E60 M5 Rod Bearing Failure! - Advice Really Appreciated

E60 M5 Rod Bearing Failure! - Advice Really Appreciated

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James-z9dpf

Original Poster:

17 posts

104 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Hello, I had my 2007 M5 for just over a month when the engine management light came on. I have a comprehensive Mondial warranty, so took it to the main dealer in Yeovil, who took the engine out and said that the rod bearings have failed and ruined the engine.

They've said its not worth even submitting to Mondial as it must have been driven very hard, and have charged me £2400 and left me with an M5 in pieces liberally spread over their workshop. I think it'll be at least another £8k to get back on the road with a recon engine!

I've now done a lot of reading and realised a lot of engines have this problem. Has anybody claimed through Mondial or can anybody suggest if i may have a case? I really appreciate any insight - been a very stressful couple of weeks!


Wills2

22,669 posts

174 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
So they have charged you £2400 to tell you what the issue is and then told you not to claim on the warranty as the car must have been driven hard?! As long as it has been serviced on the button then why can't you claim?

Good luck but I would be going bananas at them, I'd want a full repair and £2400 paid less any excess...

Call Mondial.



Edited by Wills2 on Sunday 26th July 16:59

Khaki Suit

500 posts

163 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Loads of the American owners are changing them out. Seems a common problem and I would be all over BMW/Mondial to get it sorted.

Lazyjames

Original Poster:

17 posts

104 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
What the garage said was that they'd need to strip the engine further down before contacting warranty - the £2400 has got the engine out and sump off. They said they could go further into the engine, but my bill would go up at £130 an hour and warranty still wouldn't pay due to the worn bearings!

Really glad i checked the forums this weekend, looks like i have a busy day tomorrow on the phone!

AW10

4,422 posts

248 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Your service history needs to be 100% spot on - any gaps or missing stamps and Mondial will wriggle out.

Your dealer is doing you no favours at all by not even trying to fight your corner. I feel like they're trying to milk you by getting you to pay up as they'll get more money out of you than they will out on Mondial. I believe Mondial only pays them £65/hour and they are getting double that out of you?

How many miles on the car?

A call to Mondial is probably the next step.

jonah35

3,940 posts

156 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
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Ouch. Main dealer prices!

Sorry to hear it.

This is, however, why air cooled Porsches and so on appreciate and why these just stick languishing in the classifieds week after week with no one buying them.

180 miles per tank and so many issues just put so many off.

I'd certainly contact the warranty company and,Malmö if you bought it from a dealer I'd contact the dealer.

Lazyjames

Original Poster:

17 posts

104 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Thanks for all the advice so far, much appreciated. As pointed out, its felt like the dealer has tried their hardest to squeeze as much money out of me as possible.

The car has 81k, it has a full bmw history which the dealer (Westerly) checked before they took the engine out to make sure there were no gaps in case it was a warranty repair.

The last main dealer oil service was only 2000 miles ago with no problems reported and a clean health check. I'm really surprised there weren't any flecks of metal considering how bad the bearings are now.

I bought the car privately and put on 800 miles over the 5 weeks i had it before it died on me, plus the previous owner had just had a sensor changed at a main dealer a few days before he sold it and again there was a clear health check.

The dealer have said they very rarely deal with any M cars, so i'm sure their lack of experience hasn't helped.

I understood the risks of the V10, but thought a full history and comp Mondial warranty would cover me for the majority of scenarios.

I guess i'll find out in the morning when i start by calling Mondial.

Beedub

1,954 posts

225 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Lazyjames said:
Thanks for all the advice so far, much appreciated. As pointed out, its felt like the dealer has tried their hardest to squeeze as much money out of me as possible.

The car has 81k, it has a full bmw history which the dealer (Westerly) checked before they took the engine out to make sure there were no gaps in case it was a warranty repair.

The last main dealer oil service was only 2000 miles ago with no problems reported and a clean health check. I'm really surprised there weren't any flecks of metal considering how bad the bearings are now.

I bought the car privately and put on 800 miles over the 5 weeks i had it before it died on me, plus the previous owner had just had a sensor changed at a main dealer a few days before he sold it and again there was a clear health check.

The dealer have said they very rarely deal with any M cars, so i'm sure their lack of experience hasn't helped.

I understood the risks of the V10, but thought a full history and comp Mondial warranty would cover me for the majority of scenarios.

I guess i'll find out in the morning when i start by calling Mondial.
this is a very real ///M problem, and its not limited to your engine at all.... infact most of the recent ///M engines are doing this to a worrying degree. With what your saying, this needs to be thrashed out now with mondial, you have every right to expect a payout, full service history , full details, so get onto them and don't accept no, first thing id be doing is getting that car out of the dealer and too a specialist or back home, that dealer with a lack of knowledge will really hurt this process imo and may even try to deliberately F you over.

RS Grant

1,416 posts

232 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Beedub said:
Lazyjames said:
Thanks for all the advice so far, much appreciated. As pointed out, its felt like the dealer has tried their hardest to squeeze as much money out of me as possible.

The car has 81k, it has a full bmw history which the dealer (Westerly) checked before they took the engine out to make sure there were no gaps in case it was a warranty repair.

The last main dealer oil service was only 2000 miles ago with no problems reported and a clean health check. I'm really surprised there weren't any flecks of metal considering how bad the bearings are now.

I bought the car privately and put on 800 miles over the 5 weeks i had it before it died on me, plus the previous owner had just had a sensor changed at a main dealer a few days before he sold it and again there was a clear health check.

The dealer have said they very rarely deal with any M cars, so i'm sure their lack of experience hasn't helped.

I understood the risks of the V10, but thought a full history and comp Mondial warranty would cover me for the majority of scenarios.

I guess i'll find out in the morning when i start by calling Mondial.
this is a very real ///M problem, and its not limited to your engine at all.... infact most of the recent ///M engines are doing this to a worrying degree. With what your saying, this needs to be thrashed out now with mondial, you have every right to expect a payout, full service history , full details, so get onto them and don't accept no, first thing id be doing is getting that car out of the dealer and too a specialist or back home, that dealer with a lack of knowledge will really hurt this process imo and may even try to deliberately F you over.
Completely agree with this... interested to hear how this turns out, but on the face of it, I see no reason why you wouldn't get a claim accepted for this?!


Cheers,
Grant

Patrick Bateman

12,143 posts

173 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Why would worn bearings be any justifiable reason to not pay out?? Surely that's the exact reason you'd want a warranty, it isn't normal wear and tear at 80k miles to lead to engine failure.

And driven hard? An M car driven hard? Who'd have thought! rolleyes

Edited by Patrick Bateman on Sunday 26th July 20:07

Cemesis

771 posts

161 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Call BMW UK and explain the problem, that the dealer checked the service history before doing anything, that you expect it to be covered and that you wish to make a complaint against the dealership.

Schermerhorn

4,342 posts

188 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
If the dealer knew this was going to be the result (trust me they did.....as soon as the car went into the dealership!) then why the **** did they even touch it in the first place?

The first thing they should have done - like any decent, self respecting dealer - is to ring the warranty company and ask if it would have been covered. Instead, they opened it up and then decided to shaft you for £2400 probably knowing full well the warranty company would have copped out of it.

Ring them tomorrow and say your solicitor will be contacting them and that you've spoken to Jane Noble at BMW.

Here are some useful email addresses

jane.noble@bmw.co.uk

Graeme.Grieve@bmw.co.uk

Matthew.Bacon@bmw.co.uk

Nick.Sharman@bmw.co.uk

Debbie.Prince@bmw.co.uk


These are all top brass at BMW UK. Write to them and tell them your greivances.

Jane Noble is where you'd get the best response from but try the others too.

Watch them squirm after that. Also ask to speak directly to the manager of the dealership. Tell him (or her) in no uncertain terms why you are f*cked off with them and they your solicitor will be speaking to HIM directly.

My M6 was in and out of the dealership during my ownership (mostly due to lack of dealership knowledge and code deleting rather than fixing the problem properly) that I wanted to reject the car. They refused to take it it back so I threatened legal action and in the end I got a nice payout from Sytner Leicester (still can't discuss details I'm afraid, condfidentiality b*llocks and all that) after persisting.

Do NOT back down.




Edited by Schermerhorn on Sunday 26th July 21:34

daz05

2,904 posts

194 months

Sunday 26th July 2015
quotequote all
Worth pointing out that if you took the warranty out rather than this being an annual policy transferred from the previous owner, your ts and cs state that you can't claim for anything in the first month (iirc) from beginning the policy. You're 5 weeks which is cutting it extremely fine.

If your warranty doesn't pay out I think you best port of call is getting it to an independent because the dealership you are using sound like a disgrace.

Good luck.

Shaoxter

4,048 posts

123 months

Monday 27th July 2015
quotequote all
daz05 said:
Worth pointing out that if you took the warranty out rather than this being an annual policy transferred from the previous owner, your ts and cs state that you can't claim for anything in the first month (iirc) from beginning the policy. You're 5 weeks which is cutting it extremely fine.
Good point but he said the issue occurred just over a month after he got the car so it's fine. 5 weeks is the same as 5 years in this case.

Things like this is exactly why you want a warranty in the first place, you should fully expect a payout. But out of interest have you been thrashing the car from cold?

rassi

2,447 posts

250 months

Monday 27th July 2015
quotequote all
You bought the car privately, with a Mondial warranty carried over from the previous owner and the dealer acknowledged that the warranty (even if you are only 5 weeks into ownership) is still running?

In that case, there should be no question whatsoever asked, they pulled the engine, opened it up and found rod bearings that are toast, which may or rather may not be attributed to "hard driving", which is of no relevance to the case, as it has a FSH, and Mondial should simply pick up the bill.

Fail to understand why the dealer would not want to explore a warranty claim and the associated repairs, which should be a win win for them?

Either way, stand your ground, leave the car with them and do not move to an independent, and make the relevant calls/emails, raising it with the dealer principal, as this is warranty case by all accounts.

Lazyjames

Original Poster:

17 posts

104 months

Monday 27th July 2015
quotequote all
I took the warranty out the day i bought the car, as I didn't want to risk running without one. Mondial have confirmed that the warranty is live and applicable for the date that the car first went into limp home mode and gave vanos faults, then got recovered to them by the AA.

I always let the car heat up before going over 3k rpm, as I have since owning turbo cars a long time ago.

I've spoken to Mondial, who have said they need a claim from the dealer before they can action or discuss anything.

I've spoken to the service dept in the dealer, where the only tech who worked on my car is away for 10 days on holiday and the warranty lady is away training until Thursday. The service receptionist restated that the tech said the worn bearings were likely caused by low oil or hard driving at some point in its life and not warranty work in his opinion. One of the first things the tech did when the car arrived was remove the oil, there was 8.5 litres in there, plus he said to me he thought the damage hadn't happened in the short time when i was using the car.

I think my next step is to speak to BMW direct, as I can see this being pushed into the long grass for a couple of weeks by the dealer, especially since i've already paid the £2400.

rassi

2,447 posts

250 months

Monday 27th July 2015
quotequote all
Very strange that you would have to pay 2400 £ upfront before it was determined that it was NOT a warranty claim? And how can the tech speculate that the car had been driven hard or had low oil sometime during its life? Pure speculation, and something a second owner of course could never know?!

You need to stand your ground, and make sure that the dealer submits a warranty claim ASAP and that they pay you back your money as well, completely absurd situation.

daz05

2,904 posts

194 months

Monday 27th July 2015
quotequote all
Good news that you have these things confirmed. However, you really need the dealer to fight your case here, they don't appear to be acting in your best interests at the moment. Do you know if the previous owner had a Mondial policy, as from their point of view a claim this large could look suspicious?

Edited by daz05 on Monday 27th July 10:11

Shaoxter

4,048 posts

123 months

Monday 27th July 2015
quotequote all
The car takes approx 9.2 litres of oil, so you'd only get a low oil message at 8.2-8.4L. I don't think 8.5L would be considered low oil.

Lazyjames

Original Poster:

17 posts

104 months

Monday 27th July 2015
quotequote all
When the sump was taken off and they pulled the bearing the tech then decided it wasn't a warranty job and i was left to pay the £2400. Up to that point they had said if it was a warranty job then i would only need to pay the £250 excess.

As i said, the car had literally just come out of a main dealer 2 days before I bought it with a clean bill of health, it had a main dealer oil service 2000 miles ago, plus i still have the ebay ad i bought the car from, where the car is sold in good health etc. I guess they can also see on the computer when the codes first started, which should clear up any confusion about whether this is a new fault or one carried over from a previous owner.

I'm in the process of writing an email to Jane Noble and Tim Abbott at BMW UK, to make them aware of the situation and ensure i'm ready for the dealerships next move when the warranty lady returns