RE: Mazda MX-5 vs Toyota GT86
Discussion
NDNDNDND said:
In my experience, the main problem with non-PAS these days is most people (even on here!) think a car without PAS is undriveable.
Can't speak for anyone else, but my old Griff was a handful - on track at least - would've been way better with PAS. Steering was too heavy and slow to catch once I'd (almost) lost it. Clearly this is partly down to my own limitations, but power and/or quicker rack would've helped.mikeock64 said:
daemon said:
Fair point.
Its the same length as a 370z, and close to the same width, yet the 370z packs near 130BHP more and has a 3.7 litre v6 beneath its similarly proportioned bonnet.
I had hankered after a 370z black edition since they came out. So the time came to make the purchase. I took a test drive and hated it. The need for a V6 was dampened by terrible road noise from the tyres and when the windows were rolled down the wind noise drowned out the engine note. I wanted to love this car. My next choice was the BRZ. Drove it , loved it, never fear putting fuel in it. It's a fun car that you can travel miles in. Its the same length as a 370z, and close to the same width, yet the 370z packs near 130BHP more and has a 3.7 litre v6 beneath its similarly proportioned bonnet.
See one in the flesh and drive it on a good test drive. I've had mine nearly 2 years and still love it.
Bit like the '86
Edited by liner33 on Tuesday 25th August 14:29
LordGrover said:
.... I doubt very much there's 30kgs let alone 100kgs to save and still have a desirable car.
Hm, wasn't expecting that -- but if you say so. IMO still worth doing a 'ClubSport' since it should be pretty cheap to whip up and 30kg is at least a start. I think a more focused version is what people are looking for right after a factory option for more horses (let's not go there again please 
). ORD said:
30kg is the difference between a thin driver and a fat driver. Not really worth a new version!
although Lotus have the CR version with less weight saving (27kg i think on Elise. Within that small market it has a pull.Even then the savings are a lighter battery (don't park for a long w/end), and no roof, no A/C. So quite drastic really. Admittedly the Elise has few other bits too lose!
mikeock64 said:
I had hankered after a 370z black edition since they came out. So the time came to make the purchase. I took a test drive and hated it. The need for a V6 was dampened by terrible road noise from the tyres and when the windows were rolled down the wind noise drowned out the engine note. I wanted to love this car. My next choice was the BRZ. Drove it , loved it, never fear putting fuel in it. It's a fun car that you can travel miles in.
See one in the flesh and drive it on a good test drive. I've had mine nearly 2 years and still love it.
Have to agree with the road noise on the 370. first thing I noticed, and the noise of the stones flicking up just behind my head.See one in the flesh and drive it on a good test drive. I've had mine nearly 2 years and still love it.
It feels special to drive, a strange driving position sat down low, visibility is rubbish out the back, but then so is a Lamborghini Countach and I would love one of them too.
Fuel costs are what you expect for a car with 326 bhp and high road tax too.
I still have no regrets buying mine.
mikeock64 said:
I had hankered after a 370z black edition since they came out. So the time came to make the purchase. I took a test drive and hated it. The need for a V6 was dampened by terrible road noise from the tyres and when the windows were rolled down the wind noise drowned out the engine note. I wanted to love this car. My next choice was the BRZ. Drove it , loved it, never fear putting fuel in it. It's a fun car that you can travel miles in.
See one in the flesh and drive it on a good test drive. I've had mine nearly 2 years and still love it.
I had the same issues with my 350Z. It had a fruity exhaust but even still you could barely hear it over the racket caused by the open window wind and road noise above 50mph. There were other little things as well, like if you have the window down whilst driving along and do a windscreen wash/wipe you get soaked. Overall the car felt very cheaply made, but I concluded I shouldn’t have been surprised by this given the limited market and hence the low volumes Nissan had anticipated to sell. There’s no way they’d be investing the many millions into the R&D they would with the Primera for example. This is something I’d be cautious about with the GT86 as it’s a very similar proposition, whereas Mazda know they’re onto a winner with the MX5 and will have invested accordingly.See one in the flesh and drive it on a good test drive. I've had mine nearly 2 years and still love it.
kambites said:
I think one problem with non-PAS on modern cars is that the cabins tend to have been designed around very small steering wheels.
Could well be a problem, the E30 e.g. still had PAS as an option and the standard steering wheel was 38 or 40 cm in diameter. No problems with the controls, just a bit of a workout when parking (Touring 325i on stock wheels).Robert Elise said:
Although Lotus have the CR version with less weight saving (27kg i think on Elise. Within that small market it has a pull.
Yeah, I think it would still be worth doing, even if only as marketing / cost reduction exercise. Perhaps a bit more weight can be squeezed out, and it is just enough to get on the virtuous circle? Our low cost BRZ option in Germany e.g. gets the diff removed and has solid brakes at the rear. Makes it a bit lighter, but not really attractive as the price and weight difference isn't very big. Would be a better proposition if it was that additional 30-40 kg lighter and an additional 1-2k less expensive.
Having more power is fine, if that's what you want, but too many drivers think that more power and more technology make you a better driver, they don't.
The article is correct that there is only so much power that is any use on a public road and that you are better off having a well set up car than adding power. Personally I've always been very happy with low powered but excellently handling RWD, FWD and 4WD cars, i'm not saying I wouldn't buy a 5 litre Jag F-Type if I could afford one but I wouldn't imagine it would be more fun than what I've had before.
I am sure there are plenty of people who think sticking 400+bhp in a FWD Ford is ok and will argue the point till they die but I tend to disagree
The article is correct that there is only so much power that is any use on a public road and that you are better off having a well set up car than adding power. Personally I've always been very happy with low powered but excellently handling RWD, FWD and 4WD cars, i'm not saying I wouldn't buy a 5 litre Jag F-Type if I could afford one but I wouldn't imagine it would be more fun than what I've had before.
I am sure there are plenty of people who think sticking 400+bhp in a FWD Ford is ok and will argue the point till they die but I tend to disagree
nottyash said:
Discounts apply to the car and options.
Why would you want an auto sport car?Most are manual and as for colour, the red looks great.
Each to his own. I hate operating clutches. Of course I would still use the paddles.Why would you want an auto sport car?Most are manual and as for colour, the red looks great.
Around 1/3 of the GT86 sales are for the auto version.
Autos are very common for Porsche Boxsters and many other Sports Cars.
As for colour, maybe it's an age thing. I like discrete colours, rather then Police magnets! There is a nice used GT86 for sale near me, but I could not bear the Orange colour - just embarrassing.
zpat said:
Each to his own. I hate operating clutches. Of course I would still use the paddles.
Around 1/3 of the GT86 sales are for the auto version.
Autos are very common for Porsche Boxsters and many other Sports Cars.
As for colour, maybe it's an age thing. I like discrete colours, rather then Police magnets! There is a nice used GT86 for sale near me, but I could not bear the Orange colour - just embarrassing.
Where did you get the one third figure from? I'd genuinely be amazed if that's the case. The auto is not good in the 86 / brz at all!Around 1/3 of the GT86 sales are for the auto version.
Autos are very common for Porsche Boxsters and many other Sports Cars.
As for colour, maybe it's an age thing. I like discrete colours, rather then Police magnets! There is a nice used GT86 for sale near me, but I could not bear the Orange colour - just embarrassing.
zpat said:
Each to his own. I hate operating clutches. Of course I would still use the paddles.
Around 1/3 of the GT86 sales are for the auto version.
Autos are very common for Porsche Boxsters and many other Sports Cars.
As for colour, maybe it's an age thing. I like discrete colours, rather then Police magnets! There is a nice used GT86 for sale near me, but I could not bear the Orange colour - just embarrassing.
Most Boxster were not Auto at all.That's nonsense.Around 1/3 of the GT86 sales are for the auto version.
Autos are very common for Porsche Boxsters and many other Sports Cars.
As for colour, maybe it's an age thing. I like discrete colours, rather then Police magnets! There is a nice used GT86 for sale near me, but I could not bear the Orange colour - just embarrassing.
I've had a Boxster S and wouldn't want the driver experience ruined by an auto box.
I personally enjoy driving, and have been operating a clutch pedal for27 years and love it.
The fact is discounts are not just for red cars, but all cars and extras.
So what's a discrete colour on a Gt86 which stands out as a sports car in any colour??
nottyash said:
Most Boxster were not Auto at all.That's nonsense.
I've had a Boxster S and wouldn't want the driver experience ruined by an auto box.
I personally enjoy driving, and have been operating a clutch pedal for27 years and love it.
The fact is discounts are not just for red cars, but all cars and extras.
So what's a discrete colour on a Gt86 which stands out as a sports car in any colour??
Not sure about that. I imagine most 981 Boxsters are PDK by quite some margin! Been the case for a while.I've had a Boxster S and wouldn't want the driver experience ruined by an auto box.
I personally enjoy driving, and have been operating a clutch pedal for27 years and love it.
The fact is discounts are not just for red cars, but all cars and extras.
So what's a discrete colour on a Gt86 which stands out as a sports car in any colour??
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