Exige 350 / 380 / 390 / 410
Discussion
Hi All,
911 GT3 owner here considering making the move in to an S3 Exige but it's difficult to get a real understanding of the different variants and the relative price points so just looking for advice or feedback.
Having done some reading of various articles it seems the 390 could be the sweet spot for what I would be looking for - social weekend car with maybe one or two track days per year.
One question I do have is regarding GPFs - do the later models have these fitted and therefore less of the raucous noise? If so which models are best to avoid this, presumably a 410 from around 2017 - 2018?
Thanks in advance for any input!
911 GT3 owner here considering making the move in to an S3 Exige but it's difficult to get a real understanding of the different variants and the relative price points so just looking for advice or feedback.
Having done some reading of various articles it seems the 390 could be the sweet spot for what I would be looking for - social weekend car with maybe one or two track days per year.
One question I do have is regarding GPFs - do the later models have these fitted and therefore less of the raucous noise? If so which models are best to avoid this, presumably a 410 from around 2017 - 2018?
Thanks in advance for any input!
Mr R said:
Hi All,
911 GT3 owner here considering making the move in to an S3 Exige but it's difficult to get a real understanding of the different variants and the relative price points so just looking for advice or feedback.
Having done some reading of various articles it seems the 390 could be the sweet spot for what I would be looking for - social weekend car with maybe one or two track days per year.
One question I do have is regarding GPFs - do the later models have these fitted and therefore less of the raucous noise? If so which models are best to avoid this, presumably a 410 from around 2017 - 2018?
Thanks in advance for any input!
GPF? No buddy, this is a bit more basic than your Porsche. The only filters you'll find on these are for fuel and oil.911 GT3 owner here considering making the move in to an S3 Exige but it's difficult to get a real understanding of the different variants and the relative price points so just looking for advice or feedback.
Having done some reading of various articles it seems the 390 could be the sweet spot for what I would be looking for - social weekend car with maybe one or two track days per year.
One question I do have is regarding GPFs - do the later models have these fitted and therefore less of the raucous noise? If so which models are best to avoid this, presumably a 410 from around 2017 - 2018?
Thanks in advance for any input!
Ref noise: the 390/410/420 and 430 all have loud, valved exhausts. Unless you're doing a 105db day you'll need to fit a track exhaust. Even then, you'll have to check the driveby as they're really loud above 4500rpm (exhaust note and supercharger noise). Silverstone is usually ok for these cars bar the odd weather anomaly, Anglesey and Knockhill don't really test and Croft you should be ok for static and they have no driveby. Most other circuits you won't get near in a 390-430 spec car. Combe might let you on potentially. Goodwood do 105db days but you'll be black flagged for driveby on lap 1.
If it's just a couple of dates a year that you're doing then my recommendation would be to head over to Spa and the Ring. No noise issues there
From the sound of your anticipated usage a 390 would be perfect, although a 410 at similar money a consideration.
All offer very similar experiences and as mentioned no silly filters to bother with .
Tracking is difficult because of UK noise restrictions and bizarrely the loud noise Lotus’s make ( great for road though)
I would probably invest in a track back box as pretty easy to switch over
Good Luck
All offer very similar experiences and as mentioned no silly filters to bother with .
Tracking is difficult because of UK noise restrictions and bizarrely the loud noise Lotus’s make ( great for road though)
I would probably invest in a track back box as pretty easy to switch over
Good Luck
To echo what everybody else has said (though every single person who has replied either has a 410 or a 430 so this thread is probably a bit of an echo chamber!), the noise is incredible. 380 and above all have the same exhaust systems (steel or, as an optional extra, titanium but these sound the same).
I'll throw a bunch of info as it's always something that can be linked to later or found via Google.
Getting geo done to suit is very, very much recommended. I covered my experiences a little bit on TLF though there are folks that have far more experience with track-biased setups if that takes your fancy.
They're more comfortable than you'd expect with the Nitron 3-ways at least. It is firm but handles big hits (potholes and the like) far, far better than my Elegance (i.e. wafty old man spec) W204 C-Class and my other half's diesel Golf. High tyre pressures can impact ride quality immensely, so keep on top of those. You might want a steering wheel spacer; Eliseparts offer numerous sizes. Mine at least is built well and aside from the windows rattling (which I need to look at myself and add something to deaden this; seems to be common in 111 cars) and needing to adjust the placement on a bit of anti-squeak tape on one of the rear roof brackets, it doesn't creak or rattle at all.
You need to be in Sport mode for proper throttle response. Otherwise it is a little delayed and generally a bit more difficult to drive smoothly; at low speed I'd always be adding more throttle than needed until I started using Sport mode full-time. Sport is the least invasive ESC mode (aside from all off) as this allows a bit of slip and no Electronic Differential Lock (EDL, i.e. braking a wheel to badly mimic an LSD). The car has so much traction that this is a reasonable mode to use on the road.
You can't do badly with any of these cars. If you don't care about carbon and Nitron dampers and want the noise and a warranty, 390 is good choice. Otherwise, these cars are reliable and many (myself included) run without a warranty, making the 390 the financially tricky choice in my book (though others may disagree): a 410 is not much more, and if you only care about the noise and aren't looking for power upgrades, a 380 is quite a bit less and offers loads of carbon and Nitron 2-ways. Note that the Nitrons need servicing every 12k miles for road use, so check this has been done if on any Nitron-equipped car around (multiples of) that mileage. Quite a few say that these ride better than the Bilstein cars; I can't comment on this.
Values do seem to have a consistent floor: high mileage 410s don't appear to be able to go lower than any 380, for example. I don't think you're at risk of losing much at all for any duration of ownership.
Servicing is roughly £280/450/280/1300 or thereabouts (four-year cycle). Figures will be a bit off but gives you an idea. 4th year service is a big one. These figures do not include Nitron damper servicing (which I think is £700 including removal/fitment for all 4 corners, but again, might be completely wrong here). If keeping the car for a long time, a Moroso baffled sump might be worth the spend just to reduce the labour cost of replacing the baffles.
Lotus can be challenging to deal with at times but some force (unfortunately) generally gets the right result for out-of-the-ordinary warranty matters. Independent specialists are the route I'd go.
Lastly, don't be tempted to buy the Type 25 wooden gearknob. I went through 4 of them before giving up and getting a refund (still waiting for that...), they last about 3 months.
Hope this helps. The car is epic and I'll never sell mine
I'll throw a bunch of info as it's always something that can be linked to later or found via Google.
- 380 adds a baffled sump, has a little more boost but a lowered redline (6800rpm), gearbox cooler, all the nice carbon bits. Harrop HTV1320, non-chargecooled, exactly like the Exige S/350/Cup/360 Cup. I'd say the extra 200rpm of the 390 and up is much preferred judging by my experience in my 410.
- 390 and above all have the same drivetrain components (with all the coolers etc.). Larger Edelbrock supercharger (1740cc) with a built-in chargecooler. Komo-Tec upgrades to similar power levels (e.g. to 475hp and, in many cars, over 500Nm) are cheaper and less work than on 380 and lower-end cars as a result. Power modifications don't really impact value in either direction, so if you're not looking to keep the car in the long term, can afford to have money locked in to it, but are still looking to get more power, this is likely the most sensible route to go down overall.
- S/350/390 use Bilstein non-adjustable dampers.
- 380 uses Nitron 2-way dampers (compression and rebound).
- 410/420/430 use Nitron 3-ways (slow compression, fast compression, rebound). Some say 410s had to have a Track Pack for Nitrons soon after launch but I have never seen a 410 without them. Double check as I'd imagine a non-Nitron car will be almost impossible to move on.
- 380/410/420/430 gets lots of nice carbon bits. 380s often seem to get carbon side skirts, sill covers, etc. whereas on 410/420/430 some of these parts from factory somewhat rare depending on spec.
- Factory tyre for 380/410/420/430 is Cup 2 in 215/265/285 sizes, otherwise it's 205/265 PS4 on 350/390.
Getting geo done to suit is very, very much recommended. I covered my experiences a little bit on TLF though there are folks that have far more experience with track-biased setups if that takes your fancy.
They're more comfortable than you'd expect with the Nitron 3-ways at least. It is firm but handles big hits (potholes and the like) far, far better than my Elegance (i.e. wafty old man spec) W204 C-Class and my other half's diesel Golf. High tyre pressures can impact ride quality immensely, so keep on top of those. You might want a steering wheel spacer; Eliseparts offer numerous sizes. Mine at least is built well and aside from the windows rattling (which I need to look at myself and add something to deaden this; seems to be common in 111 cars) and needing to adjust the placement on a bit of anti-squeak tape on one of the rear roof brackets, it doesn't creak or rattle at all.
You need to be in Sport mode for proper throttle response. Otherwise it is a little delayed and generally a bit more difficult to drive smoothly; at low speed I'd always be adding more throttle than needed until I started using Sport mode full-time. Sport is the least invasive ESC mode (aside from all off) as this allows a bit of slip and no Electronic Differential Lock (EDL, i.e. braking a wheel to badly mimic an LSD). The car has so much traction that this is a reasonable mode to use on the road.
You can't do badly with any of these cars. If you don't care about carbon and Nitron dampers and want the noise and a warranty, 390 is good choice. Otherwise, these cars are reliable and many (myself included) run without a warranty, making the 390 the financially tricky choice in my book (though others may disagree): a 410 is not much more, and if you only care about the noise and aren't looking for power upgrades, a 380 is quite a bit less and offers loads of carbon and Nitron 2-ways. Note that the Nitrons need servicing every 12k miles for road use, so check this has been done if on any Nitron-equipped car around (multiples of) that mileage. Quite a few say that these ride better than the Bilstein cars; I can't comment on this.
Values do seem to have a consistent floor: high mileage 410s don't appear to be able to go lower than any 380, for example. I don't think you're at risk of losing much at all for any duration of ownership.
Servicing is roughly £280/450/280/1300 or thereabouts (four-year cycle). Figures will be a bit off but gives you an idea. 4th year service is a big one. These figures do not include Nitron damper servicing (which I think is £700 including removal/fitment for all 4 corners, but again, might be completely wrong here). If keeping the car for a long time, a Moroso baffled sump might be worth the spend just to reduce the labour cost of replacing the baffles.
Lotus can be challenging to deal with at times but some force (unfortunately) generally gets the right result for out-of-the-ordinary warranty matters. Independent specialists are the route I'd go.
Lastly, don't be tempted to buy the Type 25 wooden gearknob. I went through 4 of them before giving up and getting a refund (still waiting for that...), they last about 3 months.
Hope this helps. The car is epic and I'll never sell mine
Edited by jmcvaughn on Wednesday 2nd August 14:02
Thanks for all of the very helpful and informative replies everyone, especially clarifying that the main difference between the 350/390 and 410/20/30 lies in the Nitron vs Bilstein dampers.
Noise is certainly one of the main factors for me so it sounds like the 350 is out of the equation.
My original thinking preference for a 390 was based on the £7-8k price difference to a 410 seeming quite steep for 20bhp but it sounds like there is much more to it, and also that the 410 may be more desirable for future buyers because of the dampers. Presumably the gearbox in all variants is the same in terms of ratios and feel (excluding the earlier 350 as would be lookong at a 2020 onwards)?
Thanks again for all of the info, I have a road trip in the GT3 planned for Sept so once this is done I'll have to start having a look at a few cars.
Noise is certainly one of the main factors for me so it sounds like the 350 is out of the equation.
My original thinking preference for a 390 was based on the £7-8k price difference to a 410 seeming quite steep for 20bhp but it sounds like there is much more to it, and also that the 410 may be more desirable for future buyers because of the dampers. Presumably the gearbox in all variants is the same in terms of ratios and feel (excluding the earlier 350 as would be lookong at a 2020 onwards)?
Thanks again for all of the info, I have a road trip in the GT3 planned for Sept so once this is done I'll have to start having a look at a few cars.
I realise that my last response was mainly about the 380 and above mainly as it was more about what they add as opposed to anything else.
350 and up are the ones with the newer gearshift mechanism. Pre-350 cars can allegedly (I've only ever driven my 410) be more inconsistent; some are fine, others are terrible. All are probably not as good as the new linkage. Retrofitting is possible, or there are aftermarket options there, but I'd personally just focus on the right car from the outset if that's a problem.
The pre-350 cars are allegedly not quite as well put together, but I'd imagine there's simply more anti-squeak tape in use...
If you are happy without the additional bits, you could buy a 350 or pre-350 car (if you're happy with the gearshift mechanism of the example you test drive) and buy an aftermarket exhaust (e.g. Jim at 2bular offers loads of options that would probably get the sound back on an older car, as do Komo-Tec, and there are others). Or from Lotus new, or find a used 380/410/420 exhaust. Just as a far cheaper option that is again bound to see even less depreciation.
350 and up are the ones with the newer gearshift mechanism. Pre-350 cars can allegedly (I've only ever driven my 410) be more inconsistent; some are fine, others are terrible. All are probably not as good as the new linkage. Retrofitting is possible, or there are aftermarket options there, but I'd personally just focus on the right car from the outset if that's a problem.
The pre-350 cars are allegedly not quite as well put together, but I'd imagine there's simply more anti-squeak tape in use...
If you are happy without the additional bits, you could buy a 350 or pre-350 car (if you're happy with the gearshift mechanism of the example you test drive) and buy an aftermarket exhaust (e.g. Jim at 2bular offers loads of options that would probably get the sound back on an older car, as do Komo-Tec, and there are others). Or from Lotus new, or find a used 380/410/420 exhaust. Just as a far cheaper option that is again bound to see even less depreciation.
Edited by jmcvaughn on Wednesday 2nd August 16:44
Thanks again for taking the time to reply so comprehensively. A sub £50k 350 does look good value - is the power difference in a 380 / 90 significantly noticeable vs the 350 for those that have driven both?
Given the GT3's appetite for revs I want something similar that pulls strongly right at the top of the range, even if the redline is somewhat lower.
What's the view on wear and tear for tyres and brakes on track days - is it realistic to get a few days in during a year without significant expense for replacements?
Thanks again!
Given the GT3's appetite for revs I want something similar that pulls strongly right at the top of the range, even if the redline is somewhat lower.
What's the view on wear and tear for tyres and brakes on track days - is it realistic to get a few days in during a year without significant expense for replacements?
Thanks again!
Mr R said:
What's the view on wear and tear for tyres and brakes on track days - is it realistic to get a few days in during a year without significant expense for replacements?
My 410 is in a different league to previous cars I've owned like M3's, Cayman, 911 in terms of consumables.I replaced my front Michelin Cup 2 tyres this year. The ones I took off were the originals from the factory. They had done about 15 track days and a total of around 10,000 miles. Even then, I replaced them because they had 'gone off', not because they were illegal.
The rears had needed replacing before that, but still did about 13 track days.
Brake wise, my OEM pads did 4 track days but I can't remember how worn they were when I got the car. A set of Pagid RS29's seems to last 8 - 10 track days.
Mr R said:
- is the power difference in a 380 / 90 significantly noticeable vs the 350 for those that have driven both?
I haven't driven both, but I have been on track 350's. In particular, the ones which have the Alias23 air intakes fitted seem to be basically as quick as my 410. This video is from Donington earlier in the year, and the blue car behind me when the video starts at 9:08 is my friend in his 350 with air intake. We did some laps with me leading and then we swapped around.
You can see from video the difference (or lack of) in straight line speed. (And you can see from the data when I'm at full throttle):
https://youtu.be/cKkcRK4v07I?t=548
I'm in a 350. Great value, great fun and minimal cost of ownership. 350 is more than enough for a mainly road use/weekend car.
If you do want bragging rights, Komotec is the closest you'll get to an official upgrade. £10k odd if you have it done or quite often see 460bhp komotec cars up for sale for not a great deal more than a standard 350.
https://www.seriouslylotus.com/komo-tec-tuning/exi...
Older V6S listed in PH classifieds. Blue, 460bhp, decent value at £42950 if you don't mind the replacement engine.
If you do want bragging rights, Komotec is the closest you'll get to an official upgrade. £10k odd if you have it done or quite often see 460bhp komotec cars up for sale for not a great deal more than a standard 350.
https://www.seriouslylotus.com/komo-tec-tuning/exi...
Older V6S listed in PH classifieds. Blue, 460bhp, decent value at £42950 if you don't mind the replacement engine.
Edited by Rick101 on Wednesday 2nd August 20:42
Thanks for all of the info everyone.
Paul - that's great to hear that you can make a set of tyres last across multiple track days as I would like to do more in the coming years. Also thanks for sharing the video, certainly looks like good fun!
Rick - thanks for the info on potential upgrades, I think my preference would be to go for one of the higher power factory setups but it's worth knowing that there's options.
Keo - that's very kind of you to offer, unfortunately I'm in the South East near the Berkshire / Surrey borders.
Think I need a trip to Bell & Colvill in the next few weeks to do some further research.
Thanks again everyone!
Paul - that's great to hear that you can make a set of tyres last across multiple track days as I would like to do more in the coming years. Also thanks for sharing the video, certainly looks like good fun!
Rick - thanks for the info on potential upgrades, I think my preference would be to go for one of the higher power factory setups but it's worth knowing that there's options.
Keo - that's very kind of you to offer, unfortunately I'm in the South East near the Berkshire / Surrey borders.
Think I need a trip to Bell & Colvill in the next few weeks to do some further research.
Thanks again everyone!
I’m coming in to the discussion a bit late but have some experience going from an earlier S 2015 (pre 350) to a 390FE.
The 390 is a much better sounding car, I believe it’s the same exhaust as the 410 but not sure. I also had the dealer install the valve override switch on the steering column which works really nice and integrates with the electronic display showing on/off. The noise is incredible really.
I don’t do any track days but the 390 has the charge cooler which isn’t used on the 350 or 380.
Either way, I loved my old car so much, I wanted to buy a final edition car as the Exige is really hard to beat no matter which one you’ve got.
The 390 is a much better sounding car, I believe it’s the same exhaust as the 410 but not sure. I also had the dealer install the valve override switch on the steering column which works really nice and integrates with the electronic display showing on/off. The noise is incredible really.
I don’t do any track days but the 390 has the charge cooler which isn’t used on the 350 or 380.
Either way, I loved my old car so much, I wanted to buy a final edition car as the Exige is really hard to beat no matter which one you’ve got.
Mr R said:
Thanks for all of the info everyone.
Keo - that's very kind of you to offer, unfortunately I'm in the South East near the Berkshire / Surrey borders.
Think I need a trip to Bell & Colvill in the next few weeks to do some further research.
Thanks again everyone!
How did you search go? I'm Berkshire-based and have owned my 350 Sport for about 18m now. Happy to go for a brew/chat/drive if you're still looking at getting into Exige ownership. Keo - that's very kind of you to offer, unfortunately I'm in the South East near the Berkshire / Surrey borders.
Think I need a trip to Bell & Colvill in the next few weeks to do some further research.
Thanks again everyone!
Mr R said:
Thanks for all of the info everyone.
Paul - that's great to hear that you can make a set of tyres last across multiple track days as I would like to do more in the coming years. Also thanks for sharing the video, certainly looks like good fun!
Rick - thanks for the info on potential upgrades, I think my preference would be to go for one of the higher power factory setups but it's worth knowing that there's options.
Keo - that's very kind of you to offer, unfortunately I'm in the South East near the Berkshire / Surrey borders.
Think I need a trip to Bell & Colvill in the next few weeks to do some further research.
Thanks again everyone!
Hi Mr R, I have a 410 and based near Newbury. Happy to take you out and//or meet at Podium Place for a coffeePaul - that's great to hear that you can make a set of tyres last across multiple track days as I would like to do more in the coming years. Also thanks for sharing the video, certainly looks like good fun!
Rick - thanks for the info on potential upgrades, I think my preference would be to go for one of the higher power factory setups but it's worth knowing that there's options.
Keo - that's very kind of you to offer, unfortunately I'm in the South East near the Berkshire / Surrey borders.
Think I need a trip to Bell & Colvill in the next few weeks to do some further research.
Thanks again everyone!
Only have a lowly Elise as I just couldn't stomach the Exige prices back then.
Still much want for an Exige but then again couldn't stomach the thought of letting anyone else own my Elise
I would narrow it down to 350 vs 410 - to me, the rest are just superfluous.
The 390 is newer than the 410 and thus likely identical in price - but inferior in terms of equipment while the 380 to me is a worse 410, especially given it revs lower.
Still much want for an Exige but then again couldn't stomach the thought of letting anyone else own my Elise
I would narrow it down to 350 vs 410 - to me, the rest are just superfluous.
The 390 is newer than the 410 and thus likely identical in price - but inferior in terms of equipment while the 380 to me is a worse 410, especially given it revs lower.
how about those last models, the Final Editions: Sport 390, Sport 420 and Exige Cup 430.
could be interesting when you want to sell it say after some years fun.
no idea if they are a bit more special? yes the 430 but expensive, but the one in between, say that 420 final edition, is it 'better' or more interesting then say a 410?
could be interesting when you want to sell it say after some years fun.
no idea if they are a bit more special? yes the 430 but expensive, but the one in between, say that 420 final edition, is it 'better' or more interesting then say a 410?
GTRene said:
how about those last models, the Final Editions: Sport 390, Sport 420 and Exige Cup 430.
could be interesting when you want to sell it say after some years fun.
no idea if they are a bit more special? yes the 430 but expensive, but the one in between, say that 420 final edition, is it 'better' or more interesting then say a 410?
For the 410 vs 420, as far as I know the differences are literally just the following:could be interesting when you want to sell it say after some years fun.
no idea if they are a bit more special? yes the 430 but expensive, but the one in between, say that 420 final edition, is it 'better' or more interesting then say a 410?
- 10bhp and 5lb-ft more from a slightly different tune
- Stunted version of the AiM MX2E dash (that cannot be "unlocked" or firmware-flashed to a full-fat MX2E)
- The slightly flat-bottomed steering wheel
- Different seat trim design (but same seats) that look like you cannot add an inflatable lumbar support underneath of due to the fact that the way each trim piece is arranged.
Olivera said:
Is the exhaust on the earlier cars quieter on startup, as well as when driving?
Anything 350 and earlier has a quieter exhaust. 380 upwards have the loud exhaust. On the 380+, valves open during turnover (I actually wouldn't mind if you could start it with them closed) but then close straight away. You can add the button to have it open all the time (including at start-up) on the 390+, 380 I assume will be the same. 350 and below I'm actually not 100% sure how the valve works, I'm pretty sure Sport mode opens the valves.Gassing Station | Elise/Exige/Europa/340R | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff