Legalities of organising a run in PistonHeads.

[D4V KC]

Legalities of organising a run in PistonHeads.

I've been 'guilty' of organising group runs in the past via the PistonHeads website and was wondering what the legal implications are?
I'll generally say on the thread that I'm organising a run, going from "A" to "B" and usually I provide a photocopied map on the day with a route marked on it.

Should I be getting a disclaimer signed before the off?

Exactly how much trouble can I get myself into?

What are the actual implication with 5, 10, 20+ cars taking part?
Police interest, (other than potential revenue from scamera vans? Law regarding a group drive, run, rally, hoon????

I only ever tend to say 'organised run'.

Hope someone in the know on here can help. But please only state what is legal fact. I don't want to rely on what ya mate said down the pub.

Unless they're a lawyer!!!

[grahamdance]

If there is no element of timing, then you are OK.

If there is, or there are checkpoints/cluepoints to visit (like a navigational scatter) then you have to get the route authorised by the Motor Sports Association and the county Route Liason Officer (who works on behalf of the MSA).

[Cooperman]

Call the RAC Motor Sports Association on 01753 681736 for advice.

[randlemarcus]

Ahem, I'm not sure this applies. Calling the RAC or MSA departments whose paid employment is making sure that people fill out the correct forms for organised and funded rallies may not be the way forward.

Fairly sure that a one paragraph DVD response would be more pertinent.

[Don]

I have never worried about this.

I make it clear that it just so happens that I am driving from A to B today at a certain time. If anyone else would like to also drive that route at that time its up to them. Sheer coincidence.

I'm not sure it would stand up in court but all the car clubs do it. So long as drivers aren't asking for any special treatment when using the public roads it should be fine.

After all - there's NO element of competition, there's NO timing, there's no special consideration shown to those doing a particular drive. Why shouldn't they use the public roads they've paid for whenever they happen to prefer?

[Graham]

Cooperman said:

Call the RAC Motor Sports Association on 01753 681736 for advice.

actually its just Motor sport association (MSA) these days.... its not rac anymore...

[Flat in Fifth]

randlemarcus said:

Fairly sure that a one paragraph DVD response would be more pertinent.

Not sure I can do it in one para but here goes.

One para: no timing, no set route, just a group of like minded individuals, get on with it no problem.

Specifically for the anoraks.

Legislation specifying when motor events are permitted is in sections 12 and 13 of the Road Traffic Act 1988.

Section 12 prohibits any race or trial of speed between motor vehicles from taking place on public highways.
Section 13 of the 1988 Act allows other forms of competition or trial between motor vehicles to take place on public highways, provided that they are authorised in accordance with the relevant regulations, which are the Motor Vehicles (Competition and Trials) Regulations 1969 as amended in 1974, 1976, 1978, 1982, 1993 and I believe again in 2002.

These regulations require all events to be authorised through the MSA authorisation office except for certain types of events which are automatically authorised and therefore no specific authorisation is needed nor sought in law.

Rather than confuse the issue by listing all the types of events, providing your run meets one of the following then you will be OK.

An event on which no merit is attached to completing the event with the lowest mileage, and in which as respects such part of the event is held on the Public Highway, there are no performance tests and no route, and competitors are not timed or required to visit the same places, except that they may be required to finish at the same place by a specified time.

or :ahem:

An event in which, as respects such part of the event as is held on the Public Highway, merit attaches to a competitor’s performance only in relation to good road behaviour and compliance with the Highway Code.

I think your proposals fall foul by handing out a set route.

I do know that certain bike clubs get round this by having leaders and markers, in that they take turns to lead the way, and then whoever is second on the road "parks" up at any significant junctions so that followers know to go the right way. Someone else volunteers, or they take itin turns to be tail-end charlie.

Mind you, you could all join the Forces call it a training exercise and you can then do what you want. But don't say I told you.

[D4V KC]

Thanks everyone, especially Flat In Fifth. Very helpful, I can only guess from your input you are in some way connected with the legal profession? So cheers for the info.
D4V KC

[D4V KC]

D4V KC said:

<br/> <br/>>>> Edited by TonyHetherington on Wednesday 1st March 11:44

What happened here? Tony? Cheers, D4V KC

[TonyHetherington]

No idea Dave. All I did was remove the (18) logo from your thread (it was not needed and if over-used dilutes it's usefulness). Can you not see your original post then (I can)?!

For info, in case not, original post was;

D4V KC said:

Legalities of organising a run in PistonHeads. I've been 'guilty' of organising group runs in the past via the PistonHeads website and was wondering what the legal implications are? I'll generally say on the thread that I'm organising a run, going from "A" to "B" and usually I provide a photocopied map on the day with a route marked on it. Should I be getting a disclaimer signed before the off? Exactly how much trouble can I get myself into? What are the actual implication with 5, 10, 20+ cars taking part? Police interest, (other than potential revenue from scamera vans? Law regarding a group drive, run, rally, hoon???? I only ever tend to say 'organised run'. Hope someone in the know on here can help. But please only state what is legal fact. I don't want to rely on what ya mate said down the pub. Unless they're a lawyer!!!

[Flat in Fifth]

D4V KC said:

Thanks everyone, especially Flat In Fifth. Very helpful, I can only guess from your input you are in some way connected with the legal profession? So cheers for the info. D4V KC

No probs but for ref I am not a lawyer, just interested in traffic law.

See my profile pic and you might figure out how I know about such competition regulation stuff.

[D4V KC]

No worries Tony, i understand, thanks.