Winter/Summer wheels & tyres storage

[dopamine]

Morning all,

I was hoping to get your thoughts on something:

I have been thinking about a winter tyres/wheels storage addition to my business. This is pretty standard practice on the continent, especially Germany where your tyres have to be changed twice a year minimum. When your winter set is on, the summers are sent away by the fitters and held in storage, and returned to your fitter before the summer, and vice verca with the winters.

Obviously we don't have the same winter tyres usage in the UK *yet* but I suspect the benefits of these tyres will eventually make it into the public mindset.

Given PHers are pretty much the forefront of motoring in the UK I'm interested in your thoughts as I dare say that if this is of interest to PHers, then it probably will be to everyone in time.

Thanks in advance for your input

Cheers

Travis
Pistonheads Tyres
http://pistonheads.tyregiant.com

[DonkeyApple]

I assume the plan is that a chap comes to you, changes the wheels and stores your second set for a fee?

If someone hasn't the space to store a set of wheels then are they going to have the financial appetite for a service such as this? Outside of central London where there are a few people who have cars, live in small apartments, have a need for winter tyres and a disposable income for such a luxury, I can't honestly see a viable model. If I'm honest, I can't see one in London as we don't have winter here.

It seems like the sort of model that only comes into its own if the State enforces a law to use such tyres so the masses are suddenly screwed and require such a service.

[Shaw Tarse]

It's something I might consider.
Are you thinking drive in on one set of wheels, drive out with others on the car?

I think the facility already is offered by others?

[DonkeyApple]

Why not stick to a single brand of winter trye and the most common sizes and offer a rental service based on drive in drive out fee plus tread depth?

Ie essentially rent matched sets of part worns that once below 4mm tread you just sell off?

That way you cater for the majority of road users who aren't particular as those who are probably don't require a storage service?

You can then pitch the service as a health and safety/insurance scenario to fleet managers/companies instead of the huge cost of trying to vend to the small number of private motorists who currently change tyres?

[annsxman]

On the continent most people keep their second set of whee;s/tyres at their local garage. When the decree goes out - giving a set date by which time you must have your winter tyres on - you just pop down to the garage and they swap them over. Personally I keep my winter wheel set at home and it takes about 10 minutes to swap them over.

[anonymous-user]

Trouble is, you'll need a presence all over. Much like Kwikfit:-
http://www.kwik-fit.com/tyre-hotel-terms-and-condi...

[Whitean3]

It's a great idea- as you say, fairly commonplace here on the continent.
From a business perspective, Your limiting factor would be the number of people that do switch between summer and winter wheels; it makes sense when most of the population have a spare set of wheels, and storage is sometimes an issue.
You can provide various service levels too- from simple storage/exchange, to the full works- cleaning/sealing the wheels properly, recording wear levels, offering refurb service (contract out), tyre service etc.

Typically we'd spend between 40 and 100 quid per year on storage/swopping wheels on your car.
There are a few niggly problems we face too- you can't fit a spare set of wheels in most sports cars to actally take to the wheel place (you don't realize how massive they have become until they come off the car!); most storage places do not clean them either(when it is the perfect opportunity to do so!). You also get the extra hassle when you sell/trade in your car and have to retrieve your wheels...

[RobM77]

It's a great idea, but I can't help thinking that the numbers would be against you:

• Winter tyres will grow in popularity in the UK, but give it a couple of mild winters (like this one - fingers crossed!) and interest will wane again. Most people in the UK think winter tyres are only for snow, and we really don't get that much where most people live in the UK.

• People who have the money to change wheels and tyres are quite likely to own a property big enough to store the winter tyres with ease. Note that even in my first house, a small 3 bed place with a single garage, my wheels and tyres quite happily sat in a corner of my garden shed.

• People in the know with regard to cars are more likely to have a garage. Not a strong correlation, but certainly most of my car friends when house shopping look for a place with a decent garage. These people are also going to have the confidence to change all four tyres without a problem.

• The further north you go, the more that winter tyres are needed, but there's also increase in the size of property for a given expenditure, which means just as people further North are more likely to get snow and cold weather, they're also more likely to have space to store their own tyres.

• It's a general trend to improve public transport access, and the vast majority of people will drive a car on summer tyres for 50 weeks of the year and take the train to work for the other two weeks.

• See above for working from home. Many people just work from home when it snows, and again, although winter tyres are better than summers on cold days, because they aren't essential most people won't be convinced enough to fork out on a set of winters.

• As time goes by, more cars are becoming four and front wheel drive and fewer are left as rear drive, plus tyre widths are surely going to get narrower as we chase better economy, so the proportion of people thinking about winter tyres will get lower.

I can see this working as an extension to an existing business (mobile tyre fitting perhaps), but I can't see it working as a business in its own right; geography is one main reason behind this.

Please don't quote one of the above points and criticise it for making a marginal difference; the whole point of my post is that the above marginal probabilities add up to a greater whole.

Edited by RobM77 on Monday 26th January 15:33

[dopamine]

Hello all,

Thanks very much to those that have replied so far

DonkeyApple - Interesting thought re the rental of winter tyres - I hadn't thought of that... I expect it will require a serious look from a legal team to make sure that this kind of thing wouldn't open us up to potetial legal issues in the event a well worn, albeit legal tyre was to be involved in a crash... interesting though...

Shaw Tarse - Yeah, pretty much.

annsxman - Tyre Hotels are a pretty big business in Germany. I would be interested in in knowing how many local garages over there send off the tyres to a central storage depot... I agree that home storage is likely the biggest competitor to a scheme like this, but I think some will see the benefit of not getting their hands dirty and not taking up space, especially if it is in short supply.

Jimboka - We actually have the largest fitter network in the UK currently (KwikFit have about 650 compared to over a 1000 in the Tyre Giant network) so I think we can make it fly, especially as we also have 5 massive warehouses for the tyres spread across the UK where we can centralise storage for those fitters who are unable to store long term...

Whitean3 - Agree completely with the sentiment. My thoughts are IF tyre storage does get taken up, either through public acceptance or through governmental decree, being the ones who are already running a scheme could prove a sound move... big old IF though eh?

Interesting comment about cleaning them also - agree completely that it is the perfect time for cleaning and even refurbing if needed.

RobM77 - completely agree with all of your points - obviously for us, it would be an additional upsell service for the tyre business as a whole, rather than a business in its own right, moreover it is a service that will cost little for us to implement as we have much of the infrastructure in place, bought and paid for... certainly in terms of our depots - my next discussion will be with ur network of fitters who may nix the whole thing before it begins if they don't like it - that siad I'm yet to find a fitter that doesn't like an opportunity to fit a few more tyres

Thanks again for the really considered answers - will be interesting to see how winter tyres in the UK evolve over the coming few years.

Cheers

Travis
Pistonheads Tyres
http://pistonheads.tyregiant.com

[RobM77]

dopamine said:

RobM77 - completely agree with all of your points - obviously for us, it would be an additional upsell service for the tyre business as a whole, rather than a business in its own right, moreover it is a service that will cost little for us to implement as we have much of the infrastructure in place, bought and paid for... certainly in terms of our depots - my next discussion will be with ur network of fitters who may nix the whole thing before it begins if they don't like it - that siad I'm yet to find a fitter that doesn't like an opportunity to fit a few more tyres

Thanks again for the really considered answers - will be interesting to see how winter tyres in the UK evolve over the coming few years.

Cheers

Travis
Pistonheads Tyres
http://pistonheads.tyregiant.com

I had no idea at all you already ran a tyre business. If you do, then it totally changes my answer. I would now say that if you already offer a mobile fitting service and have spare capacity to store the tyres, it would be a very minimal extra overhead to offer this service, for potentially a reasonable return (albeit not a sufficient return to pay for the storage, wages, vans, VAT etc). If it were me I'd run a trial next winter and see how you get on.

[Shaoxter]

I think RobM77 made some very valid points - I've never felt the need to change to winter tyres (even with a 500bhp RWD car) because you just don't need them in big cities. And it's the people in apartments with no garages in who are the target market here.

But if the marginal cost of implementing this is low, and you get extra upside of selling more winter tyres then I'd say it's definitely worth pursuing. Probably need to start marketing winter tyres as not just for snow but for general cold conditions too? And also emphasise the safety aspect and get the milfwagons queueing up

[DonkeyApple]

dopamine said:

Hello all,

Thanks very much to those that have replied so far

DonkeyApple - Interesting thought re the rental of winter tyres - I hadn't thought of that... I expect it will require a serious look from a legal team to make sure that this kind of thing wouldn't open us up to potetial legal issues in the event a well worn, albeit legal tyre was to be involved in a crash... interesting though...

Shaw Tarse - Yeah, pretty much.

annsxman - Tyre Hotels are a pretty big business in Germany. I would be interested in in knowing how many local garages over there send off the tyres to a central storage depot... I agree that home storage is likely the biggest competitor to a scheme like this, but I think some will see the benefit of not getting their hands dirty and not taking up space, especially if it is in short supply.

Jimboka - We actually have the largest fitter network in the UK currently (KwikFit have about 650 compared to over a 1000 in the Tyre Giant network) so I think we can make it fly, especially as we also have 5 massive warehouses for the tyres spread across the UK where we can centralise storage for those fitters who are unable to store long term...

Whitean3 - Agree completely with the sentiment. My thoughts are IF tyre storage does get taken up, either through public acceptance or through governmental decree, being the ones who are already running a scheme could prove a sound move... big old IF though eh?

Interesting comment about cleaning them also - agree completely that it is the perfect time for cleaning and even refurbing if needed.

RobM77 - completely agree with all of your points - obviously for us, it would be an additional upsell service for the tyre business as a whole, rather than a business in its own right, moreover it is a service that will cost little for us to implement as we have much of the infrastructure in place, bought and paid for... certainly in terms of our depots - my next discussion will be with ur network of fitters who may nix the whole thing before it begins if they don't like it - that siad I'm yet to find a fitter that doesn't like an opportunity to fit a few more tyres

Thanks again for the really considered answers - will be interesting to see how winter tyres in the UK evolve over the coming few years.

Cheers

Travis
Pistonheads Tyres
http://pistonheads.tyregiant.com

I do think that you'd have more commercial success I n selling a winter tyre lease scheme to responsible businesses with large fleets of similarly tyred cars or packaging a retail lease through a dealership chain etc.

[RobM77]

Shaoxter said:

I think RobM77 made some very valid points - I've never felt the need to change to winter tyres (even with a 500bhp RWD car) because you just don't need them in big cities. And it's the people in apartments with no garages in who are the target market here.

But if the marginal cost of implementing this is low, and you get extra upside of selling more winter tyres then I'd say it's definitely worth pursuing. Probably need to start marketing winter tyres as not just for snow but for general cold conditions too? And also emphasise the safety aspect and get the milfwagons queueing up

Thanks. That's another good point that I didn't think of - it's mainly people like me who live in the country amongst untreated lanes who buy winter tyres, and obviously like most people living in the countryside I'm not short on space to store them. Any house without storage space is likely to be in a town where the roads are cleared of snow (again, it's snow that pushes most UK drivers to invest in winter tyres).

It's all just these small effects that add up really, but if tacked on to an existing business it could certainly work.

[dopamine]

Hello again,

Shaoxter - Yep, this is what I'm thinking. Agree on the comment about them being perceived as 'snow' tyres, with the majority not realising that even on roads that are a few degrees lower than normal winter tyres will result in massively lower braking distances - even in the dry... I need to find a good place to pass on the message - anyone know a good motoring forum Perhaps a bit of government lobbying might not go a miss...

Donkeyapple - I agree wholeheartedly with the sentiment. The fleet business works very differently to the B2C market and indeed (especially in the case of KF) does work on a monthly fee that covers the fleets tyre requirements. The problem being that to try to get into the fleet business, one that is largely closed/sewed-up/jobs-for-the-boys is, er, *tricky*.

RobM77 - Indeed you are right about the buyers - also a big market are people like PHers who are savvy to the benefit in the day to day driving we all do. What we need now is for the message about the significant safety benefits to get out there a bit more - spoken like a guy that s sells tyres right

Cheers

Travis
Pistonheads Tyres
http://pistonheads.tyregiant.com

[DonkeyApple]

Re fleets. Find someone who sells the fleet, like Nick Whale, and sit down with them to create an upsell package that his salesmen can then use to differentiate from the competition. It's not as if it isn't a sensible/responsible product for firms to be doing with their fleet drivers to increase staff safety and efficiency etc.

Can't remember the name of the chap who founded Hexagon but he's another big fleet account vendor and perfect to strike a deal with.

I suspect that if there is enough skin in it for them and it is a beneficial addition to the sales pitch then there would be interest.

Pendragon would be another?

For pure retail I'd go straight to CarGiant or similar.

[FBP1]

My (Renault) dealer does this for the family wagon already.

I just swapped over onto my steelies/winter tyres last week ahead of driving to the Alps in Feb and my alloys/ summer tyres will be stored by him until I swap back in March /April. £75 and I don't have to get dirty / lug tyres in and out of my house.

Works for me

[anonymous-user]

Is this a (potential) official Pistonheads business then?

Edit
I missed before, I see it is:-
http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyI...

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 27th January 00:51

[Glosphil]

I bought a wheel/tyre stand for £9.99 that supports the wheels/tyres in a vertical column with spaces between and a cover over - only takes up the same space as a single tyre laid flat on the floor would. Stands in the corner of the garage, but could be in a garden shed (or green house!). I change over the wheels before and after each winter and that takes me 40 minutes or so - would be much faster if I was younger.

[ging84]

Winter tyres have almost zero chance of making it into the public mindset in the UK now.
Winter tyres and meer cats have 1 thing in common, they were both made fads in the UK by the car insurance industry. They had the chance to become popular in 2010 when we had the worst winter on record, on the back of a previous winter which was nearly as bad. But winter tyres ended up being talked about not for the benefit of them but because a bunch of greedy insurance companies wanted to load people's premiums for doing something sensible.

[Viper]

I remember this service been advertised a few years ago, first link on google throws up this company
http://www.tyremen.co.uk/tyres-explained/tyre-hote...

seems a reasonable service for just £50 per swap