X5 Brakes Squealing after Pad Change
Discussion
I’ve just had the rear pads changed on my 2011 E70 BMW X5 d40 by a reputable independent BMW specialist. The discs weren’t changed (seemed to have plenty of life and no probs before the pad change: it wasn’t recommended by the garage)
Car is back with me and I’ve done about 500 miles Over the weekend since collecting it. The brakes seem to be working well, good modulation and stopping the car ok with no sponginess or vibration through the pedal. Unfortunately they are screeching when the pedal is partly depressed. They are fine under hard braking. There has been no improvement or notable bedding in or scrubbing in the 500 miles since collecting the car.
Spoke to the garage who advised if it doesn’t improve the only solution it to replace the discs- a further £200+. I did point out that I’ve had pads only changed several times on this car and others without this problem but they didn’t seem able to offer any other solution.
They say they fit the pads with copper slip (or equivalent) and when I asked about cleaning the disks they said the new pads should do that within a few miles of use.
Any advice before I fork out for new discs?
Thanks
Car is back with me and I’ve done about 500 miles Over the weekend since collecting it. The brakes seem to be working well, good modulation and stopping the car ok with no sponginess or vibration through the pedal. Unfortunately they are screeching when the pedal is partly depressed. They are fine under hard braking. There has been no improvement or notable bedding in or scrubbing in the 500 miles since collecting the car.
Spoke to the garage who advised if it doesn’t improve the only solution it to replace the discs- a further £200+. I did point out that I’ve had pads only changed several times on this car and others without this problem but they didn’t seem able to offer any other solution.
They say they fit the pads with copper slip (or equivalent) and when I asked about cleaning the disks they said the new pads should do that within a few miles of use.
Any advice before I fork out for new discs?
Thanks
Usually that means the anti squeal shims were left out if they have them on the X5, copper grease between the piston and the back of the pad makes a big difference as well.
Unlikely to need disks due to squealing in my experience, usually these days disks and pads get changed at the same time.
Unlikely to need disks due to squealing in my experience, usually these days disks and pads get changed at the same time.
I can tell you from experience that the problem is the new pads - changing the discs will make no difference. If the pads do not have any sort of anti-squeal shim or rubber backing then this will happen. Copper grease is no substitute as it is only intended to prevent the pad binding in the carrier (a pretty rare event if everything is assembled cleanly).
Should be easy to spot through the wheel if the pads have any sort of backing on them. It's possible to stick a backing on them if they don't have one but it should have been done while they were clean before fitting.
Should be easy to spot through the wheel if the pads have any sort of backing on them. It's possible to stick a backing on them if they don't have one but it should have been done while they were clean before fitting.
Common problem usually poor install (presuming it was not doing it beforehand). I would not be ponying up for more if it was not doing it before the change at all without trying other solutions first.
Blaming the discs is lazy and just another money making opportunity in this first instance IMO.
Blaming the discs is lazy and just another money making opportunity in this first instance IMO.
Ninja59 said:
Common problem usually poor install (presuming it was not doing it beforehand). I would not be ponying up for more if it was not doing it before the change at all without trying other solutions first.
Blaming the discs is lazy and just another money making opportunity in this first instance IMO.
Agreed. Brake noise is a major part of brake testing by manufacturers. It depends on the materials, but my experience is that brake discs outlast pads by 2:1Blaming the discs is lazy and just another money making opportunity in this first instance IMO.
Note these notes in EPC for BMW
The following additional parts are
also essential:
- brake pad sensor
- brake pad paste
The following recommendation applies
to vehicles more than 48 months old:
- Replace retaining spring
refer to Repair Manual!
34116798126 for the front retaining spring clip
34216758059 for the rear retaining spring clip
Possibly not enough paste or the retaining clip is rattling at squeaking frequency. But ultimately like above poor install.
Also the TIS for the car on the brake pads...
https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e70-x5-xdrive40...
https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e70-x5-xdrive40...
The following additional parts are
also essential:
- brake pad sensor
- brake pad paste
The following recommendation applies
to vehicles more than 48 months old:
- Replace retaining spring
refer to Repair Manual!
34116798126 for the front retaining spring clip
34216758059 for the rear retaining spring clip
Possibly not enough paste or the retaining clip is rattling at squeaking frequency. But ultimately like above poor install.
Also the TIS for the car on the brake pads...
https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e70-x5-xdrive40...
https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e70-x5-xdrive40...
Thanks for all the advice and responses- that’s really useful. The garage did mention that it might be a flange caused by wear around the edge of the disc, although they fitted the last pads (and discs) as well, with OEM parts, so I’d have thought that Pad size would match. There was no problem before the work was done.
I think their attitude is if they are going to take a further look they will put new discs on (to make it worth their while and solve the problem).
I feel that this should have been picked up by the garage when the job was completed (it was obvious). I’d like to think with the advice you’ve given it wouldn’t be unreasonable to get them to check the pad fitting before fitting new pads but I think they might be reluctant: I’m relying on their word- one solution makes them look like they’ve not done the job correctly, the other gets them more work 🤔. It’ll be an inconvenience to get the car back to them, not to mention any duplication of labour costs.
I’ll take a look at the discs: I assume if their is a flange catching I should be able to see where the disc is burnishing it. Is it likely to be on the outer or inner edge of the disc?
I think their attitude is if they are going to take a further look they will put new discs on (to make it worth their while and solve the problem).
I feel that this should have been picked up by the garage when the job was completed (it was obvious). I’d like to think with the advice you’ve given it wouldn’t be unreasonable to get them to check the pad fitting before fitting new pads but I think they might be reluctant: I’m relying on their word- one solution makes them look like they’ve not done the job correctly, the other gets them more work 🤔. It’ll be an inconvenience to get the car back to them, not to mention any duplication of labour costs.
I’ll take a look at the discs: I assume if their is a flange catching I should be able to see where the disc is burnishing it. Is it likely to be on the outer or inner edge of the disc?
My youngest's 307 squealed from the front brakes since he got it. Bought as a trade to trade.
When I eventually managed to get him to fit it into his schedule for me to sort it out(!) I found that:
1. The discs had a slight lip around the outer edge.
2. The discs were still well within thickness.
3. The pads in it had a set of clip on anti-squeal shims with a very thin rubbery coating & one had quite obviously been fretting as the rubber had gone & the metal of the shim was clearly worn.
New set of good quality pads fitted which come with the antisqueal pad fixed to the pads (Apec, a brand I've used a lot) & no more squealing.
You could have the lip removed but I've never bothered on any of our vehicles & not had any issues.
Were the pads fitted by the indy actually genuine BMW (can they prove it?) or A.N.Other from one or other of the local motor factors?
When I eventually managed to get him to fit it into his schedule for me to sort it out(!) I found that:
1. The discs had a slight lip around the outer edge.
2. The discs were still well within thickness.
3. The pads in it had a set of clip on anti-squeal shims with a very thin rubbery coating & one had quite obviously been fretting as the rubber had gone & the metal of the shim was clearly worn.
New set of good quality pads fitted which come with the antisqueal pad fixed to the pads (Apec, a brand I've used a lot) & no more squealing.
You could have the lip removed but I've never bothered on any of our vehicles & not had any issues.
Were the pads fitted by the indy actually genuine BMW (can they prove it?) or A.N.Other from one or other of the local motor factors?
Edited by paintman on Thursday 30th November 19:28
Pica-Pica said:
paintman said:
1. The discs had a slight lip around the outer edge.
]? Unless I misunderstand you, of course there is a lip there. The pads do not contact there, so there is no wear. Perfectly normal.
Entirely normal on a part worn disc. I've never seen any of ours - which includes BMW, Ford, Reliant, Land Rover, Rover, Peugeot, Mercedes - without it.
Edited by paintman on Thursday 30th November 19:39
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