Porsche tuning

[Seany88]

I'm trying to find out what is the potential of the various 911's as right now I want a 911 but looks like it'll be a 3.2 Carrera (pre-89 gen.), or I could wait another year and get a turbo. Ideally I want one now (as i'm impatient!) and so was thinking that maybe the 3.2 would be a good start on the porsche experience before I dive into the turbo's. So just a few questions:

Can a non-turbo be converted to a turbo? Any issues with bodywork cooling etc?

What's the tuning potential of the turbo engines? Can the older generations be tuned as well as the newer ones? I've seen a ?964 turbo get up to 700bhp, not looking to get that far but is the possibility there?

I ask as i'm scared the engine might blow, in which case it'd be a perfect time to upgrade. How much should I set aside to cover this?

[ultra violent]

930's and 964 turbo's can realatively easily get into the 400's. 500 will cost more than you probably want to spend. 600+ takes a boat load of cash, to be done properly.

[Seany88]

ultra violent said:

930's and 964 turbo's can realatively easily get into the 400's. 500 will cost more than you probably want to spend. 600+ takes a boat load of cash, to be done properly.

Is 930 the model designation code for that era?

How much does 400bhp cost? And more importantly, who?

[Seany88]

Oh and btw I've read that only 89 onwards had the G50 box, is that something that'd be necessary? I see on this forum comments about it implying that its the thing to have...?

[ultra violent]

Starting from a 964 turbo, you can get ~375bhp with 1 bar boost, headers, cat bypass. That lot would cost you a couple of grand. If you are starting from a 930, you'd need a K27 turbo and, really, a bigger intercooler. There after it starts to get expensive.

[Seany88]

So for the 930 the standard turbo isn't big enough to support 400bhp then? How much room is there for bigger intercoolers, and is the pipework difficult to fabricate?

I've also found out that the G50 box is stronger, so that'll be a must then. When were they introduced? I've read 1987 onwards, can anyone confirm?

[scruffy101]

g50 on the carrera 1987 onwards,always get it if you can

[ultra violent]

There is no real point in converting a 3.2 to turbo spec. It would just be too expensive, relatively. The 930 4 spead is strong enough, but too long geared unless you have big HP. If cash is an issue, try and find the best 930 you can and enjoy.

[Seany88]

ultra violent said:

There is no real point in converting a 3.2 to turbo spec. It would just be too expensive, relatively. The 930 4 spead is strong enough, but too long geared unless you have big HP. If cash is an issue, try and find the best 930 you can and enjoy.

I am trying, but you always want the fastest/top of the range/bestest don't you?

Ok so I guess go for a good condition 3.2 for now, and see how I feel later on. I see you have a turbo, what have you done to yours and what kind of bhp is it running?

Edited by Seany88 on Saturday 28th October 21:31

[Seany88]

I read in another thread that you can do that to the newer (996 etc) models, is it an option on the 930? Can the std engines take boost or will be need to be built?

[djhep6]

Hi...
I have a 1986 930 turbo, and have very recently ordered some go faster bits which are sold as a kit by Imagineauto in the States. (Imagineauto.com)
The parts will only be despatched on Nov 6th, so can't give you my impression just yet, but the kit is quoted as increasing power from 300bhp up to 394bhp, and torque from 319lb/ft to 400lb/ft.
The cost of this is approx $8000 (5000GBP).
I believe that the same power increase can be had for less money, but i liked that fact that all the parts had been tested together as a kit and gave proven bhp/torque increase figures.

Hope this helps you in your decision.

Cheers.

Dave.

[djhep6]

Sorry, i Should have mentioned that after reading a fair amount on the subject of increasing hp on the 930 turbo, it seems that 450bhp is the max that can be achieved without spending mega bucks on upgrading the standard CIS fuel system.

Dave.

[Globulator]

Seany88 said:

Can a non-turbo be converted to a turbo? Any issues with bodywork cooling etc?

Yes, in that anything can be converted to anything with enough time and money. No in that you may not want to waste time and money - the conversion would cost a lot more than just buying a turbo car in the first place, and would not be worth anything afterwards.

Porsche changed many parts going from the Turbo to the Carrera, some of the most important being the brakes and gearbox.. not to mention the tail and engine, down to details like dials, wiring loom, injection system etc.

The CIS injection system is the usual reason for not going overboard on the power hikes, but there are a few articles around if you search for them about that use the existing CIS and getting more power. In addition the new MegaSquirt kits may allow you to install a full new injection system with more confidence than in the past, although the CIS is fairly reliable and economical.

I'd try buying one, having the 1bar spring done and a bigger intercooler fitted before you spend to much - the stock 930 goes like a rocket anyway and is a very enjoyable car without the modern thinking that needs huge amounts of power to counteract the natural dullness and blandness of modern cars (boxster excepted).

[Seany88]

Gazboy said:

djhep6 said:

Hi...
I have a 1986 930 turbo, and have very recently ordered some go faster bits which are sold as a kit by Imagineauto in the States. (Imagineauto.com)
The parts will only be despatched on Nov 6th, so can't give you my impression just yet, but the kit is quoted as increasing power from 300bhp up to 394bhp, and torque from 319lb/ft to 400lb/ft.
The cost of this is approx $8000 (5000GBP).
I believe that the same power increase can be had for less money, but i liked that fact that all the parts had been tested together as a kit and gave proven bhp/torque increase figures.

Hope this helps you in your decision.

Cheers.

Dave.

What comes with that kit, and how much is fitting?

From the website:

IA 394HP Kit - 911/930

Our Stage II kit offers not only stunning power, but reduced turbo lag - an unfortunate characteristic of the 930. Our upgraded intercooler coupled with free flow headers, helps to improve drivability and engine response.

394HP and 400Ft/Lbs of Torque will also put a smile on your face - a BIG smile. This kit is based on our Stage I and adds an HKS electronic boost control, custom plug wires, long neck intercooler w/updated blow off system and custom headers.

$5384.00

[Seany88]

Globulator said:

Seany88 said:

Can a non-turbo be converted to a turbo? Any issues with bodywork cooling etc?

Yes, in that anything can be converted to anything with enough time and money. No in that you may not want to waste time and money - the conversion would cost a lot more than just buying a turbo car in the first place, and would not be worth anything afterwards.

Porsche changed many parts going from the Turbo to the Carrera, some of the most important being the brakes and gearbox.. not to mention the tail and engine, down to details like dials, wiring loom, injection system etc.

The CIS injection system is the usual reason for not going overboard on the power hikes, but there are a few articles around if you search for them about that use the existing CIS and getting more power. In addition the new MegaSquirt kits may allow you to install a full new injection system with more confidence than in the past, although the CIS is fairly reliable and economical.

I'd try buying one, having the 1bar spring done and a bigger intercooler fitted before you spend to much - the stock 930 goes like a rocket anyway and is a very enjoyable car without the modern thinking that needs huge amounts of power to counteract the natural dullness and blandness of modern cars (boxster excepted).

So basically buy the 3.2 carrera first, and then when i've got the money trade for the turbo. It sounds obvious really, its just that I know I get attached to cars and so I hate the whole buying/selling process...wish I could keep all the cars i've ever owned

And i'm sure 300bhp will be plenty fast for a good while, but there will always come a time when you want more! So a bit of prep work in advance can't do any harm!

And djhep6 make sure to keep us updated with the quality of the kit and how good it is, sounds like it'll be a monster!

[Seany88]

Oh and what's the standard boost pressure for the 930 and what can it take safely before having to forge etc?

[scruffy101]

Seany88 said:

Globulator said:

Seany88 said:

Can a non-turbo be converted to a turbo? Any issues with bodywork cooling etc?

Yes, in that anything can be converted to anything with enough time and money. No in that you may not want to waste time and money - the conversion would cost a lot more than just buying a turbo car in the first place, and would not be worth anything afterwards.

Porsche changed many parts going from the Turbo to the Carrera, some of the most important being the brakes and gearbox.. not to mention the tail and engine, down to details like dials, wiring loom, injection system etc.

The CIS injection system is the usual reason for not going overboard on the power hikes, but there are a few articles around if you search for them about that use the existing CIS and getting more power. In addition the new MegaSquirt kits may allow you to install a full new injection system with more confidence than in the past, although the CIS is fairly reliable and economical.

I'd try buying one, having the 1bar spring done and a bigger intercooler fitted before you spend to much - the stock 930 goes like a rocket anyway and is a very enjoyable car without the modern thinking that needs huge amounts of power to counteract the natural dullness and blandness of modern cars (boxster excepted).

So basically buy the 3.2 carrera first, and then when i've got the money trade for the turbo. It sounds obvious really, its just that I know I get attached to cars and so I hate the whole buying/selling process...wish I could keep all the cars i've ever owned

And i'm sure 300bhp will be plenty fast for a good while, but there will always come a time when you want more! So a bit of prep work in advance can't do any harm!

And djhep6 make sure to keep us updated with the quality of the kit and how good it is, sounds like it'll be a monster!

i got my carrera chpped to 352 bhp,and had it tested at niemeister ,they do it for about £500.

[djhep6]

Seany88......

No problem....i will be sure to report back once i get the kit fitted.
Just for the record, the price of the stage 2 kit was the cost of the stage 1 and stage 2 together, so approx $8000.
All parts are bolt on, so the car can be reverted to standard at any time, and they are quoting 15hrs approx to fit.

Cheers.

Dave.

[Seany88]

Gazboy said:

Seany88 said:

Oh and what's the standard boost pressure for the 930 and what can it take safely before having to forge etc?

0.8bar I think- hasn't it already got forged internals?

Oh really? So other than fuelling etc what's stopping you from just winding up the boost?

[Seany88]

scruffy101 said:

Seany88 said:

Globulator said:

Seany88 said:

Can a non-turbo be converted to a turbo? Any issues with bodywork cooling etc?

Yes, in that anything can be converted to anything with enough time and money. No in that you may not want to waste time and money - the conversion would cost a lot more than just buying a turbo car in the first place, and would not be worth anything afterwards.

Porsche changed many parts going from the Turbo to the Carrera, some of the most important being the brakes and gearbox.. not to mention the tail and engine, down to details like dials, wiring loom, injection system etc.

The CIS injection system is the usual reason for not going overboard on the power hikes, but there are a few articles around if you search for them about that use the existing CIS and getting more power. In addition the new MegaSquirt kits may allow you to install a full new injection system with more confidence than in the past, although the CIS is fairly reliable and economical.

I'd try buying one, having the 1bar spring done and a bigger intercooler fitted before you spend to much - the stock 930 goes like a rocket anyway and is a very enjoyable car without the modern thinking that needs huge amounts of power to counteract the natural dullness and blandness of modern cars (boxster excepted).

So basically buy the 3.2 carrera first, and then when i've got the money trade for the turbo. It sounds obvious really, its just that I know I get attached to cars and so I hate the whole buying/selling process...wish I could keep all the cars i've ever owned

And i'm sure 300bhp will be plenty fast for a good while, but there will always come a time when you want more! So a bit of prep work in advance can't do any harm!

And djhep6 make sure to keep us updated with the quality of the kit and how good it is, sounds like it'll be a monster!

i got my carrera chpped to 352 bhp,and had it tested at niemeister ,they do it for about £500.

That's a massive increase just from a chip, or did you have extra mods?