Skipping The Queues at Traffic Lights

[skahigh]

Admittedly I've only been doing this a year and def. still learning but, as I started commuting on the bike a bit I wanted to make sure I was making progress while not being inconsiderate to other road users.

Had a good read of this and a few other sites and now tend to position the bike between vehicles 1 and 2, sometimes slightly to the side if there is not enough room to get directly in-between but certainly close enough that vehicle 2 can't possibly fail to see me.

I never pass the first vehicle unless there is room be at least a little in front without going in to the cycle box.

I think car drivers are much less likely to get wound up and do silly things if they think you are obeying the same rules they are (not entering the cycle box) and are willing to be patient (by not trying to pass every single vehicle in the queue).

[Wedg1e]

Moulder said:

when looking over my shoulder a few seconds after setting off after the lights change I am always surprised quite how little progress cars have made.

What is there to be surprised about? 100 BHP bike weighing 200Kg versus 100bhp car weighing 1300Kg, not much to ponder there... plus you're expecting to launch when the lights change, they're taking the kids to dance lessons and thinking about what to have for tea.

[toxgobbler]

zonkkk said:

If there are traffic lights, I always go in front of the first car so they can see me.
If there is a queue at a junction with no traffic lights I always stop between the first and second car.
I don't want to obstruct the first car driver's view.

This.

[CaptainMorgan]

I dont do a huge amount of filtering, locally if I do the lanes are pretty generous size wise so I'll sit between the front car (or two on a dual carriageway) but ahead a little so they can see me clearly. Roundabouts I dont tend to bother unless the queue is huge, then I'll just filter to the front then nip in a decent gap as I near the front.

When I've visited London I've always been weary of going in the cycle boxes, last time I read it was the same offence as jumping a light, I dont fancy getting that on my licence.

I'm not the most confident filterer though tbh, I guess partly because I dont do it that much.

[jjones]

Always go to the front, either between cars or if there is the gap at the front for cyclists I pull into that.

Dump the clutch on amber and hang on

[jjones]

CaptainMorgan said:

When I've visited London I've always been weary of going in the cycle boxes, last time I read it was the same offence as jumping a light, I dont fancy getting that on my licence.

Quick google says £100 fine but no mention of points, will take my chances

[CaptainMorgan]

jjones said:

Quick google says £100 fine but no mention of points, will take my chances

http://content.met.police.uk/Article/Advanced-Stop-Lines/1400018009433/1400018009433

I'm assuming thats a UK wide rule but couldnt say for sure.

[Fastdruid]

sjtscott said:

Basically the golden rule is if you are pulling in front of anything stationary in London get the f**k on with it away from the lights when they change! Its called the london brisk getaway - which might be called a almost semi racing start in more sleepy parts of the UK.

This regardless of where you are. Nothing I hate more when in the car than someone who pulls to the front on a bike and then dawdles. You want to filter, do it but don't then hold people up.

When the roles are reversed and I'm on the bike it's TLGP every set of lights and I'll launch it like I'm on the drag strip. Only things to beat me have been other bikes and decently quick cars when I've been on a 50cc! bks that a car will keep up to 30. Nothing outside of a supercar being properly launched should be able to keep up with even a 600. 0-30 times in 1 to 1.5 seconds. Even a junior supercar will only just have made it 30 by the time a bike is already doing 60...

[Fastdruid]

moto_traxport said:

olly22n said:

Or in between first and second, and get a jump on them at the lights.

I was never shy in filtering and queue jumping, probably best that I don't road ride anymore tbh

Exactly this. You don't wind up the car at the front by "blocking" him. If he's steady off the line just pop him in the first couple of yards, if he wants a race then let him win up to the next thing in 50 yards and sail past.

My method works in Normaltown but in London you might be overrun by other motorbikes. In London of course you should be on a pushbike and treat the whole Highway Code thing like it doesn't apply to you - which of course it doesn't.

Quite a few years back part of my commute used to take me down an 6 lane 40mph A-road with traffic lights every few hundred yards. I used to love filtering to the front, *nailing* it off the line up to 40mph, then sticking at the speed limit. All the cars would come sailing past me doing 50+ about 50-100yards before the next set of lights which were inevitably on red. Filter to the front once again passing both the cars that had over taken me and a bunch more and repeat. Only thing faster than me down that road was a girl on a GSXR1000.

[darkyoung1000]

Pulling to the front can definitely antagonise car drivers.... A couple of weeks ago I was deliberately nudged by a pr1ck in a car having filtered between two lanes of stationary traffic (both going straight on) to join a roundabout.
We both waited for the traffic (nice VX220) to clear the roundabout....and then he rammed me. Punted me across the traffic lane to my left which luckily hadn't started moving.
I was not best pleased.

[creampuff]

bass gt3 said:

Just stay to the side. as soon as the lights change you'll be 50 meters up the road before he driver knows what's happened.
Pulling in front can sometimes antagonise people despite the fact they won't see the going of you.

+1 on this.

There are other advantages too:
- it is legal (not that you are likely to get pulled for going over the stop line a little, but this way it is 100% legal)
- it gives you time to check the junction is clear when the light goes green, something the person in the vehicle next to you may not do
- on the very rare occasions when the vehicle next to you boots it, you are in no obligation to get out of their way

[creampuff]

rat840771 said:

I think I'll adopt the front wheel in box technique.

The offence is crossing the solid stop line on a red light or amber light where you could have reasonably stopped. A front wheel in the box is just as much an offence as the whole bike in the box. Personally, like I wrote above, I can make the same progress by staying behind the stop line and riding legally, so why do something which is not legal when there is no benefit to it.

[black-k1]

creampuff said:

bass gt3 said:

Just stay to the side. as soon as the lights change you'll be 50 meters up the road before he driver knows what's happened.
Pulling in front can sometimes antagonise people despite the fact they won't see the going of you.

+1 on this.

There are other advantages too:
- it is legal (not that you are likely to get pulled for going over the stop line a little, but this way it is 100% legal)
- it gives you time to check the junction is clear when the light goes green, something the person in the vehicle next to you may not do
- on the very rare occasions when the vehicle next to you boots it, you are in no obligation to get out of their way

The problem with this approach, and it has happened to me, is that you can take off quickly (but not at GP launch speed) thinking you’re going to leave the car behind, only to find that half way across the junction, the car is still beside you. You’re now heading towards the island/oncoming traffic, with insufficient space to safely get passed the car, leaving you the only option of braking and hoping you can drop in behind.

As most normal road junctions are only 10m to 15m wide you have to be sure that you are safely passed the car in about 8m to 12m. For the vast majority of cars that are slow off the line, that’s not a problem. For the chav’d up Corsa that’s revving the nuts of waiting for the lights to change, that’s not a problem either. The problem comes when a reasonably powerful car is sat their quietly thus you don’t do the full GP racing start, but they then really decide to go for it. In the first 4m to 5m you’ll move that bike length forward relative to them so that you (but not the back half of your bike), are just in front of their bonnet and thus they’re out of your peripheral vision. They’ll then match your acceleration for the next 4 to 5 m where you’re now at decision point to pull over into their lane but have no space to do so.

Drivers may feel put out by you moving in front of them but if it’s the safer option (for me and for them) then I’ll happy live with their slight disgruntlement. After all, if they are not moving you haven’t made them change their speed or path and if you get out of the way quickly, you haven’t held them up. Their disgruntlement is nothing more than an ego dent.

creampuff said:

rat840771 said:

I think I'll adopt the front wheel in box technique.

The offence is crossing the solid stop line on a red light or amber light where you could have reasonably stopped. A front wheel in the box is just as much an offence as the whole bike in the box. Personally, like I wrote above, I can make the same progress by staying behind the stop line and riding legally, so why do something which is not legal when there is no benefit to it.

If going over the line or into the puff box is an issue for you then the safest option is to filter up to just behind the first car and position yourself in front of the second car. You have then safely claimed your space in the queue and can take the car in front when it is safe and appropriate to do so.

In the scenarios I have described above, you are in charge of the situation and you are making the decisions. You are not dependant on others doing or not doing something. At the point when you are depending on someone else to do or not do something, you are handing responsibility for your safety to another road user. Not something I would want to do.

[ShaunTheSheep]

There's a lot of talk on this thread about slotting in between the 1st and 2nd cars. As a newbie game to try anything once... How are you doing this?

At every set of lights with traffic last night there was no where for me to slot in. I could push a wheel in but there's no way I could fit my bike. Are you sitting at the side?

[black-k1]

ShaunTheSheep said:

There's a lot of talk on this thread about slotting in between the 1st and 2nd cars. As a newbie game to try anything once... How are you doing this?

At every set of lights with traffic last night there was no where for me to slot in. I could push a wheel in but there's no way I could fit my bike. Are you sitting at the side?

You only need to get enough of you/the bike infront of car to stop it moving until you move. A wheel is more than enough. It's also why it is recommended that you stop with your left leg down, so it the bike is leaning into the path of the car.

[Moulder]

ShaunTheSheep said:

There's a lot of talk on this thread about slotting in between the 1st and 2nd cars. As a newbie game to try anything once... How are you doing this?

At every set of lights with traffic last night there was no where for me to slot in. I could push a wheel in but there's no way I could fit my bike. Are you sitting at the side?

My understanding of this is that you are alongside both, e.g. filter to the front(ish) so you stop with your foot peg level with the back of the front car. If the front one boots it it is unlikely the second one will so you slot in behind the first one, if the first one is napping you accelerate away into the lead/first.

[Moulder]

Wedg1e said:

Moulder said:

when looking over my shoulder a few seconds after setting off after the lights change I am always surprised quite how little progress cars have made.

What is there to be surprised about? 100 BHP bike weighing 200Kg versus 100bhp car weighing 1300Kg, not much to ponder there... plus you're expecting to launch when the lights change, they're taking the kids to dance lessons and thinking about what to have for tea.

See exactly what you are saying here, I don't have kids and eat out most nights so it was always going to be a foregone conclusion.

[LeadFarmer]

I stay in-between the two cars. Would never angle myself to be blocking one of the cars, what if I stall (obviously i never do!) and the car hasn't realised, pulls forward and contacts with me? Surely its best to not put yourself in the line of the other car?

[bogie]

Moulder said:

ShaunTheSheep said:

There's a lot of talk on this thread about slotting in between the 1st and 2nd cars. As a newbie game to try anything once... How are you doing this?

At every set of lights with traffic last night there was no where for me to slot in. I could push a wheel in but there's no way I could fit my bike. Are you sitting at the side?

My understanding of this is that you are alongside both, e.g. filter to the front(ish) so you stop with your foot peg level with the back of the front car. If the front one boots it it is unlikely the second one will so you slot in behind the first one, if the first one is napping you accelerate away into the lead/first.

Yeah, thats my strategy too. Filtering is always risk versus reward whilst keeping safe, and not making a nuisance of yourself

[Jazoli]

Straight to the front, over the line if necessary, then set off at usual speed, works for me, I couldn't care less if I piss car drivers off, I'm long gone.

I wish I could commute on the bike, I'm stuck in a van through the week trying my best to make it hard for bikes to filter past and not letting anybody merge.