Discussion
Audi S8 V10 – End of term report
Hello all. I have just put my S8 up for sale after 3 great years. I’ve posted twice about my experience with the car previously, but I wanted to end with a summary of the overall experience and some guidance on running costs before the car moves on.
What I’ve loved about it
1) The V10. It’s unique and exotic. It’s also Jekyll and Hyde - one minute you can be wondering at the silence and serenity, the next howling past a 7,000 rpm red line. Performance isn’t as ballistic as a ’63 AMG, but it’s an extremely quick car which feels quite long geared and really gets a move on after about 4,500 rpm.
2) It’s rare and appreciated. In the three years I’ve owned the car I’ve probably seen 4 or 5 others. If I see an S55/63 AMG in London (of which there are plenty) there is a good chance it will not be being driven by its owner, whereas I can almost guarantee an s8 v10 will be. When stuck in slow moving traffic I’ve sometimes noticed people staring down at the little “v10” badges on the front wings, and occasionally I’ve had appreciative thumbs up. Whenever the car has been in for service/warranty work, at least one of the technicians / sales staff has commented on it being one of their favourite Audis.
3) Looks. It’s handsome, sporting, sophisticated and slightly menacing all at the same time. With its 20 inch wheels, phantom black paint and quad exhausts it looks like a proper grown-ups car. The metallic grey works really well too.
4) Comfort. The S8 is a very cosseting car. It makes me feel good about getting up at 4am on a cold, drizzly Winter’s morning to catch an early Eurotunnel. Within a mile of home the big engine is filling the cabin with warm air, the heated seats are doing their thing and the double-glazed windows have sealed you off from the outside world.
5) Build quality. This is rather clichéd, but it has the same feeling of quality and longevity that my old w124 had, but with a huge extra dollop of luxury and modernity on top.
6) Practicality. Along with a diesel A2, which I use for short trips, this has been our main afamily car. The kids love it because of the rear-seat DVDs. We were especially thankful for those when we got stuck in a 5 hour jam coming back from the Alps in February. The boot is simply massive and we have never wanted for more space. With 4-wheel drive and a lift function on the suspension, there aren’t many places you can’t go either. With Dunlop winter tyres on it was superb in the Alps.
7) The kit. In standard form the S8 can justifiably be described as being “fully loaded”. Extras like the B&O sound system, Digital TV, DAB radio etc make it a lovely thing to do long journeys in.
What’s gone wrong
1. Electronic parking brakes. I’’ve had two sets of parking brake motors fail stranding me outside the house with the brakes frozen on. The car has had to be taken off on a flat-bed on both occasions. They are also expensive. Forum chat suggests a fundamental design problem.
2. Electric boot motor. The boot motor eventually ran out of puff and wouldn’t open the boot, although it would close it with no problem.
3. CD changer. One of the two CD changers had to be replaced when it stopped recognising discs.
4. Tyre pressure management warning system. When a yellow TPMS light started flashing in the dash, Audi told me the batteries in the sensors probably needed to be replaced, and that batteries count as a maintenance item and so this wouldn’t be covered by warranty. Four of them would have cost over £400, so I decided to manage without.
Apart from the TPMS everything was covered under warranty. After 3 years the warranty premium pretty much matched the costs. If anything the warranty company have ended up slightly ahead this time.
Running costs
As expected it has been an expensive car to run, but no more so than a previous M5. Based on 8,000 miles a year, main dealer servicing and an Audi warranty, it has cost about £6,000 - £6,500 per year. This is a summary of the main costs from my 3 years of ownership:
Road tax - £505 / year
Insurance - £700 / year
Tyres – one set of Michelins - £1,080 including fitting
Servicing – one major service on the long life interval - £650 (main dealer)
Warranty - £1,500 / year plus one £250 excess claim
Fuel – averages about 19-20 mpg. Highest I’ve seen with cruise control set on a French motorway is 26 mpg. Lowest is well into single figures navigating rush hour through central London.
The biggest cost – depreciation – will hopefully not be too significant.
Conclusion
I hope people find the above useful. For anyone thinking of buying an S8, I can not recommend them highly enough. If you find a good one to start with and go in with reasonable expectations of running costs, the rewards are huge, and I’ll be very sorry to see mine go.
Hello all. I have just put my S8 up for sale after 3 great years. I’ve posted twice about my experience with the car previously, but I wanted to end with a summary of the overall experience and some guidance on running costs before the car moves on.
What I’ve loved about it
1) The V10. It’s unique and exotic. It’s also Jekyll and Hyde - one minute you can be wondering at the silence and serenity, the next howling past a 7,000 rpm red line. Performance isn’t as ballistic as a ’63 AMG, but it’s an extremely quick car which feels quite long geared and really gets a move on after about 4,500 rpm.
2) It’s rare and appreciated. In the three years I’ve owned the car I’ve probably seen 4 or 5 others. If I see an S55/63 AMG in London (of which there are plenty) there is a good chance it will not be being driven by its owner, whereas I can almost guarantee an s8 v10 will be. When stuck in slow moving traffic I’ve sometimes noticed people staring down at the little “v10” badges on the front wings, and occasionally I’ve had appreciative thumbs up. Whenever the car has been in for service/warranty work, at least one of the technicians / sales staff has commented on it being one of their favourite Audis.
3) Looks. It’s handsome, sporting, sophisticated and slightly menacing all at the same time. With its 20 inch wheels, phantom black paint and quad exhausts it looks like a proper grown-ups car. The metallic grey works really well too.
4) Comfort. The S8 is a very cosseting car. It makes me feel good about getting up at 4am on a cold, drizzly Winter’s morning to catch an early Eurotunnel. Within a mile of home the big engine is filling the cabin with warm air, the heated seats are doing their thing and the double-glazed windows have sealed you off from the outside world.
5) Build quality. This is rather clichéd, but it has the same feeling of quality and longevity that my old w124 had, but with a huge extra dollop of luxury and modernity on top.
6) Practicality. Along with a diesel A2, which I use for short trips, this has been our main afamily car. The kids love it because of the rear-seat DVDs. We were especially thankful for those when we got stuck in a 5 hour jam coming back from the Alps in February. The boot is simply massive and we have never wanted for more space. With 4-wheel drive and a lift function on the suspension, there aren’t many places you can’t go either. With Dunlop winter tyres on it was superb in the Alps.
7) The kit. In standard form the S8 can justifiably be described as being “fully loaded”. Extras like the B&O sound system, Digital TV, DAB radio etc make it a lovely thing to do long journeys in.
What’s gone wrong
1. Electronic parking brakes. I’’ve had two sets of parking brake motors fail stranding me outside the house with the brakes frozen on. The car has had to be taken off on a flat-bed on both occasions. They are also expensive. Forum chat suggests a fundamental design problem.
2. Electric boot motor. The boot motor eventually ran out of puff and wouldn’t open the boot, although it would close it with no problem.
3. CD changer. One of the two CD changers had to be replaced when it stopped recognising discs.
4. Tyre pressure management warning system. When a yellow TPMS light started flashing in the dash, Audi told me the batteries in the sensors probably needed to be replaced, and that batteries count as a maintenance item and so this wouldn’t be covered by warranty. Four of them would have cost over £400, so I decided to manage without.
Apart from the TPMS everything was covered under warranty. After 3 years the warranty premium pretty much matched the costs. If anything the warranty company have ended up slightly ahead this time.
Running costs
As expected it has been an expensive car to run, but no more so than a previous M5. Based on 8,000 miles a year, main dealer servicing and an Audi warranty, it has cost about £6,000 - £6,500 per year. This is a summary of the main costs from my 3 years of ownership:
Road tax - £505 / year
Insurance - £700 / year
Tyres – one set of Michelins - £1,080 including fitting
Servicing – one major service on the long life interval - £650 (main dealer)
Warranty - £1,500 / year plus one £250 excess claim
Fuel – averages about 19-20 mpg. Highest I’ve seen with cruise control set on a French motorway is 26 mpg. Lowest is well into single figures navigating rush hour through central London.
The biggest cost – depreciation – will hopefully not be too significant.
Conclusion
I hope people find the above useful. For anyone thinking of buying an S8, I can not recommend them highly enough. If you find a good one to start with and go in with reasonable expectations of running costs, the rewards are huge, and I’ll be very sorry to see mine go.
I love the idea of an Audi S8 V10 and I thought your write up was very interesting.
I have read many of the reports and they seem to hint towards the fact that the engine lacks some low down grunt which, of course, is all relevant. The same has been said about the Mercedes 6.2 V8 which is generally regarded as a superb piece of engineering but that is normally compared with the previous 5.5l unit which had the benefit of a supercharger so not really a fair comparison.
Did you feel that the low end shove was limited or was this naturally overcome by getting the engine spinning above 3500 rpm?
I have read many of the reports and they seem to hint towards the fact that the engine lacks some low down grunt which, of course, is all relevant. The same has been said about the Mercedes 6.2 V8 which is generally regarded as a superb piece of engineering but that is normally compared with the previous 5.5l unit which had the benefit of a supercharger so not really a fair comparison.
Did you feel that the low end shove was limited or was this naturally overcome by getting the engine spinning above 3500 rpm?
I've been fortunate enough to drive one of these on numerous occasions. A friend in my village had one and has sold it to another friend of mine, so I still get to see it.
I don't feel it has a lack of low down grunt at all, but I suppose the feeling of that is accentuated by the the following howl and wallop it gives out above 4k.
Can't agree more with the OP's summary of the car, rare and very special! When are we ever going to see a V10 normally aspirated large luxury saloon again? Never I reckon.
I don't feel it has a lack of low down grunt at all, but I suppose the feeling of that is accentuated by the the following howl and wallop it gives out above 4k.
Can't agree more with the OP's summary of the car, rare and very special! When are we ever going to see a V10 normally aspirated large luxury saloon again? Never I reckon.
The question of low down torque is an interesting one. In absolute terms it clearly has a lot of torque, but at the same time the engine is one which naturally thrives on high revs, certainly compared to a big capacity diesel. Combined with the car's weight it means there are occasions when it seems to lack low down grunt (all relative of course). In my experience this shows up occasionally when the gear box has shuffled up into 6th (as it naturally tries to when you are just tootling). You slow for a dual carriage-way or A-road roundabout and then coming out, you ask for a bit more and the gearbox is still in 6th or 5th, day-dreaming slightly. Suddenly it wakes up and realises you probably wanted 3rd and all of a sudden the scenery is a blur. I should point out that this is relatively rare and probably the only negative against an otherwise an excellent gearbox. Certainly in "S" mode the engine is very much kept on the boil and the changes seem much more intelligent. The car is rarely surprised and manual also works very well.
For me, having power at the top end gives the car its two distinct characters which is what I like so much. You just don't get that with a big diesel - competent as they are. If you are in the mood then you need to drive the car much more and that's what makes it involving. People who typically buy a large luxury saloon don't necessarily want "involving" though, so it probably appeals to quite a narrow audience.
For me, having power at the top end gives the car its two distinct characters which is what I like so much. You just don't get that with a big diesel - competent as they are. If you are in the mood then you need to drive the car much more and that's what makes it involving. People who typically buy a large luxury saloon don't necessarily want "involving" though, so it probably appeals to quite a narrow audience.
adam917k said:
I don't think there will be a replacement for now. I am moving to Singapore where a basic Fiesta costs about £60k by the time all the various taxes have been added. I will have to console myself with surfing the classifieds, reading old copies of EVO and dreaming....
Had to google this and found the followinghttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/expat/10366160/Where-on...
Unbelievable!
My neighbour had a S8, the pas pump went just after he got it,that was an engine out job,whilst they did that someone cracked the windscreen and AUDI couldn't get one anywhere. In the end he px it for a A7,the car had spent more time at the dealer than in his care and he had worked his way through most of the courtesy cars.
Edited by gtidriver on Wednesday 6th May 10:46
junglie said:
I have read many of the reports and they seem to hint towards the fact that the engine lacks some low down grunt
First I've heard that comment. Mine had plenty. junglie said:
The same has been said about the Mercedes 6.2 V8
The 6.2 V8 in my current car has a lot of torque from very low revs. I can take it from 20 - 160 in top gear quite easily. Put it in 'comfort' and you can waft along on torque...similar to a turbocharged car. Compared with it's predecessor it has a tiny amount less lbs/ft torque but having driven both and owned one I can say you'd struggle to notice. Drive one next to an F10 M5 and you'll find out what a paucity of low down torque really feels like.adam917k said:
The question of low down torque is an interesting one. In absolute terms it clearly has a lot of torque, but at the same time the engine is one which naturally thrives on high revs, certainly compared to a big capacity diesel. Combined with the car's weight it means there are occasions when it seems to lack low down grunt (all relative of course). In my experience this shows up occasionally when the gear box has shuffled up into 6th (as it naturally tries to when you are just tootling). You slow for a dual carriage-way or A-road roundabout and then coming out, you ask for a bit more and the gearbox is still in 6th or 5th, day-dreaming slightly. Suddenly it wakes up and realises you probably wanted 3rd and all of a sudden the scenery is a blur. I should point out that this is relatively rare and probably the only negative against an otherwise an excellent gearbox. Certainly in "S" mode the engine is very much kept on the boil and the changes seem much more intelligent. The car is rarely surprised and manual also works very well.
For me, having power at the top end gives the car its two distinct characters which is what I like so much. You just don't get that with a big diesel - competent as they are. If you are in the mood then you need to drive the car much more and that's what makes it involving. People who typically buy a large luxury saloon don't necessarily want "involving" though, so it probably appeals to quite a narrow audience.
This is almost exactly what I was going to write. For me, having power at the top end gives the car its two distinct characters which is what I like so much. You just don't get that with a big diesel - competent as they are. If you are in the mood then you need to drive the car much more and that's what makes it involving. People who typically buy a large luxury saloon don't necessarily want "involving" though, so it probably appeals to quite a narrow audience.
The perception of lacking low end torque, IMO, comes down to (a) comparing the car's low end torque (which is perfectly respectable) with its high end torque (which is properly formidable), and (b) the gearbox when in D running up to 5 or 6 whenever it can, and so putting the end at the low end of its rev range.
Greg66 said:
The perception of lacking low end torque, IMO, comes down to (a) comparing the car's low end torque (which is perfectly respectable) with its high end torque (which is properly formidable), and (b) the gearbox when in D running up to 5 or 6 whenever it can, and so putting the end at the low end of its rev range.
Personally I thought the car could do with a bit more power full stop. In a few months when the new S8 drops a bit I'll take one out. 513 bhp and tturbos should transform the S8 experience.To the old car - surely if you want a sharp response from the gearbox you put the car into Sport or flick the lever manually, that's the point of giving you options. I'd agree the gearbox isn't the last word in advanced technology though.
popeyewhite said:
Personally I thought the car could do with a bit more power full stop. In a few months when the new S8 drops a bit I'll take one out. 513 bhp and tturbos should transform the S8 experience.
That's true of almost all cars though, isn't it? At least in a straight line. I've tried very very hard, but I cannot abide the look of the 4H A8s. The back end looks, well, s
t. And the front end is nothing to write home about either. Greg66 said:
popeyewhite said:
Personally I thought the car could do with a bit more power full stop. In a few months when the new S8 drops a bit I'll take one out. 513 bhp and tturbos should transform the S8 experience.
That's true of almost all cars though, isn't it? At least in a straight line. Greg66 said:
I've tried very very hard, but I cannot abide the look of the 4H A8s. The back end looks, well, st. And the front end is nothing to write home about either.
It's no looker, that's for sure. The huge quilted seats in the S8 appear comfy though.The car is supposed to be very refined. I will try an S63 AMG as well. t. And the front end is nothing to write home about either. I'm flirting with the idea of an S6 Avant with the V10 at the moment.
A lot seem to have high mileage though. Are there any big concerns on engine/ gearbox bork (I assume it's the same running gear as the S8)?
I could handle the odd suspension part failing but older S6s seem to have a bad reputation for gearboxes and was wondering whether they sorted this with the V10.
A lot seem to have high mileage though. Are there any big concerns on engine/ gearbox bork (I assume it's the same running gear as the S8)?
I could handle the odd suspension part failing but older S6s seem to have a bad reputation for gearboxes and was wondering whether they sorted this with the V10.
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