USA JD Power Rankings are TAINTED via inducement
Discussion
Jaguar has been making a lot of stink in the USA about how well their cars rate in "independent" JD Power and Associates survey rankings.
Well I just got my survey and I was offered $75 worth of gas and car wash in exchange for giving them an excellent rating.
I've posted the letter received at: http://therealjaguarexperience.blogsp
Anyone who has ever done any formal surveys before knows that the numbers are worthless if there is inducement in the process.
Well I just got my survey and I was offered $75 worth of gas and car wash in exchange for giving them an excellent rating.
I've posted the letter received at: http://therealjaguarexperience.blogsp
Anyone who has ever done any formal surveys before knows that the numbers are worthless if there is inducement in the process.
Edited by kinjachris on Wednesday 25th April 19:52
What!!
Has anyone told J D Power about this?
I've never used my local Jaguar main stealer, so have no idea what the "Jaguar Customer Experience" is like in the UK.
If a major survey, that many people use to choose a car was being corrupted in this way over here, it would make national TV.
JS
Has anyone told J D Power about this?
I've never used my local Jaguar main stealer, so have no idea what the "Jaguar Customer Experience" is like in the UK.
If a major survey, that many people use to choose a car was being corrupted in this way over here, it would make national TV.
JS
Look, Kinjachris, are you on some kind of one man crusade against Jaguar? You gonna take em down, boyee??!
Anyone who is reading this, I suggest you look at some of Kinjachris' other posts including in particular the one where he drives along videoing himself doing so, and judge for yourself, what is going on here.
Nobody has ever offered me inducements to comment favourably on Jaguar customer care. I wish they would. For the record, and I have an '04 XJR and an '05 XKR, the cars have been for practical purposes faultless and frankly they make me feel pretty good. The dealers pretty good too though in one case not entirely efficient in rectifying a warranty fault (worn suspension bush on second hand XKR with associated DSC warning light which kept reappearing - now resolved), but from a courtesy point of view excellent. They gave me a copy of an '06 4.2-S brochure simply because I expressed interest in it. Does that count as a bung? I emailed Jaguar comments on the current XK after taking a test drive, and though it was a general email address, I got a considered reply within hours. I am near fed up receiving polite letters asking me if my service experience was good, this from Jaguar direct by the way, not from the dealer. I got chatting to some Jaguar people at a Goodwood Festival of Speed recently and next thing I was having sandwiches with Stirling Moss and Norman Dewis.
I really dont know where you're coming from, Kinjachris, but it sounds obsessive and I'd prefer you to take this elsewhere.
Anyone who is reading this, I suggest you look at some of Kinjachris' other posts including in particular the one where he drives along videoing himself doing so, and judge for yourself, what is going on here.
Nobody has ever offered me inducements to comment favourably on Jaguar customer care. I wish they would. For the record, and I have an '04 XJR and an '05 XKR, the cars have been for practical purposes faultless and frankly they make me feel pretty good. The dealers pretty good too though in one case not entirely efficient in rectifying a warranty fault (worn suspension bush on second hand XKR with associated DSC warning light which kept reappearing - now resolved), but from a courtesy point of view excellent. They gave me a copy of an '06 4.2-S brochure simply because I expressed interest in it. Does that count as a bung? I emailed Jaguar comments on the current XK after taking a test drive, and though it was a general email address, I got a considered reply within hours. I am near fed up receiving polite letters asking me if my service experience was good, this from Jaguar direct by the way, not from the dealer. I got chatting to some Jaguar people at a Goodwood Festival of Speed recently and next thing I was having sandwiches with Stirling Moss and Norman Dewis.
I really dont know where you're coming from, Kinjachris, but it sounds obsessive and I'd prefer you to take this elsewhere.
Edited by cardigankid on Friday 27th April 11:40
Well, Tea and cookies with Sterling sounds nice but that is not the experience I've had. You don't have to read my posts but I have every right to inform others who might be considering a Jaguar purchase what a terrrible experience I've had. I didn't get invited into the tent... I've been given the finger by the corporation, and yes, that included the CEO of Jaguar N.A. and Jaguar U.K. who have both been informed of the terrible experience I've had and have intentionally chosen to do nothing about it. When I called the CEO of the US to ask for his personal attention to this matter, his administrative assistant told me "Jaguar executives do NOT talk to customers". I don't know of any company that has this blatent disconnect with reality and customer service. If I had know this would be the case up front, I would have gone elsewhere. So you can paint your experience to the public of tea and biscuts and I'll tell what is really happening from my perspective and you are right, let the public decide for themselves.
I'm coming from a place of fact and genuine concern for how I've been treated and the crap car that I now have in my garage with 1400 miles on it that I can't drive. That $91,000 US sitting in a garage collecting dust because Jagauar mechanics tell me its Normal that my car makes metallic noises from deep within the engine that they will not fix. I drove the car yesterday and had to fasten the passenger seatbelt (with no one in the seat) to make the damn thing stop chiming at me "to fasten the seatbelt" of the non existant passenger.
My wife won't ride in the passenger seat as she is worried about the airbag not being deployed becase the car can't tell if someone is in the passenger seat or not. This is a lot more alarming to me than ruining my chances to have tea with Sterling so to answer your question..... Yes, I am on a mission now because they messed with the wrong guy. I'm filing legal documents now and I'll also share that process with the public as well.
Here is the real truth, no one wants to hear a stranger tell you your baby is ugly which is why most people on this forum lash back at me. Sorry I'm insulting you if your passion is Jaguar but here is the truth, your baby is ugly. Sorry but its true. The "Jaguar Experience" is sadly below that of most economy car makers and if you are considering buying a luxury car because you expect the "experience" to match the price tag, you are in for a rude awakening.
So lets compare and contrast to the experience I'm getting from another car company.... I've got a Toyota Prius (price tag $25k US, about 1/4 that of the Jaguar). I'm having an issue, I called the company. I got a rep on the phone in less than 2 minutes. They were GENUINELY concerned that I was happy with their product and promised to have a specialist contact me in less than 24 hours. About 12 hours later a specialist called, went WAY out of their way to address the problem, problem solved. Two senior executives from Toyota have called to express concern that I even had a problem in the first place and to insure that I was happy and the issue was resolved.
So when Toyota executives call me twice for a minor issue and Jaguar executives wont even take my call for a major issue, I'm sorry but your baby is UGLY and I'm going to just call it as I see it.
For those of you considering buying a Jaguar, check this out: http://therealjaguarexperience.blogsp
I'm coming from a place of fact and genuine concern for how I've been treated and the crap car that I now have in my garage with 1400 miles on it that I can't drive. That $91,000 US sitting in a garage collecting dust because Jagauar mechanics tell me its Normal that my car makes metallic noises from deep within the engine that they will not fix. I drove the car yesterday and had to fasten the passenger seatbelt (with no one in the seat) to make the damn thing stop chiming at me "to fasten the seatbelt" of the non existant passenger.
My wife won't ride in the passenger seat as she is worried about the airbag not being deployed becase the car can't tell if someone is in the passenger seat or not. This is a lot more alarming to me than ruining my chances to have tea with Sterling so to answer your question..... Yes, I am on a mission now because they messed with the wrong guy. I'm filing legal documents now and I'll also share that process with the public as well.
Here is the real truth, no one wants to hear a stranger tell you your baby is ugly which is why most people on this forum lash back at me. Sorry I'm insulting you if your passion is Jaguar but here is the truth, your baby is ugly. Sorry but its true. The "Jaguar Experience" is sadly below that of most economy car makers and if you are considering buying a luxury car because you expect the "experience" to match the price tag, you are in for a rude awakening.
So lets compare and contrast to the experience I'm getting from another car company.... I've got a Toyota Prius (price tag $25k US, about 1/4 that of the Jaguar). I'm having an issue, I called the company. I got a rep on the phone in less than 2 minutes. They were GENUINELY concerned that I was happy with their product and promised to have a specialist contact me in less than 24 hours. About 12 hours later a specialist called, went WAY out of their way to address the problem, problem solved. Two senior executives from Toyota have called to express concern that I even had a problem in the first place and to insure that I was happy and the issue was resolved.
So when Toyota executives call me twice for a minor issue and Jaguar executives wont even take my call for a major issue, I'm sorry but your baby is UGLY and I'm going to just call it as I see it.
For those of you considering buying a Jaguar, check this out: http://therealjaguarexperience.blogsp
kinjachris said:
Two senior executives from Toyota have called to express concern that I even had a problem in the first place and to insure that I was happy and the issue was resolved.
So when Toyota executives call me twice for a minor issue and Jaguar executives wont even take my call for a major issue, I'm sorry but your baby is UGLY and I'm going to just call it as I see it.
So when Toyota executives call me twice for a minor issue and Jaguar executives wont even take my call for a major issue, I'm sorry but your baby is UGLY and I'm going to just call it as I see it.
Trust me they will not have been senior executives you self important t**pot. Maybe they called themselves marketing executives or something. I really don't think the real senior people at Toyota would call you about a problem you have with a pious.
I really think that even you may have better things to do than ranting on here about a few niggles you're having with a car. You are clearly the sort of person who rubs people up the wrong way and then, shockingly, they refuse to help you.
This doesn't ring true to me. Sorry.
I might be wrong, or things might have changed. But I remember seeing a TV program about the JD Power survey in the US, before they introduced it over here. One of the key things in the program was about the fact that there was a fundamentally difference in the way the survey participants where selected.
When JD Power started it's survey in the UK they did it in conjunction Top Gear and you were invited on air to apply to take part in the survey. So you end up with a self selected set of participants, which stats people say isn't basically worth the paper the forms are printed on.
But in the US, JD Power got the details of all the people who had bought and registered a new car from the vehicle licensing office, or what ever the US version is. They then selected the participants from there. They then mailed out the survey forms direct to the selected people, along with a $1 bill as a way of getting peoples attention. As I remember it, the form was quite long and detailed. The process they used was quite thorough and it didn't go anywhere near the dealers.
Now that was quite a number of years ago, JP Power might have gone to pot by now. But you experience doesn't sound anymore like JD Power that it does Jaguar.
I'm sorry for you if you've had a bad time with them, but somehow I just find it difficult to believe all that you are saying.
Also looking at your blog, the story you tell there seems to be totally different to the one you told here. On your site you say you bought the XK, here you said that your wife bought it for you and that you were pissed off because you didn't want a Jaguar in the first place you wanted to buy a Porsche. I also seem to remember comments which I interpreted as you thinking that anyone who drives a convertible is a hair dresser and again your wife had made the mistake of buying you the convertible.
Are there any other American readers here who have taken part in a JD Power survey who can confirm that they have stopped using normally acceptable data gathering measure and now allow the dealers to hand out JD Power survey forms.
Surely if the dealer was in a position to do this they would not have chosen you as a candidate. If they were cooking the survey they would surely choose satisfied customers to hand the forms out to in the first place.
I don't understand what is going on here?
I might be wrong, or things might have changed. But I remember seeing a TV program about the JD Power survey in the US, before they introduced it over here. One of the key things in the program was about the fact that there was a fundamentally difference in the way the survey participants where selected.
When JD Power started it's survey in the UK they did it in conjunction Top Gear and you were invited on air to apply to take part in the survey. So you end up with a self selected set of participants, which stats people say isn't basically worth the paper the forms are printed on.
But in the US, JD Power got the details of all the people who had bought and registered a new car from the vehicle licensing office, or what ever the US version is. They then selected the participants from there. They then mailed out the survey forms direct to the selected people, along with a $1 bill as a way of getting peoples attention. As I remember it, the form was quite long and detailed. The process they used was quite thorough and it didn't go anywhere near the dealers.
Now that was quite a number of years ago, JP Power might have gone to pot by now. But you experience doesn't sound anymore like JD Power that it does Jaguar.
I'm sorry for you if you've had a bad time with them, but somehow I just find it difficult to believe all that you are saying.
Also looking at your blog, the story you tell there seems to be totally different to the one you told here. On your site you say you bought the XK, here you said that your wife bought it for you and that you were pissed off because you didn't want a Jaguar in the first place you wanted to buy a Porsche. I also seem to remember comments which I interpreted as you thinking that anyone who drives a convertible is a hair dresser and again your wife had made the mistake of buying you the convertible.
Are there any other American readers here who have taken part in a JD Power survey who can confirm that they have stopped using normally acceptable data gathering measure and now allow the dealers to hand out JD Power survey forms.
Surely if the dealer was in a position to do this they would not have chosen you as a candidate. If they were cooking the survey they would surely choose satisfied customers to hand the forms out to in the first place.
I don't understand what is going on here?
kinjachris said:
My wife won't ride in the passenger seat as she is worried about the airbag not being deployed becase the car can't tell if someone is in the passenger seat or not.
Wow! It must've been really hard for her to survive in modern society for all those years she couldn't get in ANY car because they hadn't started fitting airbags yet.
I've got just the same problem - several years of TVRs and not once has any of them left the garage; they've consistently forgotten to fit them at the factory every time. Oh no, wait, I just got on with driving the cars and having a great time.
[quote]kinjachris]Two senior executives from Toyota have called to express concern that I even had a problem in the first place and to insure that I was happy and the issue was resolved.[/quote]
I call "shenanigans"! Not a chance a senior executive would do this.
J_S_G said:
kinjachris said:
My wife won't ride in the passenger seat as she is worried about the airbag not being deployed becase the car can't tell if someone is in the passenger seat or not.
Wow! It must've been really hard for her to survive in modern society for all those years she couldn't get in ANY car because they hadn't started fitting airbags yet.
I've got just the same problem - several years of TVRs and not once has any of them left the garage; they've consistently forgotten to fit them at the factory every time. Oh no, wait, I just got on with driving the cars and having a great time.
Peter Wheeler had very firmly held ideas about safety.
You are responsible for it
I'm sure I remember an article where he talked about the fact that the chassis was extremely strong, if you were in an accident it would look after you, but that it was a much better idea not to get yourself into one.
J_S_G said:
kinjachris said:
Two senior executives from Toyota have called to express concern that I even had a problem in the first place and to insure that I was happy and the issue was resolved.
I call "shenanigans"! Not a chance a senior executive would do this.
They probably have people who's job is to call and check this sort of thing, it's just a question of what constitutes "Senior Executive"
a8hex said:
J_S_G said:
kinjachris said:
Two senior executives from Toyota have called to express concern that I even had a problem in the first place and to insure that I was happy and the issue was resolved.
I call "shenanigans"! Not a chance a senior executive would do this.
They probably have people who's job is to call and check this sort of thing, it's just a question of what constitutes "Senior Executive"
I'm sure they do - any large company that has a long term outlook on their business will have a customer services team to do this kind of thing. Toyota's a really interesting company in this respect, too; one of the few in the world that has a view that delivering shareholder value isn't the overriding concern of their board. If you read into it, it's a really interesting model. So I'd expect them to be better on this than most companies.
BUT that's very different from senior executives. Fairly reasonable description of executives in terms of CxO roles given on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporat
I wouldn't argue much with that definition. And I doubt they're doing outbound customer calling!
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