Didn't pass CBT :(
Discussion
It took me 2.5 attempts to get through CBT (the half was when I was too tired to concentrate properly and voluntarily pulled the plug).
It is not easy, there is a lot to learn in a short space of time, and confidence is important.
I did not respond well to a shouty instructor the first time and asked to go out with someone a bit more constructive the next time for the road section - made a huge difference, as did following a parking attendant renewing his CBT on a scooter who knew what he was doing.
Don't lose heart - well worth it in the end, and every time you go out with an instructor you are hopefully learning each time, so nothing is wasted from previous attempts.
It is not easy, there is a lot to learn in a short space of time, and confidence is important.
I did not respond well to a shouty instructor the first time and asked to go out with someone a bit more constructive the next time for the road section - made a huge difference, as did following a parking attendant renewing his CBT on a scooter who knew what he was doing.
Don't lose heart - well worth it in the end, and every time you go out with an instructor you are hopefully learning each time, so nothing is wasted from previous attempts.
rsdntbplr said:
Today I had my much awaited CBT. I've been a cyclist for a few years, and very recently started driving lessons (about 2 hours actual driving and 2 hours discussions/theory so far). So I was expecting and hoping to get the hang of it by the time we went out on the road.
From about 9 until half 2, we went through the on site bits - figure of 8, junctions, highway code, road signs etc. By that time I'd become more than comfortable with the little 50cc. It was just like riding a quad (off road quad rides three or four times in the past, the last time being a few years ago). I've been a passenger on a few lambrettas over the years.
Out on the road. I felt mostly at ease straight away. I did, however, get anxious when I began to go out of range of the walkie talkies because I went too far ahead in front of the instructor and the other guy I was with for the day. I found myself paying much less attention to the road and instead paying more and more attention to the instructor behind me to make sure I wasn't going out of range. After we swapped positions and I was in the middle of the other guy and the instructor as opposed to being at the front, I continued that habit. Didn't need to, but I did. This diversion of attention led to me treating a stopping T junction as a give way junction. I completely missed both the stop sign and the solid white line.
At another point, I stopped behind PARKED CARS. Cars that were PARKED. Empty. Switched off. Parked. That's not quite as dangerous as not stopping at a stop sign but still hazardous and shows a lack of concentration on my part. It was also a very stupid and idiotic thing for me to do. Kicking myself for that one.
When the other guy was leading, he went right up a one way street, the wrong way. Now. I did notice this - I saw the no entry sign. I also knew it was a one way road because I happened to have appointments at a place on that exact street every week for about 3 years. I was in no way about to go up there. However, the end of that one way road is on a corner, which would have been where we went. The instructor marked me down for that one because he was sure I'd have gone up that road because I hadn't stopped until he told the other guy he'd just gone the wrong way up a one way road. What I was doing was slowing down by removing throttle to await further instruction, and also so I wasn't in the middle of one right turn and one junction. No way I could prove that so I didn't dispute it. Plus, the stop sign issue was more than enough reason not to pass me.
What I should have done is continue round the corner and then pull over. In retrospect. Disappointing I gave over the impression I did but I was in no way going up that road.
Anyway. I've got to call the head office on Monday to arrange a day to go back for the road ride part only. I'm just so disheartened by it. I made a major mistake, and a couple of rookie errors. But I feel stupid, and worried I won't get there.
I think I read somewhere they do one to one for the CBT. Is it worth asking if I can do just the road ride part one to one? I feel as though I'd be able to perform better that way. I've got social anxiety anyway, so the day was always going to be slightly daunting (DVLA are aware). I also won't have to worry about going faster than the other guy, as that caused most of the issue because it threw me off repeatedly losing contact.
I think my most major mistake was concentrating too much on the presence of the instructor. I spent TOO MUCH time looking at the mirrors - to the point of missing road signs.
I want to drive a car, but I also love the feeling of being on a two wheeled vehicle. There's nothing like it. I'm sticking with 50cc for the next year at least, to get active experience. At that point, I'll be practicing with gears off road before taking my CBT again on a geared bike (I feel more comfortable with taking a CBT with the vehicle type you're going to be using).
A penny for your thoughts?
If an examiner feels you could technically pass a test but overall still lack the confidence to be a safe road user in a motorbike, they will invent stuff to fail you on. Which I agree with.From about 9 until half 2, we went through the on site bits - figure of 8, junctions, highway code, road signs etc. By that time I'd become more than comfortable with the little 50cc. It was just like riding a quad (off road quad rides three or four times in the past, the last time being a few years ago). I've been a passenger on a few lambrettas over the years.
Out on the road. I felt mostly at ease straight away. I did, however, get anxious when I began to go out of range of the walkie talkies because I went too far ahead in front of the instructor and the other guy I was with for the day. I found myself paying much less attention to the road and instead paying more and more attention to the instructor behind me to make sure I wasn't going out of range. After we swapped positions and I was in the middle of the other guy and the instructor as opposed to being at the front, I continued that habit. Didn't need to, but I did. This diversion of attention led to me treating a stopping T junction as a give way junction. I completely missed both the stop sign and the solid white line.
At another point, I stopped behind PARKED CARS. Cars that were PARKED. Empty. Switched off. Parked. That's not quite as dangerous as not stopping at a stop sign but still hazardous and shows a lack of concentration on my part. It was also a very stupid and idiotic thing for me to do. Kicking myself for that one.
When the other guy was leading, he went right up a one way street, the wrong way. Now. I did notice this - I saw the no entry sign. I also knew it was a one way road because I happened to have appointments at a place on that exact street every week for about 3 years. I was in no way about to go up there. However, the end of that one way road is on a corner, which would have been where we went. The instructor marked me down for that one because he was sure I'd have gone up that road because I hadn't stopped until he told the other guy he'd just gone the wrong way up a one way road. What I was doing was slowing down by removing throttle to await further instruction, and also so I wasn't in the middle of one right turn and one junction. No way I could prove that so I didn't dispute it. Plus, the stop sign issue was more than enough reason not to pass me.
What I should have done is continue round the corner and then pull over. In retrospect. Disappointing I gave over the impression I did but I was in no way going up that road.
Anyway. I've got to call the head office on Monday to arrange a day to go back for the road ride part only. I'm just so disheartened by it. I made a major mistake, and a couple of rookie errors. But I feel stupid, and worried I won't get there.
I think I read somewhere they do one to one for the CBT. Is it worth asking if I can do just the road ride part one to one? I feel as though I'd be able to perform better that way. I've got social anxiety anyway, so the day was always going to be slightly daunting (DVLA are aware). I also won't have to worry about going faster than the other guy, as that caused most of the issue because it threw me off repeatedly losing contact.
I think my most major mistake was concentrating too much on the presence of the instructor. I spent TOO MUCH time looking at the mirrors - to the point of missing road signs.
I want to drive a car, but I also love the feeling of being on a two wheeled vehicle. There's nothing like it. I'm sticking with 50cc for the next year at least, to get active experience. At that point, I'll be practicing with gears off road before taking my CBT again on a geared bike (I feel more comfortable with taking a CBT with the vehicle type you're going to be using).
A penny for your thoughts?
My thoughts would be, you're over thinking it. You wouldn't have stopped your car behind parked cars, so why do it on the bike? Don't unlearn what you know.
DanielJames said:
Well, I've never known anyone fail training before.
I think its more comon than you think, know several people who havent 'passed' on the first day.Both times I did my CBT (16 and again around 22 for DAS), there were people that didnt pass on the first day. I also had close friends who had to go back for the second day.
Back in 1989 I seem to recall turning up to my CBT on an RXS100, and by doing this he just signed me off straight away and I didn't even have to ride around cones etc.
I then did an afternoon of training on the road, followed my a morning on the road before the test. Borrowed a decent RXS100 from the test centre as my indicators didn't work and took my test and passed. Straight onto an RD350, then onto GSXR750.
It seems to be a very complex and lengthy procedure nowadays, but I think in some instances this is a good idea.
I then did an afternoon of training on the road, followed my a morning on the road before the test. Borrowed a decent RXS100 from the test centre as my indicators didn't work and took my test and passed. Straight onto an RD350, then onto GSXR750.
It seems to be a very complex and lengthy procedure nowadays, but I think in some instances this is a good idea.
Nigel Worc's said:
Good god, are people actually taking the CBT seriously now ?
Incredible as it might seem to an experienced riding god, there are people out there who have very little experience of driving / riding on the road. A cbt is their first taste of riding a motorbike, and with the "advice" of their loved ones ringing in their ears ("don't do it, you'll DIE!"), they have a day to learn where all the controls are, then go out in the traffic, faster than they've ever been on a road bike, it will feel like a big deal!OP - as others have said, you seem to have a bit of bad luck and made an error, too. Sounds like you should be fine next time.
I (53) did my CBT with my niece (16) last weekend. I don't think our instructor was especially strict, but thankfully we didn't have any stuff like you did.
As others have also said - don't overthink it. I am a bit surprised about the radio range thing - we didn't have that issue so I wonder if the equipment you were using wasn't 100%.
I saved falling off the 125 I was riding until we were back in the playground
Onwards and upwards to DAS for me - niece has been banned from having a moped (by her Mum) so is saving for car lessons.
I (53) did my CBT with my niece (16) last weekend. I don't think our instructor was especially strict, but thankfully we didn't have any stuff like you did.
As others have also said - don't overthink it. I am a bit surprised about the radio range thing - we didn't have that issue so I wonder if the equipment you were using wasn't 100%.
I saved falling off the 125 I was riding until we were back in the playground
Onwards and upwards to DAS for me - niece has been banned from having a moped (by her Mum) so is saving for car lessons.
rat840771 said:
Back in 1989 I seem to recall turning up to my CBT on an RXS100, and by doing this he just signed me off straight away and I didn't even have to ride around cones etc.
I then did an afternoon of training on the road, followed my a morning on the road before the test. Borrowed a decent RXS100 from the test centre as my indicators didn't work and took my test and passed. Straight onto an RD350, then onto GSXR750.
It seems to be a very complex and lengthy procedure nowadays, but I think in some instances this is a good idea.
Showing my age here, but I never had to take a CBT, or a two part test, when I took my bike test. It was the 10th Jun 1982 (it was 10 days after my 17th birthday). I then did an afternoon of training on the road, followed my a morning on the road before the test. Borrowed a decent RXS100 from the test centre as my indicators didn't work and took my test and passed. Straight onto an RD350, then onto GSXR750.
It seems to be a very complex and lengthy procedure nowadays, but I think in some instances this is a good idea.
Coincidentally, I also had an indicator problem... when I got to the test centre I gave my DT250MX a final check over, only to find that the indicators had packed up. Nightmare. Obviously it was too late to arrange another bike or start trying fault find. So I just did hand signals all the way round. I bet they wouldn't let you even take the test like that nowadays.
Yes those were the days, but I had been riding since I was 16 and had experience, so I was confident on a bike.
At out test centre I seem to recall a brief theory test, they then walk you out and ask you to read a number plate to test eye sight, then off we went with a instructor following me, jumps out at one point to do an emergency stop and then that was it, pass!
Coincidentally, I also had an indicator problem... when I got to the test centre I gave my DT250MX a final check over, only to find that the indicators had packed up. Nightmare. Obviously it was too late to arrange another bike or start trying fault find. So I just did hand signals all the way round. I bet they wouldn't let you even take the test like that nowadays.
At out test centre I seem to recall a brief theory test, they then walk you out and ask you to read a number plate to test eye sight, then off we went with a instructor following me, jumps out at one point to do an emergency stop and then that was it, pass!
4737 Carlin said:
rat840771 said:
Back in 1989 I seem to recall turning up to my CBT on an RXS100, and by doing this he just signed me off straight away and I didn't even have to ride around cones etc.
I then did an afternoon of training on the road, followed my a morning on the road before the test. Borrowed a decent RXS100 from the test centre as my indicators didn't work and took my test and passed. Straight onto an RD350, then onto GSXR750.
It seems to be a very complex and lengthy procedure nowadays, but I think in some instances this is a good idea.
Showing my age here, but I never had to take a CBT, or a two part test, when I took my bike test. It was the 10th Jun 1982 (it was 10 days after my 17th birthday). I then did an afternoon of training on the road, followed my a morning on the road before the test. Borrowed a decent RXS100 from the test centre as my indicators didn't work and took my test and passed. Straight onto an RD350, then onto GSXR750.
It seems to be a very complex and lengthy procedure nowadays, but I think in some instances this is a good idea.
Coincidentally, I also had an indicator problem... when I got to the test centre I gave my DT250MX a final check over, only to find that the indicators had packed up. Nightmare. Obviously it was too late to arrange another bike or start trying fault find. So I just did hand signals all the way round. I bet they wouldn't let you even take the test like that nowadays.
rat840771 said:
At out test centre I seem to recall a brief theory test, they then walk you out and ask you to read a number plate to test eye sight, then off we went with a instructor following me, jumps out at one point to do an emergency stop and then that was it, pass!
Sounds a lot like my 'Part 2' test in... 1989 I think: the test centre was in a local shopping centre next to a housing estate so the instructor would direct you to make left-hand circuits of the estate while he ran between the houses (hanging on to a trilby and a clipboard) to observe, then a few right-hand circuits, an e-stop 'jump out' and 'L' plates in the test centre bin 
robbocop33 said:
DanielJames said:
Well, I've never known anyone fail training before.
Yep,have to agree!I think this is the first person i've ever heard failing one,he must be rubbish!
p.s.I'm an ex instructor so i know he's the first one!
Were you this encouraging to your students when you were an instructor? 
I took more than one go to pass my CBT. This bore no relation to my eventual riding standard.
I 'failed' my CBT the first time.
I was 16 and a few things conspired against me and it all went a bit worng.
My TS50 Suzuki developed an oil starvation issue so i got to use the places honda single 4 stroke bike instead so i was on an unfamiliar machine. All was fine with the off orad bit, like figure 8 etc, as i had ridden trail bikes for years so was confident on bikes and handling them.
However when we did the road part, the one way radio was a bit iffy and i wasnt getting all the communication, and when the instructor said 'next left' i assumed the junction about 20 yards further up the road than the junction that was basically right beside me, so he thought i was having issues with reading the road, this led me going onto the larger dualled road that runs through town with a huge crossroads in the middle, and while trying to listen to the instructor and panicking a bit as i knew this was not a good situ to be in, i almost got cleaned out by a bus!
We stopped the CBT and i knew i hadnt passed, and i was so wound up that 'everyone passes' the cbt and i was the first guy to get a bike at school, i actually cried a bit, it always makes me laugh now, but at the time my world had ended.
Re sat it a week later, passed straight away and went home to play on my birthday present of a nintendo 64. Good times.
never looked back and just sold my CB1000R. Wedding and house next, then something fruity for the garage again
I was 16 and a few things conspired against me and it all went a bit worng.
My TS50 Suzuki developed an oil starvation issue so i got to use the places honda single 4 stroke bike instead so i was on an unfamiliar machine. All was fine with the off orad bit, like figure 8 etc, as i had ridden trail bikes for years so was confident on bikes and handling them.
However when we did the road part, the one way radio was a bit iffy and i wasnt getting all the communication, and when the instructor said 'next left' i assumed the junction about 20 yards further up the road than the junction that was basically right beside me, so he thought i was having issues with reading the road, this led me going onto the larger dualled road that runs through town with a huge crossroads in the middle, and while trying to listen to the instructor and panicking a bit as i knew this was not a good situ to be in, i almost got cleaned out by a bus!
We stopped the CBT and i knew i hadnt passed, and i was so wound up that 'everyone passes' the cbt and i was the first guy to get a bike at school, i actually cried a bit, it always makes me laugh now, but at the time my world had ended.
Re sat it a week later, passed straight away and went home to play on my birthday present of a nintendo 64. Good times.
never looked back and just sold my CB1000R. Wedding and house next, then something fruity for the garage again
robbocop33 said:
Yep,have to agree!I think this is the first person i've ever heard failing one,he must be rubbish!
p.s.I'm an ex instructor so i know he's the first one!
So I'm rubbish for giving way at a stop sign? I suppose you've never made a mistake. p.s.I'm an ex instructor so i know he's the first one!
You may be an ex instructor, but that isn't to say you were a rubbish instructor yourself. Many instructors fail to make the grade and unfortunately many don't move with the times. Things aren't the same as they used to be.
Anyway. Now that complete tart has had a reply, I can move on.
Of course, taking a CBT is taken seriously. Road traffic accident figures involving motorcycles have decreased dramatically since the CBT was introduced. Without the CBT, any fool could go onto the road and endanger the lives of themselves and others. A 125cc engine may not be huge, but it's enough to cause some serious damage and anyone over the age of 18 with a CBT and a provisional can ride one.
The CBT is a good introduction to handling a motorcycle. Admittedly, a lot of it I knew by watching my step-dad and brothers with their Lambrettas and Yamahas. What I didn't know is certain theory elements as I'd never looked much into theory, although I do know the Highway Code.
I don't get why you wouldn't take a CBT seriously. I turned up in a helmet, gloves, boots, kevlar-lined jeans and a thick jacket because I have witnessed a motorcycle accident first hand and thus I'd rather not go into motorcycling with a blase and humorous attitude to it all.
As it happens, a week's working (9-6 5 days a week) plus a sleepless night from the storm we had had left me rather sleepy for the day. By the time we were ready for the road drive, my arse already hurt and I was exhausted.
Enough of that. I thought I should expand on those points a little more.
I've booked in for the 2 hour road ride for Saturday 18th. I'm 80% I'll pass then. And no, you cannot "fail" your CBT in the strict sense of the word. What you can do is "fail to pass" your CBT on the first day. Passing your training is getting that certificate. It may not be literal "passing" as in most exams. But when you look at it, you can technically "Pass" and, if the riding school gets fed up with trying to train you, "Fail".
All I have to do is turn up on Saturday (18th) at 9 and do my road ride.
Thank you all for your encouragement and kind words. I'll let you know how it goes.
I did my CBT 2 Sundays ago. I'd never even sat on a motorbike before then so was pretty nervous. I did manage to "pass" however the young guy that was on it with me was told to come back on his own as he just wasn't listening/picking it up therefore was holding me back.
As with most things experience and practice are key. You'll pass with ease 2nd time out.
As with most things experience and practice are key. You'll pass with ease 2nd time out.
The other chap doing the CBT with me was utterly clueless on the road. He did an emergency stop on a busy road when he saw some people that might cross, when circumnavigating a roundabout he stopped for every entrance to let people on, did not know left from right, ignored directions and got lost.
He also stopped to piss in a park, luckily the instructor was amenable to the idea of issuing basic instructions for this task over the radio.
Despite all this he still 'passed'. Total liability.
Not sure why the theory test is not a pre-requisite to doing the CBT.
He also stopped to piss in a park, luckily the instructor was amenable to the idea of issuing basic instructions for this task over the radio.
Despite all this he still 'passed'. Total liability.
Not sure why the theory test is not a pre-requisite to doing the CBT.
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