SuperCar Challenge Day - NOBLE M12
Discussion
Spent Saturday at "Prestwold Hall" driving collection of kit - most excited about trying the Noble.
AWESOME machine, absolutely fantastic handling, grip & power. (Wiped the floor with everything else there IMO)
Fear it may have to be added to the garage -
What are general feelings ref the new 3litre unit - am told that it's upset the cars balance (I drove a 2.5l).
What are thoughts on the high spec version - is that available yet?
Appreciate any guidance.
Few pics of the day at:
http://web.ukonline.co.uk/gtcook/PRESTWOLD/prestwold.html
AWESOME machine, absolutely fantastic handling, grip & power. (Wiped the floor with everything else there IMO)
Fear it may have to be added to the garage -
What are general feelings ref the new 3litre unit - am told that it's upset the cars balance (I drove a 2.5l).
What are thoughts on the high spec version - is that available yet?
Appreciate any guidance.
Few pics of the day at:
http://web.ukonline.co.uk/gtcook/PRESTWOLD/prestwold.html
The 3L engine is much smoother and has a better torque curve than the 2.5L which results in a more relaxed way of driving - at least when not on a track - because you don't need to run in high revs to have the power. 
There is no discernible difference in the car balance or cornering capability.
Chris
There is no discernible difference in the car balance or cornering capability.
Chris
joust said: Not exactly a good idea to publish a Noble's number plate hooning around a track, given that the track day sump modification isn't ready yet........
Are you implying that there is a warranty issue?
I've never been told this and I have every expectation of using my car on the track and if someone thinks they're going to make me buy a new sump in order to do this then they are very much mistaken.
Before you go off on one and say "track day activity would invalidate your warranty" then tell me, what's the difference between circulating a large empty roundabout at high speed at 3:30am and hooning around a track? (besides the legal aspect). I know this is not a good comparrison but I think you get what I'm driving at (but not cornering too fast for too long). There are roads on the continent which will test driver and car every bit as much as a track.
Phil
Rainman.
Fear not. See this thread...
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=23996&f=26&h=0
IIRC, the 'mod' is a dry sump, which Noble are still in the process of developing. If you were to place an order today for a new Noble, then chances are very high that this 'mod' will be available by the time your car is ready for collection. (Anyone got an idea as to how long the queue is at the moment?).
I'm guessing the queue is around a year, as I've got the M12-3R on order (order placed on first Friday at Motorshow in October), and have recently been told to expect delivery in August.
Fear not. See this thread...
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=23996&f=26&h=0
IIRC, the 'mod' is a dry sump, which Noble are still in the process of developing. If you were to place an order today for a new Noble, then chances are very high that this 'mod' will be available by the time your car is ready for collection. (Anyone got an idea as to how long the queue is at the moment?).
I'm guessing the queue is around a year, as I've got the M12-3R on order (order placed on first Friday at Motorshow in October), and have recently been told to expect delivery in August.
I spoke to Lee about this earlier this week. Dry sump was a non starter for a variety of reasons, including the fact that you'd have to lose the A/C to fit it. They were looking at baffled sumps too, but with no great success. Current line of investigation is Accusumps (www.accusump.com for more info).
Apparently the problem is more pronounced on right hand corners rather than left, so my advice would be to avoid ultra twisty circuits (such as Brands Hatch), try something with plenty of left handers (Bedford Autodrome springs to mind) and make sure the oil is up to the max mark.
Apparently the problem is more pronounced on right hand corners rather than left, so my advice would be to avoid ultra twisty circuits (such as Brands Hatch), try something with plenty of left handers (Bedford Autodrome springs to mind) and make sure the oil is up to the max mark.
Rainman said: Before you go off on one and say "track day activity would invalidate your warranty" then tell me, what's the difference between circulating a large empty roundabout at high speed at 3:30am and hooning around a track? (besides the legal aspect). I know this is not a good comparrison but I think you get what I'm driving at (but not cornering too fast for too long). There are roads on the continent which will test driver and car every bit as much as a track.
Yeah, right! Not done many track days, have you... :-)
Buster, as in the thread link above, the T&C's of the warranty are very clear. However, Noble have taken a sensible approach and said that they will give full and complete warranty cover for defects on track days with the mod done (and certain guidelines being followed) but not before.
Rainman said:Are you implying that there is a warranty issue?
If you're going to order on - don't worry - it'll all be fixed by the time you get your car (see below).
I've never been told this and I have every expectation of using my car on the track and if someone thinks they're going to make me buy a new sump in order to do this then they are very much mistaken.
The thread discusses the various arguments about this issue so I won't return to them here - reading the thread will give you all the information you need.
Err - a massive amount of difference! Cornering forces (and therefore the reason the sump may become "dry" causing engine failure due to oil surges) is related to two factors, the speed entering the corner and length/radius of it. A roundabout has very little radius, and is in effect either a "bus stop" or a chicane (depending which exit you take
Before you go off on one and say "track day activity would invalidate your warranty" then tell me, what's the difference between circulating a large empty roundabout at high speed at 3:30am and hooning around a track? (besides the legal aspect). I know this is not a good comparrison but I think you get what I'm driving at (but not cornering too fast for too long). There are roads on the continent which will test driver and car every bit as much as a track.
)from a track point of view, the corners that create problems are fast, sharp right handers that have different characteristics. The only road that you could get near to track cornering forces is probably the Nurburgring, which give it's a "special" toll road could and almost certainly would be classed as a track for warranty purposes.
There are many other reasons though to not publish photos of cars with VRN's on track days, insurance cover being just one of those.
Hope that clears things up for you - certainly don't let it put you off the car - it's an amazing thing and the mod that is just a few weeks away will remove any issue with track days, high lateral g-forcces (which is why you were so impressed with the car
) and oil surges. Have fun!
J
>> Edited by joust on Thursday 13th February 08:17
Latest I have from Lee is...
Nildram said:Apparently the problem is more pronounced on right hand corners rather than left, so my advice would be to avoid ultra twisty circuits (such as Brands Hatch), try something with plenty of left handers (Bedford Autodrome springs to mind) and make sure the oil is up to the max mark.
"Yes the weather is a pain, can't test properly the solution i hope is a Accusump we have fitted one to our car but not tested yet. The reason for accusump is it is easy to fit on existing cars
I hope to have some time this week weather permiting to test it. If it works it would only take one day to fit to cars."
So - little bit more paitence and then we can all start to be "hooligans" again! If it had been a bit drier we would have had the solution sooner!
J
I can only coment on two - Noble obviously and the 360. They are two quite different Cars. If you want to do big mileages then the 360 is more comfortable and quieter than the Noble. On the track the Noble is far more rewarding IMHO becasue it does not have any electrical gismo's it's all down to the driver! 360 can be a bit scary once you loose the tail although the electronic brain usually helps you out of trouble - the Noble on this front is great because it provides so much more feel in this area and you just know whats going on and can counter act impending spins etc. So huge power sildes are easily obtainable.
If you want a mad sports car thats a real laugh and you don't need to do big mileages then a Noble is good for it. If you want a car that is great at eating miles in comfort then I would say a 360 may be better.
If you want a mad sports car thats a real laugh and you don't need to do big mileages then a Noble is good for it. If you want a car that is great at eating miles in comfort then I would say a 360 may be better.
Nildram said:
Yeah, right! Not done many track days, have you... :-)
Erm, took my Elises to Donnington Park, Brands Hatch & Lydon Hill, combined with a full seasons club level of production class motorcycle racing & supermoto and throw in the odd trip to the Isle of Man and the odd car or bike thrown up the strip at "the pod" ... no, I don't suppose I have. ;-)
As far as european roads are concerned, have you never been to Stevio? There are plenty of empty, top quality asphalt, circuit type roads the likes of which you'll never find in the UK. I visit europe frequently on two and four wheels for just such a reason.
www.stelvio.org.uk/
Phil
Nildram said: Stelvio is pretty much one of a kind. I concede that racing down a mountain can put as much stress on a car as a track day, but roundabouts is pushing it :-)
I dunno, you've not seen the way I (ab)use roundabouts. hehehehe.
I'm also a firm believer that Colin Chapman invented the roundabout.
Phil
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