The alternatives to Harley Davidson

The alternatives to Harley Davidson

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Discussion

ZesPak

24,423 posts

195 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
HD Adam said:
I don't really understand these "Harleys handle badly" comments.

Of course they don't handle like a sports bike. None of the cruisers whether it's an Indian, Rune, Victory or HD will. That's not what they are about.
Ok, let me clarify, they are like for like worse than any of the bikes you mention.

Handling wise, standard suspension, brakes and engine are not on par with the competition, whilst the price is usually not on par in the other direction. You really, really have to want a Harley to get one, or just not be aware of the competition.

Things like that usually attract some stick.

casbar

1,102 posts

214 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
ZesPak said:
Ok, let me clarify, they are like for like worse than any of the bikes you mention.

Handling wise, standard suspension, brakes and engine are not on par with the competition, whilst the price is usually not on par in the other direction. You really, really have to want a Harley to get one, or just not be aware of the competition.

Things like that usually attract some stick.
That is absolutely rubbish, My bike has Brembo brakes, which are Linked above 25mph, plus if you bother to read reviews from the US Police, they have rated the Harley ABS system as they best they have tested. I have been riding legally since the 1980 and have ridden Jap, British and German bikes, only been on a Harley for about 7 years, but the new bikes do not handle badly.

wtdoom

3,742 posts

207 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
How about a big Japanese muscle bike ? I'd love a xjr1300 with some trick bits on it .

HD Adam

5,144 posts

183 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
casbar said:
ZesPak said:
Ok, let me clarify, they are like for like worse than any of the bikes you mention.

Handling wise, standard suspension, brakes and engine are not on par with the competition, whilst the price is usually not on par in the other direction. You really, really have to want a Harley to get one, or just not be aware of the competition.

Things like that usually attract some stick.
That is absolutely rubbish, My bike has Brembo brakes, which are Linked above 25mph, plus if you bother to read reviews from the US Police, they have rated the Harley ABS system as they best they have tested. I have been riding legally since the 1980 and have ridden Jap, British and German bikes, only been on a Harley for about 7 years, but the new bikes do not handle badly.
No, I'm pretty sure that Zespak has ridden all the equivalent models which has allowed him to come up with that well informed statement.

Here's a test of the 3 touring bikes for an alternate look.
The HD comes 2nd to the Indian overall and costs $4000 less but it is slower over the quarter mile by 7/100ths of a second.

Embarrassing really rolleyes


http://www.cycleworld.com/2015/03/16/harley-davids...

They are all much of a muchness. Just pick the one you like best.





casbar

1,102 posts

214 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
HD Adam said:
No, I'm pretty sure that Zespak has ridden all the equivalent models which has allowed him to come up with that well informed statement.

Here's a test of the 3 touring bikes for an alternate look.
The HD comes 2nd to the Indian overall and costs $4000 less but it is slower over the quarter mile by 7/100ths of a second.

Embarrassing really rolleyes


http://www.cycleworld.com/2015/03/16/harley-davids...

They are all much of a muchness. Just pick the one you like best.

A whole 7/100ths of a second - wow. It might be that the bike they tested was a 103 and the Indian has a 111 engine. If they tested a Harley with a 110 engine there wouldn't be a lot of difference. I'm not really bothered how many bikes anyone has tested, I'm well qualified to make the statements I have, as I actually own a 2014 CVO Road King. Each to their own, ride whatever you want.

bimsb6

8,034 posts

220 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
I'm in the u.s at the moment on holiday , i've driven from dallas through to vegas there were loads of bikes on the roads the vast majority were harleys a few bmws a few triumphs and some ducatis oh and 2 indians . The bike touring types are still firmly in the harley camp from what i have seen .

Mastodon2

13,818 posts

164 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
bimsb6 said:
I'm in the u.s at the moment on holiday , i've driven from dallas through to vegas there were loads of bikes on the roads the vast majority were harleys a few bmws a few triumphs and some ducatis oh and 2 indians . The bike touring types are still firmly in the harley camp from what i have seen .
Because HD are a brand who've played the aspirational marketing card very well, for better or worse for the people who buy their bikes.

ZesPak

24,423 posts

195 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
HD Adam said:
No, I'm pretty sure that Zespak has ridden all the equivalent models which has allowed him to come up with that well informed statement.

Here's a test of the 3 touring bikes for an alternate look.
The HD comes 2nd to the Indian overall and costs $4000 less but it is slower over the quarter mile by 7/100ths of a second.

Embarrassing really rolleyes


http://www.cycleworld.com/2015/03/16/harley-davids...

They are all much of a muchness. Just pick the one you like best.
yes I did indeed.

How you managed to get the Harley second from that article, I don't know. Their conclusion clearly states three categories, none of which are taken by the Harley.
That said, there's dozens of reviews, especially for the less expensive bikes that aren't half as nice for the Harleys.

In the end though, I was very taken by the Victory Hammer and Indian scout, but haven't pulled the trigger yet as I'm moving to a house with a bigger garage within the year.

Hooli

32,278 posts

199 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
wtdoom said:
How about a big Japanese muscle bike ? I'd love a xjr1300 with some trick bits on it .
yes

I've got a GSX14 & it does everything quite well. But then if your after a cruiser, muscle bikes aren't crusiers so won't do it for you.

bimsb6

8,034 posts

220 months

Sunday 28th June 2015
quotequote all
Hooli said:
yes

I've got a GSX14 & it does everything quite well. But then if your after a cruiser, muscle bikes aren't crusiers so won't do it for you.
Quite , it's like suggesting buying a trail bike ' coz i quite like them .

wtdoom

3,742 posts

207 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
bimsb6 said:
Hooli said:
yes

I've got a GSX14 & it does everything quite well. But then if your after a cruiser, muscle bikes aren't crusiers so won't do it for you.
Quite , it's like suggesting buying a trail bike ' coz i quite like them .
Hey this is piston heads , someone will be along in a minute voting for a street triple biggrin

spareparts

6,777 posts

226 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
Haven't tried an Indian, even though the Chieftain has significant showroom bling appeal. But all my prejudice against Harleys... well, they were blown apart when ChipChap and I decided to leave the angry sportsbikes behind, and rented a couple Harley RoadKings for a roadtrip along Wales' finest roads...

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=142...


bogie

16,344 posts

271 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
Thankfully the OP has *some* criteria which helps narrow the field a little and excludes all the traditional air cooled American V-twins wink

"Something that has decent amount of power and torque. A tiny bit of handling finesse..."

If we say >100bhp to be "decent", sure everyone will change pipes/filter/map for a few more bhp and you can easy lose 10Kg, but its pretty negligible at this level

So that limits you to:

V-Max (the original power cruiser, not cheap but most poke nearly 200bhp to go with your 310Kg)
V-Rod (Ok, so its a Harley with a German engine, 305kg/122bhp)
Rocket III (ignore that its the size of a full dress tourer - 370kg/140bhp)
Suzuki M109 (ignore the depreciation on Jap cruisers and buy used 335Kg/125bhp)

or
Diavel (not really a cruiser, but a great all round bike, 250Kg/160bhp)

Gusto

606 posts

232 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
wtdoom said:
Hey this is piston heads , someone will be along in a minute voting for a street triple biggrin
I did my DAS a couple of years ago because I wanted a Harley, I ended up with a street triple.... HD next year I think....

Janluke

2,553 posts

157 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
Hooli said:
wtdoom said:
How about a big Japanese muscle bike ? I'd love a xjr1300 with some trick bits on it .
yes

I've got a GSX14 & it does everything quite well. But then if your after a cruiser, muscle bikes aren't crusiers so won't do it for you.
I've an XJR1300 and a Victory Hammer S, both are great and have similar power/torque figures but they're very different to ride

BIRMA

3,803 posts

193 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
What about a custom job.

LeftmostAardvark

1,434 posts

163 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
bogie said:
Thankfully the OP has *some* criteria which helps narrow the field a little and excludes all the traditional air cooled American V-twins wink

"Something that has decent amount of power and torque. A tiny bit of handling finesse..."

If we say >100bhp to be "decent", sure everyone will change pipes/filter/map for a few more bhp and you can easy lose 10Kg, but its pretty negligible at this level

So that limits you to:

V-Max (the original power cruiser, not cheap but most poke nearly 200bhp to go with your 310Kg)
V-Rod (Ok, so its a Harley with a German engine, 305kg/122bhp)
Rocket III (ignore that its the size of a full dress tourer - 370kg/140bhp)
Suzuki M109 (ignore the depreciation on Jap cruisers and buy used 335Kg/125bhp)

or
Diavel (not really a cruiser, but a great all round bike, 250Kg/160bhp)
When you're looking at cruisers, Hp doesn't give you the whole picture. I've moved from a gsx1400 (106hp and 220-odd kg) to a victory Vegas (90hp and 290kg). The Vegas feels just as fast (and I think actually IS just as fast in real world). Sure ground clearance ain't great but the bike handles very well for a cruiser, planted, stable and predictable. I've worn my heels down on a pair of boots in six weeks. Reason that Vegas is great in my opinion: thrust and where in the Rev range it comes in. 113ft lb from just over tickover all the way to the (very low) redline produces a characterful, fun and useful thrust. Don't knock it until you've tried it...

Jazoli

9,086 posts

249 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
tight5 said:
Diavel for me ( well, I've got one, so it would be ! wink)



Renn Sport said:
Something that has decent amount of power and torque. A tiny bit of handling finesse...
Enough there to upset a Gixxer 750 rider on PH enough to get rid and get a Fazer 1000 instead !
laugh
Yeah right, it was your fat arse getting in the way and taking up a lane and a half wink

ZesPak

24,423 posts

195 months

Monday 29th June 2015
quotequote all
BIRMA said:
What about a custom job.
Tbh, you should try to ride one of these.

I've test ridden the Hammer S -iirc the widest standard rear tyre on any bike?- and you really have to like the riding style. Taking a corner takes a considerable amount of force because of the wide rear tyre.

That thing looks even wider! Also, no suspension whatsoever?

bimsb6

8,034 posts

220 months

Tuesday 30th June 2015
quotequote all
ZesPak said:
Tbh, you should try to ride one of these.

I've test ridden the Hammer S -iirc the widest standard rear tyre on any bike?- and you really have to like the riding style. Taking a corner takes a considerable amount of force because of the wide rear tyre.

That thing looks even wider! Also, no suspension whatsoever?
Air suspension by the look of it .