Brexit

Author
Discussion

Rovinghawk

Original Poster:

13,300 posts

157 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Many are in favour of Brexit, many are against. I'm slightly in favour but could be persuaded one way or the other depending on the good and bad consequences of leaving.

How would you vote and what reasons do you have? I'm hoping to keep the emotive side out of it & stick to logical, financial reasons and the best interests of the UK as a whole.

Digga

40,206 posts

282 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Brexit.

EU GDP and influence is on an irreversible, downward trajectory.

The UK needs to negotiate it's own trade agreements, unhindered, with the relevant and important players in the future global economy.

XJ40

5,983 posts

212 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
It's a difficult one but I lean towards the staying in persuaion. There are various practical issues and we do need some reform for sure, but idealogically I see it as more "progressive" and liberal to have common laws/trade and soft borders with neighbouring countries. Most people who come here seem to work hard and contribute to the economy so I think we're better off in that regard, plus we're free to go elsewhere and do the same if we wish.

Scuffers

20,887 posts

273 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Brexit.

No argument, the UK would be better off in just about every respect.


Moominho

893 posts

139 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
I would vote to stay in. I'm not overly bothered though, I can see the benefits of both sides. I would vote to stay in as I do a lot of business in Europe and speaking to people over there it would be preferable. I also like our employment laws, I wouldn't like to go down the American route where it would be easier to sack people and less holiday entitlement. That would be more easy to implement if we weren't in the EU.

People who want to exit the EU seem a lot more passionate and emotive about the issue than people who want to stay in my experience.

TankRizzo

7,247 posts

192 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
I don't know enough about the arrangement to say yet. Will need to read around the subject before deciding.

voyds9

8,488 posts

282 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Leave, just because we never got a vote to join and those in power are trying too hard for the 'remain in' vote by telling us how much better it will be when they get reforms.

What they actually mean is they will bluster, tell us it will change later, nothing will change. Then they will tell us we had a vote to leave but chose to stay (conveniently forgetting the empty promises).

Rovinghawk

Original Poster:

13,300 posts

157 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
XJ40 said:
idealogically I see it as more "progressive" and liberal to have common laws.................with neighbouring countries.
Could an exited UK not simply copy those laws we see the benefit of?

Rovinghawk

Original Poster:

13,300 posts

157 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Moominho said:
I wouldn't like to go down the American route where it would be easier to sack people and less holiday entitlement.
The alternative is the French system whereby it's almost impossible to get rid of someone, no matter how bad they are. Like you said, we can see both sides.

ClaphamGT3

11,269 posts

242 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Remain in.

Quite apart from the economic logic for remaining part of the EU, an 'in' vote would pave the way to closer political union with the EU

Moominho

893 posts

139 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Rovinghawk said:
The alternative is the French system whereby it's almost impossible to get rid of someone, no matter how bad they are. Like you said, we can see both sides.
Fair point. And it's telling that I'm now looking at it as an employee, rather than as a business owner, as I have been before. I do like the way our laws are at the moment though, the balance seems right to me.

Rovinghawk

Original Poster:

13,300 posts

157 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
ClaphamGT3 said:
Remain in.

Quite apart from the economic logic for remaining part of the EU
Might I ask your version of this logic?
ClaphamGT3 said:
an 'in' vote would pave the way to closer political union with the EU
You see this as desirable?????

Digga

40,206 posts

282 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
ClaphamGT3 said:
Remain in.

Quite apart from the economic logic for remaining part of the EU, an 'in' vote would pave the way to closer political union with the EU
Given, as just one example, the manner in which the EU has (mis)handled the Syrian refugee crisis - ungainly, un-coordinated, even adversarial at times - I'm intrigued to know why you think this is desirable?

KrissKross

2,182 posts

100 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
The day we leave the EU we will be at least 8% better off.

This video from Professor Patrick Minford is a clear insight into the ignorance of the politicians even when presented with facts about leaving the EU, its a bit long but worth viewing:

https://youtu.be/leKEUT1TiLU

Unfortunately you wont see this guy on QT any time soon.

Edited by KrissKross on Monday 30th November 13:06

KrissKross

2,182 posts

100 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
ClaphamGT3 said:
economic logic for remaining part of the EU
Can you please explain this logic, perhaps demonstrate the maths behind your judgement?

steveT350C

6,728 posts

160 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Brexit.

All the people who told us it would be disastrous for Britain if we did not adopt the € are the same ones now saying it would be disastrous if Britain left the EU.

CaptainSlow

13,179 posts

211 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Exit Exit Exit

I want to live in a democracy please.

Do we currently have what was agreed to in the last referendum in 1975? No we don't. Voting to stay in will be the end of the UK.

Mrr T

12,152 posts

264 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
steveT350C said:
Brexit.

All the people who told us it would be disastrous for Britain if we did not adopt the € are the same ones now saying it would be disastrous if Britain left the EU.
Not all I was very anti euro but my views on EU exit is that it depends on the option. In my view any thing except flexcit would be a) virtually impossible, b) a potential disaster.

http://www.eureferendum.com/documents/flexcit.pdf

Alex

9,975 posts

283 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
There are economic arguments for both options.

The real reasons we should leave are for sovereignty, independence and democracy. The EU is undemocratic and unaccountable. That's why we should leave whether we will be better off or not.

Scuffers

20,887 posts

273 months

Monday 30th November 2015
quotequote all
Alex said:
There are economic arguments for both options.
out of interest, what do you see as the positive economic outcome from staying in?