Legal Advice needed re: Hire car solicitors letter
Discussion
Back in December 2012 I was rear ended and my insurance company provided a Hire Car from Enterprise while my car was being fixed. My insurers held the other party liable and I did not have to pay any excess on my policy, for the rental car, or the repairs to my car.
Fast forward to today, when I received a solicitor's letter acting on behalf of enterprise, saying that they have been unable to recover the rental costs from the third party's insurance company and since it was my signature on the rental form, the court case will be in my name, and I will be obliged to co-operate with enterprise's solicitors during the case.
The problem is that beyond the incident date, I really have very little recollection of exactly when I received the rental car, and for how long. I did not keep any of the paperwork that they gave to me at that time either, as this goes back 3 years. I thought the matter was fully settled so I changed insurers and moved on.
I have not acknowledged the solicitor's letter. Obviously I'd rather not get involved - is that an option, or do I need to acknowledge and co-operate with the solicitor's request? Also, my insurance company at that time were Morethan, and I did have legal protection. Would it be better for me to contact Morethan to let them know what's going on? I am no longer with Morethan - are they still responsible for legal aspects of a policy that was in 2012?
I'm really worried so any advice would be gratefully received.
Fast forward to today, when I received a solicitor's letter acting on behalf of enterprise, saying that they have been unable to recover the rental costs from the third party's insurance company and since it was my signature on the rental form, the court case will be in my name, and I will be obliged to co-operate with enterprise's solicitors during the case.
The problem is that beyond the incident date, I really have very little recollection of exactly when I received the rental car, and for how long. I did not keep any of the paperwork that they gave to me at that time either, as this goes back 3 years. I thought the matter was fully settled so I changed insurers and moved on.
I have not acknowledged the solicitor's letter. Obviously I'd rather not get involved - is that an option, or do I need to acknowledge and co-operate with the solicitor's request? Also, my insurance company at that time were Morethan, and I did have legal protection. Would it be better for me to contact Morethan to let them know what's going on? I am no longer with Morethan - are they still responsible for legal aspects of a policy that was in 2012?
I'm really worried so any advice would be gratefully received.
Edited by BHML on Friday 30th January 16:57
Edited by BHML on Friday 30th January 16:59
Magic919 said:
Are you sure it wasn't an accident management company that supplied the car? Sounds like classic credit hire car from here.
An email from the insurance company says "You have chosen to have your car repaired by one of our priority repairers. They will contact you within the next 24 hours to book your vehicle in for repairs within the following 7 days, or to arrange collection if your car cannot be driven".
I don't know whether the rental car was arranged directly by the insurance company, or by the priority repairer.
The solicitor's letter says "you used Enterprise Rent-A-Car's non fault accident credit services...etc)
Does this make any difference in terms of me sending the letter to the insurance company?
Sheepshanks said:
As above, pass it on to MoreThan, but if it ends up in court you may have to appear as a witness. You'll have agreed to this when taking delivery of the car.
Thanks, understood. If it does go to court I can obviously confirm what happened in the accident, and that I had a hire car from enterprise for a couple of weeks or thereabouts. But I won't be able to confirm the exact dates of car hire, etc. Will I get into trouble in the court for not remembering all the details?BHML said:
Thanks, understood. If it does go to court I can obviously confirm what happened in the accident, and that I had a hire car from enterprise for a couple of weeks or thereabouts. But I won't be able to confirm the exact dates of car hire, etc. Will I get into trouble in the court for not remembering all the details?
It's not to do with those kinds of details. You had a car on credit hire - they'll want you to say that you were unable to fund the hire yourself, didn't have any other vehicle you could use etc.These things don't normally get to court.
I used to work for enterprise so may be able to help...
It sounds like you agreed to take a car on a "non fault" basis. From memory, the way it works is you sign a contract when you hire the car saying the accident wasn't your fault and as such the other insurance company will pick up the tab for the rental car. This is pretty standard practice.
Now, enterprise would put you in to a "like for like" car rather than a Ford KA. If the other parties insurance company accept fault they are happy to pay for a like for like.
Usually, you give the rental car back when asked and you get your motor back repaired, never to hear from ERAC again.
The only times that Enterprise chase for money that I am aware of is when one of two things happen. Either, you don't bring the car back when your contract says you should (ask to see a copy fo the contract you signed) and the at fault insurer doesn't cough up for the extra days.
You need to find out the date when your car was returned and when you gave the car back to ERAC.
Or...
The accident didn't end up going through as non fault. So the other persons insurer won't cover the cost of the car which you took on a "non fault" basis.
N.B The source of the rental car (repairer or insurance company) is actually quite important. If it was the insurance company you can quite easily speak with them to find out all the info.
If the repairer gave Enterprise the nod that a bloke in a nice car has had an accident and they can sign him up to a "non fault like for like hire" then they get a kick back but the insurance company wouldn't be involved with the Upgrade. It's better for ERAC to get the non fault deal from the repairers as they can charge FAR higher per day rates for the car than if the insurance company books it.
It sounds like you agreed to take a car on a "non fault" basis. From memory, the way it works is you sign a contract when you hire the car saying the accident wasn't your fault and as such the other insurance company will pick up the tab for the rental car. This is pretty standard practice.
Now, enterprise would put you in to a "like for like" car rather than a Ford KA. If the other parties insurance company accept fault they are happy to pay for a like for like.
Usually, you give the rental car back when asked and you get your motor back repaired, never to hear from ERAC again.
The only times that Enterprise chase for money that I am aware of is when one of two things happen. Either, you don't bring the car back when your contract says you should (ask to see a copy fo the contract you signed) and the at fault insurer doesn't cough up for the extra days.
You need to find out the date when your car was returned and when you gave the car back to ERAC.
Or...
The accident didn't end up going through as non fault. So the other persons insurer won't cover the cost of the car which you took on a "non fault" basis.
N.B The source of the rental car (repairer or insurance company) is actually quite important. If it was the insurance company you can quite easily speak with them to find out all the info.
If the repairer gave Enterprise the nod that a bloke in a nice car has had an accident and they can sign him up to a "non fault like for like hire" then they get a kick back but the insurance company wouldn't be involved with the Upgrade. It's better for ERAC to get the non fault deal from the repairers as they can charge FAR higher per day rates for the car than if the insurance company books it.
Edited by FrankAbagnale on Friday 30th January 17:58
Magic919 said:
Sounds like you've done the standard credit hire. Means you are liable for the bill if they fail to recover their money from the TP Insurer.
Can't my insurance company at the time help with this? or does liability fall solely on me? It seems unfair that the third party's insurers can just refuse to pay and my insurance co. does nothing to recover the cost. Magic919 said:
Your Insurer will be interested in recovering their costs. I wonder how they got on. Maybe they got their money back and it's just the hire car charges being disputed. You can ask them. I presume you haven't paid a policy excess.
No I wasn't asked to pay any of my excess.Op, you need to read what's been written already as quite a few have explained this for you.
The hire car you had was not "free". It was hired by you on a credit basis ie the cost of the hire was deferred, so is considered a loan (hence the "credit" bit). As part of the overall agreement for this hire, you will have signed to say you will help the hire car company to get the other insurer to pay, so that you don't have to.
What's happeend is that the other insurer has taken issue with some part of the hire, which could be length, cost, type of car or a few other reasons. The court case is NOT to do with the accident circumstances or liability, as this issue would be argued out but he two insurance companies and not by the hire car company.
You have to help Enterprise. If you don't then you're in breach of the contract you signed with them amd could end up paying the hire costs out of your own pocket.
If you want more help, then ask, but please ask in a way that's a question rather than the "it's not fair style" that you've resorted to. You enjoyed the higher value hire car, now you have to do your bit to help them get paid.
It'd be interesting to know what car you had on hire, what car and age your own car was amd how long it took to repair it or write it off.
The hire car you had was not "free". It was hired by you on a credit basis ie the cost of the hire was deferred, so is considered a loan (hence the "credit" bit). As part of the overall agreement for this hire, you will have signed to say you will help the hire car company to get the other insurer to pay, so that you don't have to.
What's happeend is that the other insurer has taken issue with some part of the hire, which could be length, cost, type of car or a few other reasons. The court case is NOT to do with the accident circumstances or liability, as this issue would be argued out but he two insurance companies and not by the hire car company.
You have to help Enterprise. If you don't then you're in breach of the contract you signed with them amd could end up paying the hire costs out of your own pocket.
If you want more help, then ask, but please ask in a way that's a question rather than the "it's not fair style" that you've resorted to. You enjoyed the higher value hire car, now you have to do your bit to help them get paid.
It'd be interesting to know what car you had on hire, what car and age your own car was amd how long it took to repair it or write it off.
FrankAbagnale said:
The only times that Enterprise chase for money that I am aware of is when one of two things happen. Either, you don't bring the car back when your contract says you should (ask to see a copy fo the contract you signed) and the at fault insurer doesn't cough up for the extra days.
The usual problem is the 3rd party insurer disputes the hire cost, especially if it seems out of proportion to the damage. There used to be a big problem the credit hire companies charging extortionate daily rates, but there are agreed rates now.Sheepshanks said:
The usual problem is the 3rd party insurer disputes the hire cost, especially if it seems out of proportion to the damage. There used to be a big problem the credit hire companies charging extortionate daily rates, but there are agreed rates now.
Rates are only "agreed" for ABI GTA Members, non GTa subscribers can charge what they feel like, although whether it gets laid is a whole different discussion. There are many reasons for. Credit Hire Payment Pack to be disputed, rates are only one of them.
LoonR1 said:
Op, you need to read what's been written already as quite a few have explained this for you.
The hire car you had was not "free". It was hired by you on a credit basis ie the cost of the hire was deferred, so is considered a loan (hence the "credit" bit). As part of the overall agreement for this hire, you will have signed to say you will help the hire car company to get the other insurer to pay, so that you don't have to.
What's happeend is that the other insurer has taken issue with some part of the hire, which could be length, cost, type of car or a few other reasons. The court case is NOT to do with the accident circumstances or liability, as this issue would be argued out but he two insurance companies and not by the hire car company.
You have to help Enterprise. If you don't then you're in breach of the contract you signed with them amd could end up paying the hire costs out of your own pocket.
If you want more help, then ask, but please ask in a way that's a question rather than the "it's not fair style" that you've resorted to. You enjoyed the higher value hire car, now you have to do your bit to help them get paid.
It'd be interesting to know what car you had on hire, what car and age your own car was amd how long it took to repair it or write it off.
Thanks for that. My car was a 2 year old skoda octavia vrs and I was given a Peugeot 3008 hatchback. My car had bumper repaired but when it came back to me the filler had collapsed and it went back to the body shop for another 7-10 days iirc. I had returned the peugeut within the first week and was given a vauxhall corsa for the remainder of the time. The hire car you had was not "free". It was hired by you on a credit basis ie the cost of the hire was deferred, so is considered a loan (hence the "credit" bit). As part of the overall agreement for this hire, you will have signed to say you will help the hire car company to get the other insurer to pay, so that you don't have to.
What's happeend is that the other insurer has taken issue with some part of the hire, which could be length, cost, type of car or a few other reasons. The court case is NOT to do with the accident circumstances or liability, as this issue would be argued out but he two insurance companies and not by the hire car company.
You have to help Enterprise. If you don't then you're in breach of the contract you signed with them amd could end up paying the hire costs out of your own pocket.
If you want more help, then ask, but please ask in a way that's a question rather than the "it's not fair style" that you've resorted to. You enjoyed the higher value hire car, now you have to do your bit to help them get paid.
It'd be interesting to know what car you had on hire, what car and age your own car was amd how long it took to repair it or write it off.
LoonR1, I'm guessing that you would still recommend me to contact my insurance co as well as reply to Enterprise queries?
The types of vehicle you hired seem to be ok given that you were in an Octavia VRS. Maybe the TP Insurer is disputing the duration of hire. Maybe they've agreed to pay the hire bill but are dragging the heels and have not sent the cheque and this is the only issue.
To be fair, Enterprise aren't normally recognised as "troublesome" hire providers as their rates are usually pretty fair.
I doubt your insurers will help as you would have gone directly to the hire company or through an accident management company. You'll need to contact them to give you more information as to why they're considering issuing court proceedings in your name. As Loon has said, you need to provide them with all the assistance you can. They may ask for financial statements to show why you couldn't have used your own funds to hire a vehicle yourself rather than go for credit hire which is charged out at a higher rate. Let this be a lesson to this in future who opt for credit hire vehicles. It's nice to have a like for like vehicle but if there is any quibbling down the line with the hire bill, you will be asked to do all you can to help the hire company recover their outlay.
To be fair, Enterprise aren't normally recognised as "troublesome" hire providers as their rates are usually pretty fair.
I doubt your insurers will help as you would have gone directly to the hire company or through an accident management company. You'll need to contact them to give you more information as to why they're considering issuing court proceedings in your name. As Loon has said, you need to provide them with all the assistance you can. They may ask for financial statements to show why you couldn't have used your own funds to hire a vehicle yourself rather than go for credit hire which is charged out at a higher rate. Let this be a lesson to this in future who opt for credit hire vehicles. It's nice to have a like for like vehicle but if there is any quibbling down the line with the hire bill, you will be asked to do all you can to help the hire company recover their outlay.
BHML said:
Thanks for that. My car was a 2 year old skoda octavia vrs and I was given a Peugeot 3008 hatchback. My car had bumper repaired but when it came back to me the filler had collapsed and it went back to the body shop for another 7-10 days iirc. I had returned the peugeut within the first week and was given a vauxhall corsa for the remainder of the time.
LoonR1, I'm guessing that you would still recommend me to contact my insurance co as well as reply to Enterprise queries?
There's no point contacting More Than, it's not their problem ,or anything to do with them. I can tell you now what the problem is. Enterprise will have billed for both the initial repair period and the subsequent 7-10 days. The other insurer is not responsible for the extra hire as that was poor workmanship, not as a result of their driver's negligence. LoonR1, I'm guessing that you would still recommend me to contact my insurance co as well as reply to Enterprise queries?
Either the repairer pays Enterprise for those7-10 days, or Enterprise write it off.
Find out what the solicitor wants you to do, but 10-1 on that's the issue.
LoonR1 said:
There's no point contacting More Than, it's not their problem ,or anything to do with them.
The OP says his own insurer provided the car. OK, that may not be how it worked but many customers won't understand what goes on behind the scenes with insurers farming out no-fault claims to AMCs. I'd be dismayed if I made a claim on my own insurance company and was then abandoned with a load of hassle.
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