Bamford Rose V12 Gen II Upgrades

[magycks]

I'm interested in fellow PHers' reviews of BR's primary decat versus full system for V12 cars specifically (especially the DB9.2/Vanquish II with the higher powered engine). Has anyone had both options? How does driving experience change across the rev range? Is the full system worth the (huge) additional cost? To paraphrase from BR website:

Phase 1: Primary cat delete, BR secondary cats c+40bhp / c+30Nm. £2,700 inc VAT.

Phase 2: BR manifolds, BR secondary cats. c+70bhp / c+60Nm (figure significantly higher for DB9/Rapide S with power restriction removal). £7,800 inc VAT.


Note: I have a DB9.2 with the power upgrade (derestricts 510bhp motor to the 565 of Vanquish, though I understand these all dyno at more like 540/545). The change is only above 4,000 RPM since this is what was restricted from factory.

[karatemaserati]

where are the figures from for the cheaper option?? the primary decat option is not on the website??? phase 1 is just listed as secondary cat upgrade

[magycks]

karatemaserati said:

where are the figures from for the cheaper option?? the primary decat option is not on the website??? phase 1 is just listed as secondary cat upgrade

[Felonious]

There are some interesting points made in this thread that will likely be relevant to your info gathering and thought process.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

[magycks]

Felonious said:

There are some interesting points made in this thread that will likely be relevant to your info gathering and thought process.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Thanks. I think i've read *most* of what I could find on PH already, though a lot of it is for the older cars / doesn't necessarily compare the 'Phase 1' primary decat to 'Phase 2' full system (of course there's so much on here I may well have missed something)

[Felonious]

If it helps, I have the 'gen-2' package on a V12VS, and it's fantastic. The noise can be a bit intense with the valves open, but in normal / valves-closed mode it's very peaceful in the cabin and an easy touring car. The performance is appreciably better. To be blunt, an already rapid car is now blisteringly quick (if that's your thing). It pulls more readily from lower revs, which build much faster than before. I'm very happy with it.

[magycks]

Does anyone have before/after dynos for any of the Gen II V12 engined cars with Bamford Rose manifolds & remap? Anecdotal opinions also welcomed!

i.e. specifically interested in which are quoted from factory at:

510bhp (e.g. DB9.2, V12 Vantage) or;
565bp (e.g. Vanquish II, V12 Vantage S)

[Felonious]

Mike at BR reckons the 565bhp engine is always around 545 and that his upgrades add around 60. A friend has the factory performance pack and at some point we'll get around to a same-day, same-machine dyno to see which one has the most grunt and twist.

Regardless, mine is - to quite Mike - f**king fast. It's certainly much faster than I am.

[magycks]

Any more feedback from anyone with the full BR exhaust system on a gen II V12 engine i.e. a car that was 510 (electronically detuned) / 540 / 565bhp as stock?

[bentley01]

I didn’t have the full new manifolds but I had a primary De-Cat and standard secondary Cats on a V12 Vantage 510HP. The sound was epic and it definitely felt much perkier and pulled better. Less restricted as it revved. First class service from BR and in fact I have just had my Vanquish done as well.

[Throttlesteerer]

Hi Bentley,

could you please elaborate on the sound being epic in which direction?
I personally love a lazy burble and do not like to lose it in favour of a "tuned exhaust note" that sounds racy or Ferrari.

Also are the imorovements more on the upper rev range or are they really noticeable down low between 2K and 3K?

Thanx for your answer.

[bentley01]

Same Aston sound but slightly louder and deeper with more crackles on overrun. The car just felt less restricted and whilst the acceleration changes are slight it definitely felt quicker. Well worth doing

[magycks]

Does anyone have Bamford Rose manifolds and 200-cell secondary catalysts (with or without BR baffles) on a V12 car?

If so, for anyone willing to show me, I would love to come visit to see / hear it for myself. I'm based in SW London but happy to travel !

[Beckson]

Wasn't there also a choice between engine intake manifolds on the v12 ?
Something like one is more aimed at torque while the other at max hp at higher rpms?
Seems if going for the phase 2 upgrades might as well do the airbox or manifold upgrade too

[The V12 Way]

magycks said:

Does anyone have Bamford Rose manifolds and 200-cell secondary catalysts (with or without BR baffles) on a V12 car?

If so, for anyone willing to show me, I would love to come visit to see / hear it for myself. I'm based in SW London but happy to travel !

Hi, i did the whole hog on my V12 about five years ago, including tubular manifolds, 200 cell cats plus tune. it was awesome but unfortunately came to an untimely end during Storm Dennis

My V12S now has just been changed to a full VAP system with tubular manifolds, 200 cell cats, X pipe and GT4 back boxes, its quiet on startup but roars when on full chat, and sounds awesome, higher pitched than normal but nice for a v12

steve

[magycks]

The V12 Way said:

Hi, i did the whole hog on my V12 about five years ago, including tubular manifolds, 200 cell cats plus tune. it was awesome but unfortunately came to an untimely end during Storm Dennis

My V12S now has just been changed to a full VAP system with tubular manifolds, 200 cell cats, X pipe and GT4 back boxes, its quiet on startup but roars when on full chat, and sounds awesome, higher pitched than normal but nice for a v12

steve

Understood you have the Velocity AP system now; did you have the Bamford Rose version or VAP system (and on which V12 car?) before the storm?

[The V12 Way]

magycks said:

Understood you have the Velocity AP system now; did you have the Bamford Rose version or VAP system (and on which V12 car?) before the storm?

Hi, I had the BR system on my 2010 V12 Vantage

[magycks]

The V12 Way said:

Hi, I had the BR system on my 2010 V12 Vantage

Did the BR system make a deep bass baritone sound to keep that signature aston exhaust tone? I've heard BR can do either that or the more Italian exotic high pitch note

[The V12 Way]

magycks said:

Did the BR system make a deep bass baritone sound to keep that signature aston exhaust tone? I've heard BR can do either that or the more Italian exotic high pitch note

If you keep the original back box then cant see why that should change, on mine i had a larini back box which was louder and different pitch

[magycks]

The V12 Way said:

If you keep the original back box then cant see why that should change, on mine i had a larini back box which was louder and different pitch

From a BR video Mike mentions they can have their system as deep baritone (default) or higher pitched more Ferrari-esque. Sayd they 'play around with the secondary pipe lengths to achieve the characteristic than the customer wants'

Source: https://youtu.be/DL-Bgzjy6IM?t=135

Would still be really interested to come visit somebody with the full BR system on a V12