E36. Nankang NS-2R or Kumho KU36
Discussion
Guys looking for some advice from people who have experience with either of these tyres.
I need some track rubber for my E36 328. The car is solely for track use so no road manners need to be taken into consideration.
Wheels are BBS RC041 7.5 front and RC042 8.5 rear.
I've been browsing tyres and have come across the Nankang NS-2R soft or the Kumho KU36.
Both are £74 (235/45/17) which seems like fantastic value.
So the question is which tyre and why and what sizes would you run and why?
I'm tempted to go 235 front / 255 rear but I'm a bit worried that the rears may catch the arch. The other option is to go 235 all round with the hope that this would give a little more of an oversteery set up
So guy over to you, how should I spend my hard earned...
I need some track rubber for my E36 328. The car is solely for track use so no road manners need to be taken into consideration.
Wheels are BBS RC041 7.5 front and RC042 8.5 rear.
I've been browsing tyres and have come across the Nankang NS-2R soft or the Kumho KU36.
Both are £74 (235/45/17) which seems like fantastic value.
So the question is which tyre and why and what sizes would you run and why?
I'm tempted to go 235 front / 255 rear but I'm a bit worried that the rears may catch the arch. The other option is to go 235 all round with the hope that this would give a little more of an oversteery set up
So guy over to you, how should I spend my hard earned...
I cant provide advice directly as I haven't yet tried either, however they are the two tyres I have shortlisted to try on our E36 328 track car when we get to address the tyres.
I've heard positive reports for both tyres, although the KU36 reports came from the US. There is a guy here also an E36 328 owner who if I recall is looking to put the NS2R's on his car in the near future.
That's all I can add on the 'which' subject. Either way, looking forward to your feedback once you have made a decision and had a go on track with either tyre.
With regards to sizes, I'm still trying to work this out myself. Our car also runs RC041+042's but came with 225/45/R17 all around. The RC042 rears in that size do look stretched, the fronts I feel are the maximum width I would be happy running. Going above 225 on the 7.5J rims I think might make the side wall move too much and thus take away some steering response and feel. It's hard to say if going bigger will be better because the overall setup plays a part in how the car feels. I felt our car pushed when we got it with those tyres, but following the addition of 2.5 deg. negative camber up front as well as raising the front suspension up from the setup it came with, has made it feel decidedly better without a change in tyre compound or size.
It may be that running much wider rears will induce more understeer, but I go back to my previous point, its subject to overall setup, so hard to tell. You are probably best positioned to determine if you can live with a 245/255 rear.
Personally, I would like to try a square setup so to this end I have sourced 17" x 8J wheels front and rear, unfortunately those came with 205 width tyres all around, so beyond going with a heavier wheel than the RC's, we will be loosing tyre contact when we try the other wheels compared with the 225's, thus making a direct comparison will be difficult in our case. Once the 205's are done however I'll be looking at either of the above in 225 or 235 width and see how she fares.
Humour
I've heard positive reports for both tyres, although the KU36 reports came from the US. There is a guy here also an E36 328 owner who if I recall is looking to put the NS2R's on his car in the near future.
That's all I can add on the 'which' subject. Either way, looking forward to your feedback once you have made a decision and had a go on track with either tyre.
With regards to sizes, I'm still trying to work this out myself. Our car also runs RC041+042's but came with 225/45/R17 all around. The RC042 rears in that size do look stretched, the fronts I feel are the maximum width I would be happy running. Going above 225 on the 7.5J rims I think might make the side wall move too much and thus take away some steering response and feel. It's hard to say if going bigger will be better because the overall setup plays a part in how the car feels. I felt our car pushed when we got it with those tyres, but following the addition of 2.5 deg. negative camber up front as well as raising the front suspension up from the setup it came with, has made it feel decidedly better without a change in tyre compound or size.
It may be that running much wider rears will induce more understeer, but I go back to my previous point, its subject to overall setup, so hard to tell. You are probably best positioned to determine if you can live with a 245/255 rear.
Personally, I would like to try a square setup so to this end I have sourced 17" x 8J wheels front and rear, unfortunately those came with 205 width tyres all around, so beyond going with a heavier wheel than the RC's, we will be loosing tyre contact when we try the other wheels compared with the 225's, thus making a direct comparison will be difficult in our case. Once the 205's are done however I'll be looking at either of the above in 225 or 235 width and see how she fares.
Humour
Edited by Humour on Saturday 25th April 17:58
Thanks for the reply Humour,
I'm currently running 235 all round and they seem fine on the 7.5 front although like you say there's more to consider than just the tyre size with regard the overall setup.
At the moment I'm swaying towards the Nankangs as you can specify the softer 120 compound and there seems to be more feedback on the forums from people running them.
Still not a done deal yet, you never know someone might come along who's ran both (long shot I know).
The cars been laid up for the last 2 years so looking forward to getting it out this year once I've sorted a couple of little jobs.
I'm currently running 235 all round and they seem fine on the 7.5 front although like you say there's more to consider than just the tyre size with regard the overall setup.
At the moment I'm swaying towards the Nankangs as you can specify the softer 120 compound and there seems to be more feedback on the forums from people running them.
Still not a done deal yet, you never know someone might come along who's ran both (long shot I know).
The cars been laid up for the last 2 years so looking forward to getting it out this year once I've sorted a couple of little jobs.
Nice to see another E36 328i on here!
I've just taken delivery of some NS-2Rs for my E36, but they are firstly 205/55R16 (I have a small mountain of 16" wheels and Nankang don't make the OEM 225/50R16 size for my car), and secondly the harder compound, which seemed better for extended track day sessions and my rather limited budget. I'll be testing them in around a month's time, so I'll post my thoughts back here afterwards.
With regard to tyre sizes, a well-sorted E36 always seems to perform best on a square setup. Mine certainly does, it's nice and neutral. I might venture that 255 is too wide both in terms of contact and packaging inside the arches, and say that 225 to 245 is the ideal width range.
Humour said:
There is a guy here also an E36 328 owner who if I recall is looking to put the NS2R's on his car in the near future.
I've just taken delivery of some NS-2Rs for my E36, but they are firstly 205/55R16 (I have a small mountain of 16" wheels and Nankang don't make the OEM 225/50R16 size for my car), and secondly the harder compound, which seemed better for extended track day sessions and my rather limited budget. I'll be testing them in around a month's time, so I'll post my thoughts back here afterwards.
With regard to tyre sizes, a well-sorted E36 always seems to perform best on a square setup. Mine certainly does, it's nice and neutral. I might venture that 255 is too wide both in terms of contact and packaging inside the arches, and say that 225 to 245 is the ideal width range.
I think your on the money there regarding sizes.
After doing a bit of digging it would appear that 235 is a tad wide for my front 7.5 rims, they've been o.k on road tyre's but with a trackday tyre I think I might be doing more harm than good.
So I'm either looking for a pair of 8.5 RC042 for the front then 235 all round or stick with the current wheels and go 225 front 235 rear.
Hoping to get to Blyton at the back end of May if all goes to plan
After doing a bit of digging it would appear that 235 is a tad wide for my front 7.5 rims, they've been o.k on road tyre's but with a trackday tyre I think I might be doing more harm than good.
So I'm either looking for a pair of 8.5 RC042 for the front then 235 all round or stick with the current wheels and go 225 front 235 rear.
Hoping to get to Blyton at the back end of May if all goes to plan
I've been on the KU36 for the last year and have found them ok.
They make and hold around 1.1 g but suffer the same problems as federal RS-r's in that they crack across the carcass of the tyre and need lots of balancing. Also as they get hotter they lose their shape so shake the car violently at high speed. This is only really noticeable at 120+mph so maybe not a problem for you.
Vid is on Harry's laptimer but I've used a proper data logger since when the tyres were much older and they still made the same g. Good stuff as a lot of track tyres grip well when new then drop off after a few heat cycles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n0Nr8eD3cc
Wet is ok and better than some track tyres.
Lap time wise I'd go quicker on new federals but having had the same problems wth 2 sets won't use them again.
Haven't tried the Nankangs but suspect they'd have the same problems but have heard good things.
Have you heard of achiles 123s? check the driftworks site - around £80 I think and again have a good rep.
Interested to hear more experiences of the Nankangs..
They make and hold around 1.1 g but suffer the same problems as federal RS-r's in that they crack across the carcass of the tyre and need lots of balancing. Also as they get hotter they lose their shape so shake the car violently at high speed. This is only really noticeable at 120+mph so maybe not a problem for you.
Vid is on Harry's laptimer but I've used a proper data logger since when the tyres were much older and they still made the same g. Good stuff as a lot of track tyres grip well when new then drop off after a few heat cycles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n0Nr8eD3cc
Wet is ok and better than some track tyres.
Lap time wise I'd go quicker on new federals but having had the same problems wth 2 sets won't use them again.
Haven't tried the Nankangs but suspect they'd have the same problems but have heard good things.
Have you heard of achiles 123s? check the driftworks site - around £80 I think and again have a good rep.
Interested to hear more experiences of the Nankangs..
I have an e36 Compact with the BBS split rims 7.5 front 8.5 rear.
I'm running Toyo R888 205/40/17 on the front and 245/40/17 on the rear.
Before I bought them the 205/45/17 ditch finders fitted rubbed on the front arches with just normal road driving.
The rears are getting to the point of needing replacing so I would be interested to know what you choose
I'm running Toyo R888 205/40/17 on the front and 245/40/17 on the rear.
Before I bought them the 205/45/17 ditch finders fitted rubbed on the front arches with just normal road driving.
The rears are getting to the point of needing replacing so I would be interested to know what you choose
git-r said:
I've been on the KU36 for the last year and have found them ok.
They make and hold around 1.1 g but suffer the same problems as federal RS-r's in that they crack across the carcass of the tyre and need lots of balancing. Also as they get hotter they lose their shape so shake the car violently at high speed. This is only really noticeable at 120+mph so maybe not a problem for you.
Slightly off topic but do you have any more information on the RS-R's vibrating the car? I've done a search and not been able to find anything because I've had exactly the same issue on my car ever since I've fitted them! It happens at lower speeds than that though, 80+mph on track I get really quite heavy vibrations from the front left tyre.They make and hold around 1.1 g but suffer the same problems as federal RS-r's in that they crack across the carcass of the tyre and need lots of balancing. Also as they get hotter they lose their shape so shake the car violently at high speed. This is only really noticeable at 120+mph so maybe not a problem for you.
Just to gives other option, I'm running the following on my Evo:
Front: (7.5j x17) 235/45/17 Federal FZ-201
Rear: (8.5j x17) 235/45/17 Federal FZ-201
It was tight as hell trying to get the 235 on to the 7.5j but it went ion ok after heating in the oven.
It can't be far off a square setup and performs great on the track.
I'm thinking of trying the 225 on the front next time.
Front: (7.5j x17) 235/45/17 Federal FZ-201
Rear: (8.5j x17) 235/45/17 Federal FZ-201
It was tight as hell trying to get the 235 on to the 7.5j but it went ion ok after heating in the oven.
It can't be far off a square setup and performs great on the track.
I'm thinking of trying the 225 on the front next time.
I've just spotted this thread again, time to update my above post now that I've tried my NS-2Rs!
I have 205/55R16s in the medium (180) compound. I personally probably couldn't put up with them as a road tyre - they're not as stiff as I expected, but perhaps as this car already feels so stiff compared to my E46 daily I just didn't notice a little bit extra. Where they fall down is road noise, they howl something awful at high speed and generally throw out a lot of resonances you would never normally get. Made me glad I still have the interior in! But this isn't what they're for, nor what you want to hear about, so here's some track action comparing my trusty 225/50R16 Kumho KU31s first to the Nankangs afterwards.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mlwNMihxow&fe...
Despite my lap being nowhere near as tidy, I shaved off over half a second with the NS-2Rs. In untimed practice in the morning the car felt far better, with sharper turn-in and considerably more overall grip. These tyres do need a little heat, and I had some understeer and a bit of a slippy feeling until they warmed up. What was most telling was bolting the Kumhos on having been running the NS-2Rs all morning - I immediately found myself sliding around on exit and slightly outbraking myself. The Kumhos been a very good tyre, but the NS-2Rs showed them up good and proper, and they only seem to get better the more you drive them. Absolute potential is certainly over a second a lap, which is a really good result! I'm sure more work on longer runs on track days, and figuring out the ideal pressures for them, will make them perform even better but I'm happy with them so far
I have 205/55R16s in the medium (180) compound. I personally probably couldn't put up with them as a road tyre - they're not as stiff as I expected, but perhaps as this car already feels so stiff compared to my E46 daily I just didn't notice a little bit extra. Where they fall down is road noise, they howl something awful at high speed and generally throw out a lot of resonances you would never normally get. Made me glad I still have the interior in! But this isn't what they're for, nor what you want to hear about, so here's some track action comparing my trusty 225/50R16 Kumho KU31s first to the Nankangs afterwards.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mlwNMihxow&fe...
Despite my lap being nowhere near as tidy, I shaved off over half a second with the NS-2Rs. In untimed practice in the morning the car felt far better, with sharper turn-in and considerably more overall grip. These tyres do need a little heat, and I had some understeer and a bit of a slippy feeling until they warmed up. What was most telling was bolting the Kumhos on having been running the NS-2Rs all morning - I immediately found myself sliding around on exit and slightly outbraking myself. The Kumhos been a very good tyre, but the NS-2Rs showed them up good and proper, and they only seem to get better the more you drive them. Absolute potential is certainly over a second a lap, which is a really good result! I'm sure more work on longer runs on track days, and figuring out the ideal pressures for them, will make them perform even better but I'm happy with them so far
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