Lack of private sales! Is it a porsche/expensive car thing?
Discussion
I try and avoid car dealers where ever possible for both buying and selling, so yes I feel your grievance.
I found it best to set-up alerts on PH and Autotrader so that I didn't have to waste time checking every day.
All the best cars swap handles privately, and they are frequently the cheapest. Keep at it!
P.s. think it took me at least 3 months for me to find my Cayman which isn't too bad as its taken me over 6 in the past.
I found it best to set-up alerts on PH and Autotrader so that I didn't have to waste time checking every day.
All the best cars swap handles privately, and they are frequently the cheapest. Keep at it!
P.s. think it took me at least 3 months for me to find my Cayman which isn't too bad as its taken me over 6 in the past.
The private sales scene has been screwed up by a number of factors. A more capable individual than I could probably write either a sociological or economic thesis on it.
It's a combination of best price bro texts, WBAC convenience, easy finance, lazy buyers, fibbing sellers and a multitude of other contributors.
Net result is that the private sales scene is all but dead. Not entirely but it has changed significantly.
It's a combination of best price bro texts, WBAC convenience, easy finance, lazy buyers, fibbing sellers and a multitude of other contributors.
Net result is that the private sales scene is all but dead. Not entirely but it has changed significantly.
I've just sold a car private (half the value you are looking at)
the three strongest bids I got were from traders - all within 5% to 6% of my asking price - in the end a trader bought it unseen, sent a driver to confirm and collect (money in the bank while he collected)
Very little interest from private buyers..in fact one PH'er kept telling me it was worth £3k less than the three confirmed trade bids I had (£4.5k less than asking)
I think this is a new modern era..10 years ago I sold a 11 month old 997 C2S for within £3k (5%) what an OPC would sell for, sold in 48 hours (private buyer), over the years sold 3 further Porsches and a £30k Audi (all to private buyers).
Sad reality is in many cases traders are now better buyers than private customers.....
PS are you looking for a gen 2 997 TT or gen 1 ?? £55k is top money for a gen 1 and shy of what you need for a gen 2
the three strongest bids I got were from traders - all within 5% to 6% of my asking price - in the end a trader bought it unseen, sent a driver to confirm and collect (money in the bank while he collected)
Very little interest from private buyers..in fact one PH'er kept telling me it was worth £3k less than the three confirmed trade bids I had (£4.5k less than asking)
I think this is a new modern era..10 years ago I sold a 11 month old 997 C2S for within £3k (5%) what an OPC would sell for, sold in 48 hours (private buyer), over the years sold 3 further Porsches and a £30k Audi (all to private buyers).
Sad reality is in many cases traders are now better buyers than private customers.....
PS are you looking for a gen 2 997 TT or gen 1 ?? £55k is top money for a gen 1 and shy of what you need for a gen 2
forgot to add
WBAC doesn't help (with mis-setting private buyers expectations)
all three trade bids I had were c£3k higher than WBAC valuation
however cuts both ways..
I've just bought (from a trader) a Porsche , this was to all intensive purposes a OPC quality car, one owner, sub 20k miles, 3.5 years old, still under warranty , very high spec
Nearest thing on the Porsche web site is £39,995k (and thats got twice the mileage)...the customer PX at his local non Porsche dealer for very early £30's....
This must have been an easy £35k private sale ---perhaps the customer just didn't think it worth the risk for the extra £3k to £4k ?? needless to say I had to give the trader some margin, for doing pretty much bugger all
WBAC doesn't help (with mis-setting private buyers expectations)
all three trade bids I had were c£3k higher than WBAC valuation
however cuts both ways..
I've just bought (from a trader) a Porsche , this was to all intensive purposes a OPC quality car, one owner, sub 20k miles, 3.5 years old, still under warranty , very high spec
Nearest thing on the Porsche web site is £39,995k (and thats got twice the mileage)...the customer PX at his local non Porsche dealer for very early £30's....
This must have been an easy £35k private sale ---perhaps the customer just didn't think it worth the risk for the extra £3k to £4k ?? needless to say I had to give the trader some margin, for doing pretty much bugger all
I'd much rather deal with the owner of the car. How they describe it and their use over the years, body-language, their feelings about the car and the intricate details only an owner can tell you about. All of this is missing when buying from a dealer. I also want them to take me for a drive first so that I have an understanding of how they treated the car; is it properly warmed up before use, mechanical sympathy...
A dealer is merely the middleman and has absolutely no idea how a car has been used and treated and as such adds zero value for me. The only positives I can think of are the prep-work may be of a higher order, finance offers or a warranty (which often doesn't stand up when needed).
Generally speaking, for my more interesting cars, I always try to by from an enthusiast; they are normally very open and honest. The passion they have for the car and the way they have looked after it is what I value.
A dealer is merely the middleman and has absolutely no idea how a car has been used and treated and as such adds zero value for me. The only positives I can think of are the prep-work may be of a higher order, finance offers or a warranty (which often doesn't stand up when needed).
Generally speaking, for my more interesting cars, I always try to by from an enthusiast; they are normally very open and honest. The passion they have for the car and the way they have looked after it is what I value.
Richie200 said:
I'd much rather deal with the owner of the car. How they describe it and their use over the years, body-language, their feelings about the car and the intricate details only an owner can tell you about. All of this is missing when buying from a dealer. I also want them to take me for a drive first so that I have an understanding of how they treated the car; is it properly warmed up before use, mechanical sympathy...
A dealer is merely the middleman and has absolutely no idea how a car has been used and treated and as such adds zero value for me. The only positives I can think of are the prep-work may be of a higher order, finance offers or a warranty (which often doesn't stand up when needed).
Generally speaking, for my more interesting cars, I always try to by from an enthusiast; they are normally very open and honest. The passion they have for the car and the way they have looked after it is what I value.
couldnt agree more, i bought my last car becuase i met the owner and he was competely OCD is everyway, you could tell he was so fussy about everything, didnt even let me sit in the car the first time i came to look at it !A dealer is merely the middleman and has absolutely no idea how a car has been used and treated and as such adds zero value for me. The only positives I can think of are the prep-work may be of a higher order, finance offers or a warranty (which often doesn't stand up when needed).
Generally speaking, for my more interesting cars, I always try to by from an enthusiast; they are normally very open and honest. The passion they have for the car and the way they have looked after it is what I value.
I dont really understand why people dont like buying Porsches privately, dealers do very well from them i think, not that they dont earn there money, it's just there is a nice margin in used Porsches for the likes of 911V etc to be able to offer a pretty good service. Funny i have tried selling all my previous porsches privately and never managed it, i have always sold them in the end to dealers
I've always found selling/buyer high value private cars the stumbling block; handing over 5 or 6 figure sums to an individual too risky! I sold my CR privately and whilst the transaction went smoothly (took buyer to bank, chaps transfer), it still carried significant stress arranging, and wondering whether I'd have to entertain the buyer for a few hours waiting for the funds to appear; thankfully it was instant this time and the buyer very nice, but if the margin of difference was small, I'd probably just buy/sell from a reputable dealer.
I fully agree that too little direct/private sales happen above 30k value.
There's definitely a "security/safety" concern on both sides of the deal. It's a lot of money and you don't want to be conned. But I considered a f430 purchase a few years back from a PHer and knowing he was a genuine petrolhead and being able to retrace ownership history through the forum I felt at ease. Didn't happen because of bad timing and me being overly hesitant Ferrari was the right move (regretted it ever since btw, would have been a fantastic deal and the car was the best I have ever seen advertised in F430 space).
I also like to get to know previous owner. When you buy from a dealer you know nothing about the person. "It has all stamps in the book sir". Is all they have to say. Often prep is limited to a detail and change of tyres.
That said a good dealer might have access to a client base a private seller simply doesn't have access to. I am pretty sure JZM would know who to call for a GT3 before the car even gets on their website.. But for a mainstream model a good alert on autotrader does the trick. That's how I bought my last car..
There's definitely a "security/safety" concern on both sides of the deal. It's a lot of money and you don't want to be conned. But I considered a f430 purchase a few years back from a PHer and knowing he was a genuine petrolhead and being able to retrace ownership history through the forum I felt at ease. Didn't happen because of bad timing and me being overly hesitant Ferrari was the right move (regretted it ever since btw, would have been a fantastic deal and the car was the best I have ever seen advertised in F430 space).
I also like to get to know previous owner. When you buy from a dealer you know nothing about the person. "It has all stamps in the book sir". Is all they have to say. Often prep is limited to a detail and change of tyres.
That said a good dealer might have access to a client base a private seller simply doesn't have access to. I am pretty sure JZM would know who to call for a GT3 before the car even gets on their website.. But for a mainstream model a good alert on autotrader does the trick. That's how I bought my last car..
Looking at it the other way around. I am currently trying to sell a car privately for £130k. Having trust in a potential buyer is not something I have given much thought to as the ad has only just gone up. Are there any tell-tale or less obvious signs that I should be looking out for (Obviously western Union or Zimbabwean dollar offering will not be given the time of day)? Just never been in this position before and for me it is like handing over my child to somebody; selling a car that you hold so dear.
I just sold my 2001 (pre-facelift) 996 privately. I had the usual trade buyers offering me £2k below asking, without even viewing it. I also had a fair few private buyers offering me silly money unseen.
But after 4 days,I had a genuine buyer who turned up within a few hours of calling and by the next day he drove it away having paid very close to asking price.
I have to say I had loads of interest, but dealing with a bunch of chancers over the first few days did wind me up. I guess many people aren't prepared to put up with this.
This experience taught me that good cars will always sell privately for good money and it's worth putting up with the tyre kickers (and in one case fraudster) to find a genuine buyer.
But after 4 days,I had a genuine buyer who turned up within a few hours of calling and by the next day he drove it away having paid very close to asking price.
I have to say I had loads of interest, but dealing with a bunch of chancers over the first few days did wind me up. I guess many people aren't prepared to put up with this.
This experience taught me that good cars will always sell privately for good money and it's worth putting up with the tyre kickers (and in one case fraudster) to find a genuine buyer.
UrbanAchiever said:
I just sold my 2001 (pre-facelift) 996 privately. I had the usual trade buyers offering me £2k below asking, without even viewing it. I also had a fair few private buyers offering me silly money unseen.
But after 4 days,I had a genuine buyer who turned up within a few hours of calling and by the next day he drove it away having paid very close to asking price.
I have to say I had loads of interest, but dealing with a bunch of chancers over the first few days did wind me up. I guess many people aren't prepared to put up with this.
This experience taught me that good cars will always sell privately for good money and it's worth putting up with the tyre kickers (and in one case fraudster) to find a genuine buyer.
Do you mind me asking where you advertised?But after 4 days,I had a genuine buyer who turned up within a few hours of calling and by the next day he drove it away having paid very close to asking price.
I have to say I had loads of interest, but dealing with a bunch of chancers over the first few days did wind me up. I guess many people aren't prepared to put up with this.
This experience taught me that good cars will always sell privately for good money and it's worth putting up with the tyre kickers (and in one case fraudster) to find a genuine buyer.
I managed a private sale of my 430 Scuderia recently. There was a huge gap between trade bids and trade asking/retail prices so I kept an eye on the forums and saw a chap who was thinking about buying and contacted him. I was after a value at the mid point of the range and that was markedly less than the trade retail so everyone came away happy.
We had a few good conversations, I sent him lots of pictures and copies of documents, the history/provenance was good and we were straightforward with each other etc and I suspect we both did our research on each other a bit. It's definitely possible.
We had a few good conversations, I sent him lots of pictures and copies of documents, the history/provenance was good and we were straightforward with each other etc and I suspect we both did our research on each other a bit. It's definitely possible.
In the era of linkedin /google/ facebook etc you can check most potential buyers /sellers out
I was interested in buying a r8 v10 Spyder a couple of months ago (from a private seller) quick google search of his mobile /name through up some lovely facebook info about the supercar hire business he ran
Also when I sold my previous Porsche, the buyer informed me my linkedin profile, confirming my role at a PLC reassured him, if I had 'ripped him off" at least he had a guaranteed way of contacting me.....
I was interested in buying a r8 v10 Spyder a couple of months ago (from a private seller) quick google search of his mobile /name through up some lovely facebook info about the supercar hire business he ran
Also when I sold my previous Porsche, the buyer informed me my linkedin profile, confirming my role at a PLC reassured him, if I had 'ripped him off" at least he had a guaranteed way of contacting me.....
I think it is difficult to consummate a trade with high value porsches exceeding 100k personally. I put my prized and well maintained porker with the specialist whom i have been going to for ages and they take a fee. They are also paid to answer questions and stop tyre kickers and time wasters. In terms of getting what i need and finding the right value, they are great.
I also do believe that the best specialists have access to private stock like myself who wouldn't just go to anyone to sell.
on the other spectrum, i bought a £25k car from a private seller the next day after the ad was placed.
I also do believe that the best specialists have access to private stock like myself who wouldn't just go to anyone to sell.
on the other spectrum, i bought a £25k car from a private seller the next day after the ad was placed.
Richie200 said:
Looking at it the other way around. I am currently trying to sell a car privately for £130k. Having trust in a potential buyer is not something I have given much thought to as the ad has only just gone up. Are there any tell-tale or less obvious signs that I should be looking out for (Obviously western Union or Zimbabwean dollar offering will not be given the time of day)? Just never been in this position before and for me it is like handing over my child to somebody; selling a car that you hold so dear.
Be suspicious if they are willing to come round and view a car like that in the dark. I had two blinged up African guys rock up in a 3 series at about 20.30 (which they parked right down the road) to see my 997.2 4S Cab which I had in Auto trader one March a few years ago.They walked around the car making all the right noises, then one of them got his mobile phone out, rang somebody up and asked to be put through to the 'General'..
"Put me through to thee General!" he kept saying impatiently.. "I want to speak to thee General..!"
After a few muffled sentences, he came off the phone and said he would by the car but could make money for the both of us. He offered to pay me about 10k MORE than I was asking, rip the individual he was supposedly buying the vehicle for and split the difference with me.
"Sorry guys, not going there" I reversed the car back into the garage, closed the door and away they went.
Never again.
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