How will this pan out?

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Discussion

Andyjc86

Original Poster:

1,149 posts

149 months

Thursday 18th June 2015
quotequote all
It makes no difference to me, but I'm interested.

Long story short :

Car dealer (who I contract into), sells car (£3500 iirc), car then develops gearbox fault after a couple of weeks.

Owner gets car fixed at main dealer for £1700, owner sends original dealer bill.

Dealer says tough, should have sent it back to me first. Take me to court.

Owner issues (business?) court papers.

I recon he will be made to pay between 1/3 and 1/2, as he plans to argue it would have cost less for him to fix it.

I will update the thread when progress is made

marshalla

15,902 posts

201 months

Thursday 18th June 2015
quotequote all
Usual rule of thumb is that the vendor should be given the chance to put things right first as that's who the contract is with.

Jonsv8

7,211 posts

124 months

Friday 19th June 2015
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marshalla said:
Usual rule of thumb is that the vendor should be given the chance to put things right first as that's who the contract is with.
I agree. If the vendor knew nothing about the fault then I suspect they'll have to pay nothing.

HTP99

22,530 posts

140 months

Friday 19th June 2015
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Why would you not contact the original seller when the problem appeared, I don't think it will go the way that you hope.

98elise

26,502 posts

161 months

Friday 19th June 2015
quotequote all
Hasn't got a leg to stand on. You can't just get your car fixed anywhere and expect the other dealer to pay.

That wouldn't even happen on a brand new car with a gold plated manufacturers warranty.

Andyjc86

Original Poster:

1,149 posts

149 months

Friday 19th June 2015
quotequote all
HTP99 said:
Why would you not contact the original seller when the problem appeared, I don't think it will go the way that you hope.
No idea, he claims to have tried ringing but didn't get an answer, but didn't leave a message.

As I said, it's nothing to do with me, I've just seen all the correspondence and was intrigued. The court papers arrived on Tuesday, so it's still got a bit of a way to go yet.

eatcustard

1,003 posts

127 months

Friday 19th June 2015
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Can buyer prove he tried to make contact with the seller?

calibrax

4,788 posts

211 months

Friday 19th June 2015
quotequote all
If the original seller never had a chance to inspect the car after the fault developed, how does he know there was even a fault at all? For all he knows, the buyer and the other garage have colluded to say the work was needed when it wasn't...

Can't see the original seller being liable for anything on this one.

Andyjc86

Original Poster:

1,149 posts

149 months

Friday 31st July 2015
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Thread update. They have a court mediation on August 5th (I think)

btcc123

1,243 posts

147 months

Friday 31st July 2015
quotequote all
OP I see you are in the motor trade as the owner of a garage so why are you on here asking people a question you should know the answer of.

Andyjc86

Original Poster:

1,149 posts

149 months

Saturday 1st August 2015
quotequote all
Because your obligations fixing cars, and selling them are completely different......

Andyjc86

Original Poster:

1,149 posts

149 months

Friday 7th August 2015
quotequote all
I spoke with him yesterday. The new owner wants the total bill paying (£1700), where as the dealers have priced up the work for them to do it, and it would have been just over £400.

Basically the part that failed is a common Mercedes fault, and as such, companies like ecu testing fix them for £200. Mercedes miss diagnosed it first of all, so that chucked some extra labour on (they thought it was the auto box belts).

Dealer offered £500, buyer refused, off to court they go

The Beet

15 posts

106 months

Friday 7th August 2015
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Andyjc86 said:
(they thought it was the auto box belts).
Do these Mercs run the old DAF Variomatic transmission?

JustinP1

13,330 posts

230 months

Friday 7th August 2015
quotequote all
Andyjc86 said:
Dealer offered £500, buyer refused, off to court they go
The dealer should make this offer formal, in a WP offer save as to costs.

You don't get to buy a second hand Merc, at 10% of the new price and roll up to the franchised dealer and get them to repair it willy nilly and send the seller the bill.

Additionally, if the buyer hasn't put the matter in writing formally, requesting the sum on threat of legal action, he's also unlikely to get his court costs back.

If I were the dealer, I'd be offering £500 - hell, even £700 with the knowledge that the buyer would be too pigheaded to accept it, and roll up to the hearing.

Depending of the facts of the situation, the award is going to be £0 to £400, and as such I would argue that the buyer has been unreasonable in not accepting my offer and ask for my costs to be paid.

I'd arrive at court with a schedule of the hours spent on the matter. The current rate for a litigant in person is £18 per hour. The rate for driving to and from court is 45p a mile.

It could very well be that for example, the judge awards £400, but an adverse costs award where the claimant does not get their court costs covered, and ends up with an award for £100 or whatever against him.

Andyjc86

Original Poster:

1,149 posts

149 months

Tuesday 1st September 2015
quotequote all
A little update, no court date has been set yet.

However, the buyer has been in touch via email, to say, and I quote 'I didn't buy a pup, but a complete dog'.

The starter motor decided to pack up and cost about £400 to fix. So he has added that onto the claim and the claimed that my mate (the seller) is a criminal selling bad cars.

I think he had the car 4 or 5 months when the starter went. I despair.

People like him are the reason I will never get into sales.

VolvoT5

4,155 posts

174 months

Tuesday 1st September 2015
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It is completely unreasonable not to give the dealer a chance to fix it.

johnfm

13,668 posts

250 months

Tuesday 1st September 2015
quotequote all
JustinP1 said:
Andyjc86 said:
Dealer offered £500, buyer refused, off to court they go
The dealer should make this offer formal, in a WP offer save as to costs.

You don't get to buy a second hand Merc, at 10% of the new price and roll up to the franchised dealer and get them to repair it willy nilly and send the seller the bill.

Additionally, if the buyer hasn't put the matter in writing formally, requesting the sum on threat of legal action, he's also unlikely to get his court costs back.

If I were the dealer, I'd be offering £500 - hell, even £700 with the knowledge that the buyer would be too pigheaded to accept it, and roll up to the hearing.

Depending of the facts of the situation, the award is going to be £0 to £400, and as such I would argue that the buyer has been unreasonable in not accepting my offer and ask for my costs to be paid.

I'd arrive at court with a schedule of the hours spent on the matter. The current rate for a litigant in person is £18 per hour. The rate for driving to and from court is 45p a mile.

It could very well be that for example, the judge awards £400, but an adverse costs award where the claimant does not get their court costs covered, and ends up with an award for £100 or whatever against him.
Court costs? Small claims? Limited to £260 anyway, isn't it?

Andyjc86

Original Poster:

1,149 posts

149 months

Sunday 3rd January 2016
quotequote all
I've just found out that they are going to court tomorrow, so I assume I'll know the result tomorrow night

Du1point8

21,606 posts

192 months

Sunday 3rd January 2016
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Thats taken its time.

Hamish Finn

476 posts

108 months

Sunday 3rd January 2016
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Du1point8 said:
Thats taken its time.
It's because the auto-box belts are slipping.