Starter Track Car (yes this is another what car thread)

[maurauth]

Hi all, I'm looking to get into track days etc

I'd love to track the SLK but couldn't afford to repair any damage as it's my P&J and in pristine condition.

The mrs is learning to drive and so looking for a cheapish car that I can buy as a track toy but still have her drive

Requirements:
-preferably less than £1k so I have some cash for mods, could stretch to £2k for the perfect box ticking car
-fun
-good starter track car stock
-variety of mods available
-still has some scope after getting better at track driving, won't need to be replaced after 6 months
-road legal and can be used as a DD for the mrs
-as reliable as possible for the price point, would like one that can take some abuse on track and still survive another 20-30k miles, and if it could make a trip to the ring next year that would be great
-would like RWD if that's a possibility
-convertible / coupe would be nice but open to hatchbacks etc

Considerations:
-Mazda mx5 / eunos: had a couple mk3s before and loved the handling, I know I'd get a mk1 maybe a mk2 for this price and have heard that the milage doesn't matter as much as the condition of the bodywork. Is it better to go for a high milage with little to no rust or a lower milage with some rust considering this will mainly be for track days and some pootling round town? 1.6vs1.8- owners of the smaller engine say it's more free reving, handles better and takes modifications better. Owners of the larger engine say that its much quicker and handles no worse than the 1.6, any objective opinons?

-Saxo VTS: the car of choice for 17 year olds of my youth, heard it takes a turbo well but even N/A it's quite quick, most will be closer to 150k miles on the clock than 100k, how long lasting are these cars? Have most of them died to boy racer write offs rather than age/wear and tear related deaths? Are parts still plentiful for them?

-Clio 172: bit too pricey?

-206 GTI: don't know much, opinions?

-Golf GTI (Mk3/4): again not much of a hatchback fan so don't know much.

Would really like any ideas and thoughts about these considerations and am open to any suggestions?
Again, I've never driven on track before and despite considering myself a good driver (we all think we're F1 quality right?) I know that I'm probably going to have to start right at the beginning.

[ZX10R NIN]

I'd say FWD will be a good starting point because there's more choice.

Clio 172/182
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Renault-Clio-172-road-tr...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2004-RENAULT-CLIO-SPORT-...

Peugeot 206 GTI
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2005-05-Peugeot-206-2-0-...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2000-Peugeot-206-GRAND-T...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PEUGEOT-206-GTI-180-17-I...

If it has to be RWD take a look at the BMW Compacts
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-3-SERIES-325TI-COMPA...

[Codswallop]

Given the criteria it's hard to go wrong with some sort of MX5. Rust can be dealt with, and miles aren't a problem if the car has a good maintence record.

Light weight is useful on track as you'll spend less on consumables. Mk3 MR2 would be a good alternative to look into as they are very light and fun. Prefacelift cars (changeover was about the 2002/52 plate timepoint) can have precat failure which can wreck the engine, so worth bearing in mind. Most will have had preventative work by now I should imagine.

MG TF could be worth a look too. I've heard one or two people have expereinced some sort of cooling and or head gasket issues with the k-series (;)), but overall not a bad motor and the common faults are fairly easy to rectify.

[frisbee]

Your Mrs won't want your track toy, plus a modified car and new driver is going to be horrible for insurance.

[Gargamel]

Under 2k

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p...

I note a couple of Ford Pumas ( the 1.7 variety) in the classifieds too.

Relatively easy to modify.

[ChemicalChaos]

ZX10R NIN said:

If it has to be RWD take a look at the BMW Compacts
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-3-SERIES-325TI-COMPA...

No, don't.

These have the rear suspension from the E30 3-series, which is renowned for snap-oversteer when you least want or expect it. Not exactly a good combination for either track use or new drivers

[Benbay001]

frisbee said:

Your Mrs won't want your track toy, plus a modified car and new driver is going to be horrible for insurance.

Yep.

[maurauth]

frisbee said:

Your Mrs won't want your track toy, plus a modified car and new driver is going to be horrible for insurance.

She really liked the Mk3 mx5 and thinks small french hatches look "cute' so unless I strip out all the seats etc she won't mind. It's a free car at the end of the day!

[maurauth]

Codswallop said:

Given the criteria it's hard to go wrong with some sort of MX5. Rust can be dealt with, and miles aren't a problem if the car has a good maintence record.

Light weight is useful on track as you'll spend less on consumables. Mk3 MR2 would be a good alternative to look into as they are very light and fun. Prefacelift cars (changeover was about the 2002/52 plate timepoint) can have precat failure which can wreck the engine, so worth bearing in mind. Most will have had preventative work by now I should imagine.

MG TF could be worth a look too. I've heard one or two people have expereinced some sort of cooling and or head gasket issues with the k-series (;)), but overall not a bad motor and the common faults are fairly easy to rectify.

Hadn't considered the MG, will have a look at the MR2s as well as they look interesting.

Leaning on the MX5 a bit though

[maurauth]

ZX10R NIN said:

I'd say FWD will be a good starting point because there's more choice.

Clio 172/182
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Renault-Clio-172-road-tr...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2004-RENAULT-CLIO-SPORT-...

Peugeot 206 GTI
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2005-05-Peugeot-206-2-0-...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2000-Peugeot-206-GRAND-T...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PEUGEOT-206-GTI-180-17-I...

If it has to be RWD take a look at the BMW Compacts
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-3-SERIES-325TI-COMPA...

I'll check those out, will also look at the BMW as I've never owned a bmw other than e92/e90.

[Thunder18]

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/h...

Utterly reliable, civilised learner or track hoon!! Plenty of parts available for upgrades too

[SidewaysSi]

ChemicalChaos said:

ZX10R NIN said:

If it has to be RWD take a look at the BMW Compacts
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-3-SERIES-325TI-COMPA...

No, don't.

These have the rear suspension from the E30 3-series, which is renowned for snap-oversteer when you least want or expect it. Not exactly a good combination for either track use or new drivers

No they don't, you are confusing that with an E36. I would suggest however that a BMW is too heavy to be much fun on track.

I would save a bit longer and get an Integra DC2 - the closest to a racecar on the road out of the factory at this price point.

[e8_pack]

Saxos are awesome little track cars. Even better is the ax with the 16v engine. Very nippy, engine drops right in and you can use the brakes and 4 stud. The lighter ax and identical handling makes for a very very fun little track toy!

[ChemicalChaos]

SidewaysSi said:

ChemicalChaos said:

ZX10R NIN said:

If it has to be RWD take a look at the BMW Compacts
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-3-SERIES-325TI-COMPA...

No, don't.

These have the rear suspension from the E30 3-series, which is renowned for snap-oversteer when you least want or expect it. Not exactly a good combination for either track use or new drivers

No they don't, you are confusing that with an E36. I would suggest however that a BMW is too heavy to be much fun on track.

I would save a bit longer and get an Integra DC2 - the closest to a racecar on the road out of the factory at this price point.

Ahem... yes it does, and no I'm not.

I quote: "The E36/5 shares its suspension with the BMW Z3; the front suspension employs the E36's standard MacPherson strut design, while the rear suspension uses a semi trailing arm from the previous model BMW 3 Series (E30).
The E36/5 made use of the older semi-trailing arm rear axle, as opposed to the E36's Z-Axle Multi-link suspension. As the trailing arm design was smaller, it allowed for a lower trunk floor height, fold-down rear seats, and an exterior undermounted compact spare tire.
The inherent design of the trailing arm suspension was that it favoured oversteer"

[SidewaysSi]

ChemicalChaos said:

SidewaysSi said:

ChemicalChaos said:

ZX10R NIN said:

If it has to be RWD take a look at the BMW Compacts
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-3-SERIES-325TI-COMPA...

No, don't.

These have the rear suspension from the E30 3-series, which is renowned for snap-oversteer when you least want or expect it. Not exactly a good combination for either track use or new drivers

No they don't, you are confusing that with an E36. I would suggest however that a BMW is too heavy to be much fun on track.

I would save a bit longer and get an Integra DC2 - the closest to a racecar on the road out of the factory at this price point.

Ahem... yes it does, and no I'm not.

I quote: "The E36/5 shares its suspension with the BMW Z3; the front suspension employs the E36's standard MacPherson strut design, while the rear suspension uses a semi trailing arm from the previous model BMW 3 Series (E30).
The E36/5 made use of the older semi-trailing arm rear axle, as opposed to the E36's Z-Axle Multi-link suspension. As the trailing arm design was smaller, it allowed for a lower trunk floor height, fold-down rear seats, and an exterior undermounted compact spare tire.
The inherent design of the trailing arm suspension was that it favoured oversteer"

I agree entirely however the car linked is an E46. Irrespective, I am not sure it will be too snappy re. oversteer. It's just not a track car as it currently stands.

[ZX10R NIN]

SidewaysSi said:

ChemicalChaos said:

SidewaysSi said:

ChemicalChaos said:

ZX10R NIN said:

If it has to be RWD take a look at the BMW Compacts
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-3-SERIES-325TI-COMPA...

No, don't.

These have the rear suspension from the E30 3-series, which is renowned for snap-oversteer when you least want or expect it. Not exactly a good combination for either track use or new drivers

No they don't, you are confusing that with an E36. I would suggest however that a BMW is too heavy to be much fun on track.

I would save a bit longer and get an Integra DC2 - the closest to a racecar on the road out of the factory at this price point.

Ahem... yes it does, and no I'm not.

I quote: "The E36/5 shares its suspension with the BMW Z3; the front suspension employs the E36's standard MacPherson strut design, while the rear suspension uses a semi trailing arm from the previous model BMW 3 Series (E30).
The E36/5 made use of the older semi-trailing arm rear axle, as opposed to the E36's Z-Axle Multi-link suspension. As the trailing arm design was smaller, it allowed for a lower trunk floor height, fold-down rear seats, and an exterior undermounted compact spare tire.
The inherent design of the trailing arm suspension was that it favoured oversteer"

I agree entirely however the car linked is an E46. Irrespective, I am not sure it will be too snappy re. oversteer. It's just not a track car as it currently stands.

I agree as it stands it's not a track car but the OP wanted to spend around 2-2.5K on a track car he should be able to get the car for £1000 leaving him 1.5K to spend on Suspension & Brakes

[anarki]

Another vote here for the puma 1.7.

Upgrade the front brakes to fiesta ST spec, 280mm discs, calipers, some decent pads and braided lines for around £300-400 sorted.

It may "only" have 123hp but they weigh a smidge over a ton and the have stunning handling which makes them incredibly fun. Oh and the gearshift is rifle like good.

[maurauth]

Seem to be leaning between the Clio and MX5 at the moment, will look into the Pumas though!

Any first hand experience of the Clios or Mk1/2 MX5s here?

[feef]

maurauth said:

Seem to be leaning between the Clio and MX5 at the moment, will look into the Pumas though!

Any first hand experience of the Clios or Mk1/2 MX5s here?

I'm using my MK2.5 MX5 both as a DD and a track toy with a view to competing in hillclimbs and/or sprint when I get my race suit and helmet sorted out (car's prepped and I've got my licence).

I'm also driving it to the South of France in July with my 4yr old as co-pilot. Just shows how versatile the MX5 really is, and still be fun.

I'd go for one with minimal rust. The engines are hardy and cheap to replace. The 1.6 revs more freely as standard, but if you're tracking it and thinking about modding it, the 1.8 will rev just as freely with a slightly lighter flywheel and I've set my rev limiter at 7600rpm (hard limit, soft limit comes in at 7200) and it revs beautifully.

[maurauth]

Come across this on Autotrader whilst looking, at least it's an entry for the horrors thread haha

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2015...