Faulty Radiators / Sale of Goods Act
Discussion
We've a lot (maybe 20) cast iron radiators which are about 4 years old. They've almost all developed a fault and are leaking at the seals.
We purchased and had our plumber fit. The retailer has said we can have them sent back to the manufacturer to be reworked or replaced. It sounds like it's not an unexpected issue and sometimes the cast iron is just not perfect and we might have a bad batch.
The system is clean and well topped up with inhibitor etc. They were installed and moved per the manufacturer instructions.
That all sounds ok but the expense of getting them all drained and removed and new ones installed is looking a bit scary - probably a couple of grand. House all carpeted and many of the rads will need 4 people to move them. Will need pipes capped so we can still use some heating and we might be without the radiators for a good few weeks.
The retailer won't cover any of this cost. Reading the SOGA it sounds like we might be covered here? I think the issue might be the 4 years that have elapsed since purchase - however, with the manufacturer giving a 10 year guarantee, it would be "reasonable" to expect them to last more than 4?
Any help appreciated!
We purchased and had our plumber fit. The retailer has said we can have them sent back to the manufacturer to be reworked or replaced. It sounds like it's not an unexpected issue and sometimes the cast iron is just not perfect and we might have a bad batch.
The system is clean and well topped up with inhibitor etc. They were installed and moved per the manufacturer instructions.
That all sounds ok but the expense of getting them all drained and removed and new ones installed is looking a bit scary - probably a couple of grand. House all carpeted and many of the rads will need 4 people to move them. Will need pipes capped so we can still use some heating and we might be without the radiators for a good few weeks.
The retailer won't cover any of this cost. Reading the SOGA it sounds like we might be covered here? I think the issue might be the 4 years that have elapsed since purchase - however, with the manufacturer giving a 10 year guarantee, it would be "reasonable" to expect them to last more than 4?
Any help appreciated!
To have all the radiators removed and sent for repair would be a absolute nightmare.Would it be possible to have them repaired where they are now in your house.
Depending how they will be repaired could you ask the company if a person could come to your house to weld them or whatever and if they cannot do that in situ have a plumber and some help to remove the radiators one at a time and put back when repaired.
Depending how they will be repaired could you ask the company if a person could come to your house to weld them or whatever and if they cannot do that in situ have a plumber and some help to remove the radiators one at a time and put back when repaired.
Thanks. The retailer is basically just a shop. Their process is to send back to manufacturer who will probably repair all faulty units in one place.
From what I’ve found I think repairing radiators like these on-site would be a real nightmare. They have no means to do that anyway.
The retailer is only really interested in arranging a courier who would collect faulty ones from outside our house.
I’ve asked them to come out to inspect them or that they take 1 away to check it etc. but they seem to prefer getting them all at once.
The plumbing side in terms of disconnecting the pipes isn’t too terrible TBH – I’d cover that ok. It’s all the side effects of the work being done that I feel annoyed by. It will be a terrible job for the contractor to remove them all from the house without any damage from water. We bought what I understood was amongst the best of products – it’s bad enough to have the issue but feels like we’re left sorting it all out too.
I suppose there are also minor things like new inhibitor etc.
From what I’ve found I think repairing radiators like these on-site would be a real nightmare. They have no means to do that anyway.
The retailer is only really interested in arranging a courier who would collect faulty ones from outside our house.
I’ve asked them to come out to inspect them or that they take 1 away to check it etc. but they seem to prefer getting them all at once.
The plumbing side in terms of disconnecting the pipes isn’t too terrible TBH – I’d cover that ok. It’s all the side effects of the work being done that I feel annoyed by. It will be a terrible job for the contractor to remove them all from the house without any damage from water. We bought what I understood was amongst the best of products – it’s bad enough to have the issue but feels like we’re left sorting it all out too.
I suppose there are also minor things like new inhibitor etc.
I realise that your contract is with the retailer but may be worth a phone call to the manufacturers to explain what the problem is,that you bought a lot of radiators and the 10 year guarantee as you never know they may be able to repair on site.
If not I wish you all the best and hope it does not take too long to sort out.
If not I wish you all the best and hope it does not take too long to sort out.
The manufacturer will honour the warranty but just refers us back to the seller.
Connections are much like normal rads but a few are massive - so need 4 bodies to move them around. Not easy to drain either.
A large radiator has a lot of seals so not really practical to do 20-odd in someones house I suppose. This is not their process either.
Radiators were all flushed and correct fernox inhibitor has been used. We also have a magnetic cleaning device to pick out any debris. The system water is cleaner than any CH system I've seen. Per my post it sounds like a bad batch which according to the retailer does happen from time to time (cast moulds or some issues).
I'm mainly trying to find out what our rights are in terms of installation under Sale of Goods Act I think. From my reading it sounds like we might be covered and the seller should cover the cost of removal and re-installation. Otherwise we have a cost that has been incurred by their faulty product? Maybe they can get that back from manufacturer but that's not really our concern as our contract is with the retailer.
Connections are much like normal rads but a few are massive - so need 4 bodies to move them around. Not easy to drain either.
A large radiator has a lot of seals so not really practical to do 20-odd in someones house I suppose. This is not their process either.
Radiators were all flushed and correct fernox inhibitor has been used. We also have a magnetic cleaning device to pick out any debris. The system water is cleaner than any CH system I've seen. Per my post it sounds like a bad batch which according to the retailer does happen from time to time (cast moulds or some issues).
I'm mainly trying to find out what our rights are in terms of installation under Sale of Goods Act I think. From my reading it sounds like we might be covered and the seller should cover the cost of removal and re-installation. Otherwise we have a cost that has been incurred by their faulty product? Maybe they can get that back from manufacturer but that's not really our concern as our contract is with the retailer.
Repairing at home not going to be an option - to be fair to the company it would be totally impractical to rebuild 20 radiators in someones house. If it's a casting issue they wouldn't be able to repair anyway.
I think I've exhausted the practicalities and whilst I would dearly love to avoid them all coming out but I think that is now inevitable. Question is more on the responsibility and legality side of who should pay for that. Maybe worth trying citizens advice?
Had hoped it was a common sale of goods type question.
Thanks.
I think I've exhausted the practicalities and whilst I would dearly love to avoid them all coming out but I think that is now inevitable. Question is more on the responsibility and legality side of who should pay for that. Maybe worth trying citizens advice?
Had hoped it was a common sale of goods type question.
Thanks.
No idea on pressure test value but I'd imagine they would have tested out at installation ok and over months we don't see much pressure loss - but a single drip a week stains a carpet and shouldn't happen from what I gather with a high end item.
I don't think it's in dispute that we have faulty items though (seller and manufacturer happy that we return) and not really a plumbing question.
Cheers.
I don't think it's in dispute that we have faulty items though (seller and manufacturer happy that we return) and not really a plumbing question.
Cheers.
orbit123 said:
No idea on pressure test value but I'd imagine they would have tested out at installation ok and over months we don't see much pressure loss - but a single drip a week stains a carpet and shouldn't happen from what I gather with a high end item.
I don't think it's in dispute that we have faulty items though (seller and manufacturer happy that we return) and not really a plumbing question.
Cheers.
You're missing the point, but you carry on.I don't think it's in dispute that we have faulty items though (seller and manufacturer happy that we return) and not really a plumbing question.
Cheers.
orbit123 said:
haha it's my question to ask and it wasn't about plumbing but about return of faulty goods. The items will go out and back in just the same as when they were installed - I'd rather not pay for it to happen though if I have sale of goods act on my side.
Wouldn't you rather fix the problem in situ without all the disruption?I know what you mean - that would be great but as that is not a solution being offered by the seller or manufacturer it would be at my own cost and would no doubt invalidate the warranty. They're expensive items and with manufacturer accepting there is an issue (i.e. a bad batch, problem with tooling) I feel I'm better to get them replaced. If it was just 1 then I'd probably look more at a repair.
We will pay for removal and replacement if need be but it would seem that I then suffer a substantial loss because of this fault.
We had all the dimmer switches go faulty and had same issue - they sent replacements and we paid electrician to re-do it all. Was only a mornings work though for 1 guys so not too terrible but I wonder if I should have challenged it more. I didn't buy any of this as a business - all private individual.
We will pay for removal and replacement if need be but it would seem that I then suffer a substantial loss because of this fault.
We had all the dimmer switches go faulty and had same issue - they sent replacements and we paid electrician to re-do it all. Was only a mornings work though for 1 guys so not too terrible but I wonder if I should have challenged it more. I didn't buy any of this as a business - all private individual.
you could write to the shop / manufacturer explaining the situation - and ask them what they would like to do...
include a quote and ask how they wish to pay it
alternative is that you pay and then pursue them through the small claims court...
I would be tempted to get them fixed first and then discuss costs...
include a quote and ask how they wish to pay it
alternative is that you pay and then pursue them through the small claims court...
I would be tempted to get them fixed first and then discuss costs...
I can't help with the legalities of it all, it must be really frustrating.
I'm intrigued as to why they have started to leak after almost 4 years.
Original cast iron rads do not have seals between the sections. They are metal to metal and pull in on a taper fitting only.
Perhaps it might be worth while to pay an expert to check them over, the threaded rods might just need tightening?
I'm intrigued as to why they have started to leak after almost 4 years.
Original cast iron rads do not have seals between the sections. They are metal to metal and pull in on a taper fitting only.
Perhaps it might be worth while to pay an expert to check them over, the threaded rods might just need tightening?
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