).

I used to spectate on a lot of stage rallies, and rally drivers will generally run with no lights at all in thick fog during the daytime because they find no lights gives them better visibility than any other combination of lights (and rally cars tend to have the most varied combinations of lights). On the road in fog, however, no lights isn't really an option because no-one can see you.

I've tried the sidelight/fog light combination in a number of cars and I've never really found it much better than just headlights, and I've often found it worse. The idea is that the low front fog lights project a beam across the road surface, whilst the sidelights prevent excessive light reflection from the fog. Sounds good in theory, but it's not great in reality.

A note on intelligent use of fog lights - many people see mist or fog and then just switch their fog lights on as a sort of pavlovian response & leave them on for the rest of the journey. In reality, the occasions you actually need to use fog lights are extremely limited. Visibility of less than 100 metres is extremely thick fog or very heavy snowfall (the only two weather conditions which would require high intensity fog light use) and those weather conditions are quite rare.

You don't need fog lights when it's a bit misty, or there's a bit of dampness in the air, and you definitely never need them when it’s raining, no matter how torrentially, because the extra glare caused by fog lights reflecting off a wet road create more dangers rather than less.

If you are driving in <100M visibility, your rear fog lights are a priority to ensure traffic approaching from the rear can see you, but once you can see the headlights of following traffic in your mirror, it's usually best to switch off your fog lights, because if you can see their headlights, they'll be able to see your tail lights without fog light assistance. Don't forget that rear fog lights can mask your brake lights and make it more likely that a following vehicle will not see when you are slowing down.

Fog can be patchy too, so switch the fogs on just when they are needed and switch them off as soon as it's clear again.

And remember - they are fog lights – NOT driving lamps, posing lamps or fashion accessories. If you're not in thick fog or snow, leave them switched off!

Don’t forget that fog is actually just tiny droplets of water and will settle on your windscreen. Use the wipers – front and rear – regularly to keep your screen as clear as possible.

And don’t fall into the trap of just following the car in front. Your vision might be badly reduced by the fog, but try to keep scanning past the car in front, and as far into the distance as you can.

Freezing fog

Not much different from normal fog really, but freezing fog occurs when it is very cold and the tiny droplets which make up the fog are mad of ice, rather than water.

In freezing fog, the icy fog can settle on the road surface and make it slippery, so be aware of your grip levels.

You also need to set your heater on a high heat setting, blowing on your windscreen and keep your rear demister on. The freezing fog can settle on your glass and ice up very quickly, so it’s important to keep your glass warm and free from ice.

Frost

If you get up in the morning and you have to scrape ice off your windscreen, then there is a very good chance there will be ice on the road. This might sound ridiculously obvious, but you would not believe how many people don’t make this very simple observation link and after defrosting their car, go out and drive just as if it’s a bright sunny day.

I’ve been informed by people with meteroeoloeoloeologiclogical (!) knowledge that the temperature gauges fitted to cars are not very accurate, but in my view they do at least give an indication when the temperature is getting close to freezing. Mine gives off an ominous “bong” when it drops below 3 degrees and flashes up a warning on the dashboard. This can be helpful when you’re driving from day into night or from low to high altitude, as in those circumstances, it’s not usually obvious to a driver in a nice warm car, that the temperature is dropping outside.

Frost forms a slightly grey-coloured coating on untreated roads, and it’s not easy to spot, particularly at night. The good thing is that, actually, it isn’t as slippery as you might think and it’s quite possible to drive normally on a frosty road surface as long as you are aware that there is a little less grip, that you need a little more time to stop and a little less speed when cornering.

Keep all your inputs smooth and consistent. Be careful in how you transfer the car’s weight around when operating the controls & try to “taper” your inputs. Avoid clumsy, clumpy and clonky inputs as these are more likely to result in a loss of control when Jack Frost is out.

Sheet / Black ice

This is significantly different to frost. Sheet or “black” ice is actually frozen puddles or frozen standing water on the road surface. It is as slippery as – well – as slippery as ice and can be absolutely treacherous if you’re not careful.

Keep in mind all the awareness stuff I spoke about in the last section and the stuff I spoke about relating to standing water & where it forms in the first section. Black ice is frozen standing water - it looks just like standing water and it forms in exactly the same areas that standing water forms.

If you unexpectedly drive onto sheet ice, the first thing you’ll notice is an almost complete lack of any tyre noise whatsoever – silence suddenly descends in the vehicle cabin.

There will be virtually no grip whatsoever between the tyres and the road surface, so avoid making any inputs whatsoever whilst driving over black ice. If you turn the wheel, the car will keep going in a straight line until you leave the ice – at which point you will regain grip, and the car will suddenly shoot off in the direction you have pointed the wheel, which can lead to a sudden loss of control.

So, if you’re caught out by black ice, slide over it and then make any necessary corrections after regaining grip with the road surface. If you’re on an ocean of sheet ice and heading for an accident, muller your brakes and keep them fully on. ABS will help you make the most of the tiny amount of grip available and if nothing else, will reduce the speed of the impact. If you’re a traditionalist and you’ve no ABS, then read up on cadence braking and do the hokey-cokey on the brake pedal.

Strong winds

Strong winds are an invisible hazard, so you need to use your other senses to help you predict their likely effects.

In a car, high winds shouldn’t normally stop you from driving, but it’s a different matter if you’re towing a caravan, riding anything with two wheels or anything larger than a Mercedes Sprinter van. Curtain-sided lorries – particularly when unladen – are probably the worst unless the driver has the nous to pull the curtains back and drive with them open. It still amazes me how many do not follow this simple procedure.

High winds are more of a problem on high and exposed roads and particularly on long, high over-bridges.

Don’t grip the wheel tightly – rather, you should adopt a relaxed, reasonably loose grip on the wheel and try to feel how the wind is affecting the car, ready to apply pressure in the opposite direction to keep a straight course.

If there is a consistently high side wind, be careful when passing high-sided vehicles, as they will temporarily shelter you from the wind and it can feel like you’re being “pulled” in towards them as you pass. If possible, try to pass high-sided vehicles with an extra lane between you and keep your time alongside at a minimum.

Snow

Snow is the weather condition which seems to create more problems than anything else in this country due to people’s general inability to slightly alter their driving style to suit.

I’m not going into much detail about snow tyres & 4 wheel drive, other than to say that winter tyres can make a huge difference in any winter weather conditions and 4 wheel drive can improve your traction on a slippery road (although not as much as many people think), but gives no advantage in braking or steering.

If there is very heavy and consistent snow which is settling on the road surface, then snow chains, socks etc. will help with traction, but they must be fitted to the driven wheels.

In light snow, you should adopt a smooth, steady driving style in much the same way as I described earlier in relation to a frosty road surface.

One mistake many people make is to assume that you must drive very slowly in snow. In fact, it’s important to maintain reasonable momentum, because traction is the issue – particularly on uphill stretches. If you crawl up a hill you’re very likely to run out of traction and get stuck, whereas if you maintain some momentum and keep going, you’re far more likely to make it up the hill.

In deep snow, there is an advantage in turning off your traction control to allow a little wheel-spin. I don’t mean you should sit there with your wheels lit up, but a little slip can help to increase traction, particularly when moving off from stationary.

Tyre tracks form very quickly in snow, and at anything above 20-25 mph, moving out of these tracks onto the undisturbed snow can seriously unsettle the car. This is particularly noticeable on dual carriageways and motorways. Unless it’s absolutely necessary, try to avoid changing lanes, and if you have to, do it very gradually with minimal, smooth inputs.

On exposed roads, snow can drift onto the road from adjacent fields. Look for gaps in hedges and fences, as this is where the snow will drift.

Hail

A hailstorm can be very unpredictable and can occur at any time of the year. It is most dangerous when it falls on a cold day on a dry road, and can be similar to driving on to millions of tiny ball bearings or marbles.

If you encounter sudden hail, just be aware of the immediate reduction in road grip and drive accordingly.

Hot weather

Yes, I know – it’s January, but humour me for a minute.

Have you ever left your car on a hot sunny day and found it almost unbearable when you returned? A few years ago, Mrs L and I were on holiday in Las Vegas during an extreme heatwave – 45 degrees during the day. We left our car outside one day and on returning to it, it was impossible even to get in to the car due to the heat.

To cool a car as quickly as possible, get in, start it up and drop all the windows. Turn the air conditioning on and put the fan on full speed. Leave the windows down for a minute or so until you feel the air from the vents starting to blow cold. The fan will blow most of the hot air out of the car, then put the windows up, and switch the recirculate function on – this will keep the air inside the car cooling without drawing further warm air in from outside.

One other tip on a hot day – avoid parking on grassed areas during a prolonged hot period. Your hot exhaust can easily ignite the dry grass and this is a common cause of car fires in hot countries.

Sorry this was another long post, but, hey – it hasn’t cost anything other than your time to read it!

Feel free to share more weather related tips.

gdaybruce

754 posts

225 months

Saturday 10th January 2015
quotequote all
In relation to wet weather, I would also emphasise that all tyres are not the same. I (or my kids) have bought cars that have come with budget tyres with plenty of tread and have found them pretty well lethal, not just on wet roads but especially on damp, greasy surfaces. They're not known as "ditchfinders" for nothing! Switching to a decent brand has, in all cases, transformed the car. It really annoys me when I hear (as I have) a "tyre technician" from a well known tyre fitting chain telling a customer that the cheap budget tyre is just the same as the full price brand!

I might add that the same applies to tyres that might be from a reputable brand but which are simply old and on which the rubber has hardened.

One further point is that when the road surface is truly wet, then in my view the spray created is much the same as fog and if the spray is reducing visibility to less than 100 yards and provided it's daylight (never in the dark) then I would use the rear fog light. Tell me I'm wrong!

gdaybruce

754 posts

225 months

Saturday 10th January 2015
quotequote all
And a further thought! When it's cold but not quite freezing and the road is damp, beware bridges. The road surface on a bridge cools quicker than the ground and I well remember encountering ice as I crossed a bridge, the revs rising as the wheels span up and then grip returning as I reached the other side.

Having owned a couple of Subarus, I would say that four wheel drive makes a huge difference to traction in the snow. I had a Legacy on normal summer tyres that climbed the snowy hills of North Yorkshire where all around had come to a slithering halt. Made me feel very superior! The LSD acting between the axles certainly helped - you could feel the transmission shunting the torque front to back according to which end had the most grip.

chilistrucker

4,541 posts

151 months

Sunday 11th January 2015
quotequote all
Some cracking advice listed.
The really interesting stand out 1 for me though is the reference to curtain sided lorries, pulling the curtains back in high winds. As a wagon driver the wind can often make the job abit more of a challenge. Back in approx 2004-2005 we were pulling a customers curtainsided trailers on their jobs, they were 45ft long and 14'8 high and we only carried plastic moulded car parts in them, so a full load only went in at 6-8 tonnes gross. So in high winds they made for an interesting trailer to pull. We had been told though, (that even when empty) that we were, 'NOT' allowed to pull the curtains back and strap them accordingly in high/extreme winds as this would, (for some reason) void the insurance. I believe it was due to the effect the winds could then have on the roof structure of the trailer, although i never did get a definitive answer on this.
I remember off loading 1 day in Dover with said trailer on and so would have to run back to Southend empty, with said curtains shut as normal. I'll never forget that drive as the winds that day, and still too this, were the worst winds i've ever driven in over the last 21 years of wagon driving. Jubilee way in Dover had been shut because of the weather, so the route home was out of Dover and head up the M20 and it was frightening, by far the scariest winds I have ever driven in, the constant winds were bad, but the gusts on that day were frightening and its the gusts that will take you over, it got so bad that 2 or 3 times between Dover and Maidstone I actually considered stopping on the hard shoulder to avoid getting blown over by a gust, even though at times I was down to 20-30 mph on the M20. Fortunately I made it back ok that day, but I did end up sitting on the Dartford tunnel approach road for approx 4 hours, as because the winds had been so bad that day, 4 or even possibly 5 lorries had been blown over between junctions 29 and 30 and so they closed the M25 in both directions to avoid any more incidents. The constantly strong winds certainly make for an interesting drive, but its those frightening gusts that cause the most butt clenching moments.

Amongst all of the unusual weathers we do sometimes get over here, winds are most certainly near the top of the list for me, right up there with black ice, but for me personally the scariest by far is the fog.

Riverside

319 posts

218 months

Monday 12th January 2015
quotequote all
Driving through a built up area in the rain or wind pedestrians are likely to be less patient looking for gaps in traffic, and may not hear your approach.

If you need to use your windscreen washers to clean the screen, that same dirt is collecting on the headlamps.

When the sun is low in the sky and directly ahead or behind, put your lights on so you can be seen.

Bright light sources create a blind spot immediately around them that can hide a pedestrian, cyclist, an open car door. A low sun can hide an otherwise perfectly visible truck; main beam from an approaching car on a B-road can hide a tractor.



R_U_LOCAL

Original Poster:

2,680 posts

208 months

Monday 12th January 2015
quotequote all
Riverside said:
Driving through a built up area in the rain or wind pedestrians are likely to be less patient looking for gaps in traffic, and may not hear your approach.
This is a good one. When it's raining, pedestrians are far more willing to be hit by a car than to be hit by some raindrops.

Driving towards a sun low on the horizon in winter usually highlights the dirt and salt on your windscreen. Expect the cars in front to start washing their winscreens.

9xxNick

928 posts

214 months

Wednesday 14th January 2015
quotequote all
Another very informative article Reg. Appreciate you taking the time to do them.

Foppo

2,344 posts

124 months

Wednesday 14th January 2015
quotequote all
Good read most of it is common sense in my opinion.I have driven in all kinds of weather in the UK and abroad.Be prepared and adapt to weather conditions/traffic.

Slow down on M/ways in bad weather and be very vigilant in towns.People crossing roads head down in rain or snow not looking at traffic.It takes experience and willing to learn to become a decent driver.

SK425

1,034 posts

149 months

Thursday 15th January 2015
quotequote all
gdaybruce said:
One further point is that when the road surface is truly wet, then in my view the spray created is much the same as fog and if the spray is reducing visibility to less than 100 yards and provided it's daylight (never in the dark) then I would use the rear fog light. Tell me I'm wrong!
You're not wrong smile. The question to decide whether to switch on rear fog lights is, I think, simple. It's either:

Do I think the driver behind can see me adequately without them?

Or, if there's nobody behind right now:

If a driver were to come on the scene catching me up from behind, could they see me adequately?

In conditions you describe, particularly if it's the second question (i.e. there's nobody behind right now) tail lights can be obscured by the spray even in the dark, so fog lights could be appropriate. Once someone has caught up and is sitting behind you, it's back to the first question.

R_U_LOCAL

Original Poster:

2,680 posts

208 months

Tuesday 20th January 2015
quotequote all
I made a schoolboy error yesterday.

Over the weekend we've had a wierd selection of weather - very heavy snow showers interspersed with strangly warm periods. The snow has been a mixture of flakes and hailstones which setteled everywhere and then started to thaw immediately when the snow stopped falling, but was then topped up by the next shower.

During the day on Sunday, I decided to sweep the snow from my car so I wouldn't have too much of a job de-icing in on Monday morning. i used a soft brush & cleared all the glass, leaving the wipers off the glass overnight.

Monday morning I had an early start, so I defrosted for 5 minutes and set off. I considered removing the couple of inches of frozen snow from the bonnet and roof, but it was frozen solid and wouldn't move.

I drove all the way to work, the temperature stayed well below freezing and I still had the layers of snow strongly attached to roof and bonnet when I arrived at work.

On returning to my car after work, the slight rise in temperature during the day had warmed the snow on the bonnet just enough for it to slide off. It was sitting in a pile in front of my car. The trouble is, I gave this very little thought and did not consider that the roof snow - still a couple of inches thick - had been through yet another slight thaw/freeze cycle.

I set off home, got up to speed on the motorway without any issues, left the motorway ten or so miles later via a medium-speed long left-hander and still no problems.

Five minutes later (and fortunately whilst I was travelling at only 25-30mph, I was forced to brake by a car carelessly reversing out from a side road. Not emergency braking, but reasonably firm braking. As I did so, the roof snow, which after two days of thawing a bit and re-freezing was now akin to a single sheet of white plywood, slid quickly forward off the roof, right across the windscreen and jammed itself under the trailing edge of my bonnet, completely blocking my view ahead.

It was as though someone had just thrown a blanket over the whole bonnet. i was still moving, but couldn't see a thing. Braking just jammed the snow plywood harder into the front scuttle, and I couldn't judge where the nearside kerb was to safely stop without causimg a problem for the cars behind.

I quickly put the wipers on to their fastest speed, which shifted a chunk just big enough to allow me to stop safely and clear the snow before continuing. This could have been much worse if it had happened at a faster speed on the motorway.

In future I'll be clearing all the snow from my car as soon as it stops falling.

Still learning after all these years...

Nigel_O

2,889 posts

219 months

Wednesday 21st January 2015
quotequote all
Another VERY helpful hint is Rain-X - I've been using this since my biking days and the difference in visibility in rain is staggering.

I often used to wonder why other drivers are so cautious on rainy winter rush-hour commutes, but I recently had to use a different car, and quickly realised that the reason people slow down is because they can't see anywhere near as well as I can!

Seriously - on my daily slog up and down the M42 round Birmingham, if its raining decently hard (as opposed to just drizzle) I usually turn my wipers off - Rain-X really is that effective.

IMHO, its a huge safety aid and I can't understand why it isn't more widely used

PS - it also makes removing frost in the mornings much easier

R_U_LOCAL

Original Poster:

2,680 posts

208 months

Friday 30th January 2015
quotequote all
Just a couple of thoughts after driving in some typically British winter slushy snow-ice for a the last few days.

It's fairly obvious that on an icy road your braking distance will be longer - Roadcraft suggests up to ten times longer than on a dry road and I have no reason to disagree with that. With these much longer braking distances in mind, it's important that you extend your following position on other vehicles to a much greater distance than you would in normal weather conditions. I know the car in front will also need 10 times as long to stop, but what if they stop suddenly, due to a collision? Invoke Reg's policy of non-involvement in other people's accidents by keeping well back from other vehicles.

And again, bearing in mind the much extended braking distances on icy roads, if you're sitting at a junction waiting for a gap in which to pull out, the vehicles approaching on the main road will take much longer to slow down if you choose to "nip" out in front of them. This problem if further compounded by the fact that your ability to "nip" out is very much hampered by the lack of traction with the road surface.

Twice in the last two days, I've been leaving what I consider to be a safe gap from the vehicle in front, when the driver of a car in a side road has decided that my safe following gap is perfect for them to "nip" in to. Only to find themselves crawling out of the junction in front of me, wheels scrabbling and spinning away for grip, whilst I've been forced to make full use of my ABS.

It's catch 22 really - close up on the car in front and you've a greater risk of colliding with the car in front, but less risk of a car pulling out on you & causing an accident.

Leave a decent gap and you've less chance of colliding with the vehicle in front, but more chance of some clown pulling out and spoiling your day.

I tend to choose the latter and approach every junction as though someone will pull out - the second time I dealt with it by just steering round the (almost stationary) wheel-scrabbling idiot and continuing on my way.

mp3manager

4,254 posts

196 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
quotequote all
R_U_LOCAL said:
Strong winds

In a car, high winds shouldn’t normally stop you from driving, but it’s a different matter if you’re towing a caravan, riding anything with two wheels or anything larger than a Mercedes Sprinter van. Curtain-sided lorries – particularly when unladen – are probably the worst unless the driver has the nous to pull the curtains back and drive with them open. It still amazes me how many do not follow this simple procedure.
Because pulling the curtains back will either blow the back doors off or blow the roof off.



R_U_LOCAL

Original Poster:

2,680 posts

208 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
quotequote all
mp3manager said:
Because pulling the curtains back will either blow the back doors off or blow the roof off.
And of course, we'd all much rather be blown over than have some damage to the roof or doors.

You'd better contact the DSA then and let them know their advice is wrong. And VOSA. And the HSE. And the Highways Agency.

I don't just make this stuff up you know!

mp3manager

4,254 posts

196 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
quotequote all
R_U_LOCAL said:
And of course, we'd all much rather be blown over than have some damage to the roof or doors.

You'd better contact the DSA then and let them know their advice is wrong. And VOSA. And the HSE. And the Highways Agency.

I don't just make this stuff up you know!
I'd rather trust the advice from the trailer manufacturer, than some quango.

Oh and btw, it's DVSA not VOSA.

Technomad

753 posts

163 months

Monday 23rd February 2015
quotequote all
Good post and I'll echo everything that's been said about winter tyres/AWD, with the former being the most important. One other thing though: I was brought up that, when losing traction, building the revs up slightly then letting them drop to the point where you felt traction was the way to do. And, pre-software control, that generally worked, although if no grip is available (e.g. RWD BMWs with low-profile summer tyres) it still isn't going to help. However… …the first winter we had an X5 and the snow was deep enough to make it work for its living, I tried the usual technique and was disappointed with the results, especially as we were on 18" winters all round. Tried the DSC off bit and that helped somewhat, but still not making brilliant progress. Then I read the manual - essentially it says that when losing traction, INCREASE revs (I'd be paraphrasing to say "give it a bootful") - it appears that this gives the vehicle's systems enough information to work out where and when to shuffle the torque around. Tried it and, after a 1/4 second of wheelspin, it hooked up and shot off uphill through a foot of snow with contemptuous ease. Counterintuitive (for me, anyway) but works every time. Last time I had occasion to use this was about ten minutes ago¬

Steve Lewis

141 posts

284 months

Monday 2nd March 2015
quotequote all
Hi folks. I have been away from Pistonheads for a while so just re-engaging.
Fantastic to see so many and varied posts these days. I was particularly interested with the weather discussion
as for the last few years teaching people about driving in poor weather has been my passion.
To the extent that I set up and run r3rockingham based on the wetgrip area at the Corby facility.

The topics on your pages should be spread to every driver out there. At least to draw to their attention
how close to losing control most drivers are every day.
It is even more necessary for inexperienced/younger drivers who don't the experience gained from
years of driving. As my Mum said…
"Now you've passed your driving test, you will really learn how to drive!"

For all the theory, the one thing we are findig for every driver is…
"You can't just tell a driver to drive better"
By actually feeling the sensations of fear and loss of control, but in safety,
this really provides the driver with a true respect for their actions in the car.
Believe me, it certainly gets your attention more than any video or
simple words can.

Winter tyres were mentioned in the posts. We have spent quite some time on the low grip surfaces
testing many products.
The technology of these tyres is fantastic and they really work. We prove with drivers in the car
exactly how much more grip is available using Winter tyres over standard. Sadly figures prove
how many crashes are caused because we drivers do not look after those boring black round things
at each corner of our vehicles. When you think that most cars only touch the ground with the equivalent
of an A4 size bit of paper (IN TOTAL!) it makes you realise how important that contact patch is.

One final thing on ESP/ESC/PSM/VDC/TS etc. cars are becoming so clever these days (and safer)
Most systems can only be 'reduced' these days rather than turned off which is s agood thing for safety.
We actively allow drivers to feel these systems working and understand how they could save their lives.
Even something as basic as ABS is not something most drivers have ever been taught how to use, or
what it really allows them to do.

However Killed and Seriously Injured figures are UP 4% as off September last year.
That only leaves one conclusion…

Work is still needs to be done on the 'Nut holding the wheel'.


More power to you guys.
If I can help or add any more it will be my pleasure.

Best regards
Steve

Dr Mike Oxgreen

4,119 posts

165 months

Monday 2nd March 2015
quotequote all
Fog can be a useful indicator of the risk of ice in certain conditions.

If you see a shallow layer of fog "clinging" to the ground in surrounding fields, it is called "radiation fog" and is formed due to the ground rapidly radiating its heat away, with the result that the ground is a few degrees colder than the air. Hence, when moist air comes into contact with the colder ground, some of the moisture condenses into tiny droplets - a shallow layer of fog.

So, if you're driving along on a cold winter day and you see a shallow layer of fog in neighbouring fields, that fog is telling you that the ground is a little bit colder than the air. Take a look at your car's ambient temperature indicator and subtract about 2 or 3 degrees. That will give you a rough estimate of the ground temperature. So if it's showing 2 or 3 degrees or less, there is a risk of ice despite the air temperature being above freezing.

In fact, it's probably a good plan to assume that there's a risk of ice whenever your car's outside temperature indicator is showing less than about 4 degrees, especially early in the morning when the ground has spent all night radiating its heat up into the sky.

Edited by Dr Mike Oxgreen on Monday 2nd March 18:52

brisel

873 posts

208 months

Monday 2nd March 2015
quotequote all
There's one bit of advice missing:

In bad weather, SLOW DOWN. Stopping distances will be greater with reduced grip or the distance of clear visibility will be shorter so you will need a greater distance from other traffic or hazards. Allow longer for journey times, if nothing else to allow for the misjudgement of others.

Otherwise, I very much like what I'm reading here. Carry on!

Steve Lewis

141 posts

284 months

Thursday 5th March 2015
quotequote all
Totally agree.
That's my point with earlier comment.
However telling drivers is not good enough.
"You can't just tell a driver to drive better".

By allowing drivers to experience loss of control
(caused by their driving input and in safety)…
It's only then they realise how easy it is to do so and
how quickly it happens.

That feeling should last a lifetime and make then think twice
about distances in the
dry.. 2 second rule
wet x 2 at least
snow x 10!

proof can be found.
http://youtu.be/3gllRQHDFP8


Steve Lewis
www.r3rockingham.co.uk