997 Turbo Prices

Author
Discussion

JasonRIx

Original Poster:

69 posts

119 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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Sorry to bore everyone with depreciation/appreciation type conversations. I'm trying to figure out if 997 Turbo prices are hardening or it's my imagination.

I've been keeping an eye on them but hard to work out and with so much radio noise of people harping on about 996 Turbos going up, which if true would mean 997 Turbos at least staying still.

Any ideas?

Thanks


Bikeracer1098

510 posts

187 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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I've recently bought a gen 2 turbo.

Was originally looking for a late gen 1 car but decided to increase my budget for a gen 2 cars.

Not too sure about gen 2 residuals during the past 12,month, however gen 1 turbo cars have gone up in value by around £6k to £8k

Hope that helps

Chris355

790 posts

195 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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I have been watching them for a while. My view is that 6 and 7 turbos have both gone up in price, but this has been from winter to summer (6's have risen more). 6's have risen more, and I think it is a genuine increase (with a small amount due to seasonal variation) whereas I think that 7's increase, which has been smaller is part genuine increase, but more seasonal variation. It will be interesting to see what happens next ... Will they remain static for the rest of the summer and then drop down in September or continue increasing from now ...

JasonRIx

Original Poster:

69 posts

119 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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It will be interesting if the 6/7 turbos are genuinely starting to go up. If so it suggests that long term there may be a weird cluster of 996,997 and 991s all in a similar, if large, band. That is, after the 991s have dropped their first 3-5 years depreciation.


Bikeracer1098

510 posts

187 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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Chris355 said:
I have been watching them for a while. My view is that 6 and 7 turbos have both gone up in price, but this has been from winter to summer (6's have risen more). 6's have risen more, and I think it is a genuine increase (with a small amount due to seasonal variation) whereas I think that 7's increase, which has been smaller is part genuine increase, but more seasonal variation. It will be interesting to see what happens next ... Will they remain static for the rest of the summer and then drop down in September or continue increasing from now ...
During the past 2 or 3 years there hadn't been the usual season change in prices.

Even during the winter months prices have been close to summer prices which is unusual.

The biggest difference is that the cars are not selling as quickly during winter months.

I don't think we will see any reduction in 996/997 turbo prices from Seotember onwards unless the general car market biubble was to bust, which is highly unlikely in the current climate.

hygt2

419 posts

178 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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All of the 996T are now out of (extended) warranty. Some 997T are still under extended warranty but all of the 997T could still be placed back onto the extended warranty up to 10 years old. What would be interesting to see is what happen when warranty cannot be put on the 997T (i.e. over 10 years old), given the repair costs are generally higher than the 996T.

Also, the clientèle for the 997T is likely to change when they become 10 years old, whereas the 996T appeared to have changed since c. 2012/13. What this will do to residual value would be interesting to watch also.

Lastly, although 996T were sold in huge numbers, the 997T were sold in even bigger numbers so how would the supply-side impact the 997T used price would also be interested to see.


JasonRIx

Original Poster:

69 posts

119 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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As an aside, I think it would be great if when people speculate on prices appreciating or depreciating they should automatically be banned from the topic if they happened to have that model in question!

I include myself in that! It's almost impossible to not 'talk up' the value of a car when it is your own. It's not dishonest, just optimism most of the time.

That's no criticism of any of the above comments, just a general observation that adds to the noise when trying to work out what the prices are doing!


Chris355

790 posts

195 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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I really don't understand the 6t appreciating in value. I don't see it as collectable. Its not a limited run (excluding the s). It's not iconic like the 964t, it's not the last air cooled like the 993.

I'm looking for a 7t at the moment. The 6t is a nice car, but I wouldn't buy one, even with the current saving over a 7t. I substantially prefer the 7t shape. Subjective opinion of course.

I have seen the substantial increase in value from winter to summer hence why I think part (not all) is seasonal. Speaking to a trader recently, he said that a black 7t coupe he was selling, he didn't advertise until April as prices go up in summer!

Bikeracer1098

510 posts

187 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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Chris355 said:
I really don't understand the 6t appreciating in value. I don't see it as collectable. Its not a limited run (excluding the s). It's not iconic like the 964t, it's not the last air cooled like the 993.

I'm looking for a 7t at the moment. The 6t is a nice car, but I wouldn't buy one, even with the current saving over a 7t. I substantially prefer the 7t shape. Subjective opinion of course.

I have seen the substantial increase in value from winter to summer hence why I think part (not all) is seasonal. Speaking to a trader recently, he said that a black 7t coupe he was selling, he didn't advertise until April as prices go up in summer!
No it's not a case of these cars being worth more in the summer than the winter.

What we have seem during the past 12 months or so is a steady increase in the values of the air cooled 911 along with 996 GT3/Turbio/GT2 as well as 997 GT3/GT2 and turbos.

Looking at Ferrari prices an F430 is currently very similar to what the same car would have been last year and also during the winter months. Also Nissan R35 GTR prices have remained stable for the past 3 years with no dip in prices during the winter.

You may find a 997 turbo cheaper during the winter if your lucky, however zi don't see prices decreasing any time soon.
So much so I bought one during the past few weeks as I belive the same car will increase in value during the next 6 months.

Also all good 997.1 manual turbos are currently bring snapped up by the trade and bring readvertised with a premium of around £8k

Chad_Hugo

649 posts

177 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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The 997 Turbo is the far, far better looking car- it is for me as close to perfection you can get visually- aggressive and mean in black especially with black rs spyder wheels yet sleek, refined and perfectly proportioned.

The 996 is showing it's age, the front end massively so.

Re: 997 values- I started my search for a 997 Turbo last summer, initially my intention was to get a 07/08 tiptronic. Then I decided to take my time, drive the gen 2 Turbo/Turbo S, and many months later ended up with a brilliant 997 Gen 2 Turbo S with a very special spec. Asking prices of good, low miles, desirable colour gen 1 cars seem to have risen by a good 5k-6k, at least at OPC last time I looked, maybe even more.

I don't see build volumes of 997 Turbo being a factor going forwards as it's not every single car that will gain or hold it's value, the older the cars get the smaller the number of very desirable cars is, if anything it's a much smaller pool of low/average miles cars with fully documented service history, the right condition, not too many owners, of course spec/colour, and things like the car being original non modified come into play for most buyers. It's not easy even today to find a really good car, let alone longer term!

I don't ever see prices going crazy for them and them appreciating massively, but they are definitely a good, safe buy, especially when you consider the performance v.s. cost.



Adam B

27,142 posts

253 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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hygt2 said:
All of the 996T are now out of (extended) warranty. Some 997T are still under extended warranty but all of the 997T could still be placed back onto the extended warranty up to 10 years old. What would be interesting to see is what happen when warranty cannot be put on the 997T (i.e. over 10 years old), given the repair costs are generally higher than the 996T.
Really? How so? I can see 997T has more tech such as PASM but would have thought the general stuff would be similar.

Either way both are £100k cars and you need to budget accordingly, I doubt the small maintenance cost differences would be a factor when choosing between the two, certainly not a factor I considered when I went for the 7

Edited by Adam B on Saturday 30th May 23:42

hygt2

419 posts

178 months

Sunday 31st May 2015
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Adam B said:
Really? How so? I can see 997T has more tech such as PASM but would have thought the general stuff would be similar.

Either way both are £100k cars and you need to budget accordingly, I doubt the small maintenance cost differences would be a factor when choosing between the two, certainly not a factor I considered when I went for the 7

Edited by Adam B on Saturday 30th May 23:42
From speaking with Ken at Nine Excellent, 997T are more expensive to repair like-for-like, such as the VTG Turbos in the 997T vs. the K16/K24s in the 996T.

Regarding suspension which your mentioned, regardless whether a car has active or passive shock absorbers, shock absorbers will always wear out and I would imagine that passive dampers to be cheaper than active dampers. My W220 S-Class Bilstein dampers are massively more expensive than the passive dampers on 996T, despite that my Merc is only worth £4k vs. £25k for my 996T. However, I think the control arms and bushes should be similarly priced between the 997T and 996T.

I live in central London with lots of speed bumps and potholes and I also drive quite hard on country lanes, I expect dampers to wear out every 60k anyway, so that is a fixed cost every 5 years for me.

As you said these were expensive cars when new so high maintenance cost is not a surprise.

Robtheloop

47 posts

112 months

Sunday 31st May 2015
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I bought a 997T Gen 1 back in July last year and paid £45k. I sold it (personal reasons) last week. During that time I covered 9000 miles. It is now on the dealers forecourt for £48k. Kind of gives a strong indication that values are on the up!

Bikeracer1098

510 posts

187 months

Sunday 31st May 2015
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Robtheloop said:
I bought a 997T Gen 1 back in July last year and paid £45k. I sold it (personal reasons) last week. During that time I covered 9000 miles. It is now on the dealers forecourt for £48k. Kind of gives a strong indication that values are on the up!
Out of interest after the 9k you did in the car, what is the current mileage?

Robtheloop

47 posts

112 months

Sunday 31st May 2015
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Bought July 2014 with 41,100. Sold May 2015 with 49,200.

r1flyguy1

1,567 posts

175 months

Sunday 31st May 2015
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Had the dealer I bought mine off over 3 years ago, call me (first time since I bought it) asking what i thought of the car and what I was doing with it?

Not selling it thats for sure.

mollytherocker

14,365 posts

208 months

Sunday 31st May 2015
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If you want a 996t or 997t, I would be buying now. I reckon in another 12 months they will be at a different price level.

Just my view of course, but I am happy to be quoted in a years time.

Adam B

27,142 posts

253 months

Sunday 31st May 2015
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The sage has spoken, and this time I think he's right

Shewie

553 posts

189 months

Monday 1st June 2015
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I bought my manual 997tt in September last year. Admittedly I bought it privately, but looking in the classifieds there doesn't seem to be anything comparable for the same money I paid. Maybe it's just seasonal or maybe the market is hardening I'm not sure.

Personally I have no plans to sell as it as it's such a great car, so if I can get away with a few years relatively depreciation free I'll be happy enough

Shewie

553 posts

189 months

Monday 1st June 2015
quotequote all
I bought my manual 997tt in September last year. Admittedly I bought it privately, but looking in the classifieds there doesn't seem to be anything comparable for the same money I paid. Maybe it's just seasonal or maybe the market is hardening I'm not sure.

Personally I have no plans to sell as it as it's such a great car, so if I can get away with a few years relatively depreciation free I'll be happy enough