IT Consultants - can / would you recommend your accountant?

[W4NTED]

Time has come to change my accountant as he's acting like a p*ick! I need an accountant with decent sized balls who would not be so shite scared of the Inland Revenue.

My present accountant does not let me make any claims for meals etc (even genuine one's with clients!) as he doesn't recommend it!

Needed to apply for a mortgage recently and needed an accountants reference letter and the acted like the biggest w*nker ever! Okay I agree he would need to put in actual figures for the last two years of accounting, but my mortgage was to be based on my forcasted contract income for year ending 2008 - I needed him to jack up the figures for last year by £15k (nothing when I actually earn in excess of £150k per annum)and to project my income for 2008 with an increase of £30k. If he did this I could have had a very decent interest rate but he declined outright saying it's wrong! Due to this I have had to go with a higher self cert mortgage rate which cost me more than his fee a month!

arghhhhhh could go on and on but any IT consultants out there would know how fckin hard it is to get a decent mortgage with a decent interest rate and due to my "chicken accountant" I have suffered.

I'd be grateful if anyone can recommend an accountant with some Balls!?

EricMc???????? I hope you understand - I run a legit Ltd company but surely I wasn't asking for too much!?!?!?

[Eric Mc]

If you had suggested to him that the predicted amount you wanted him to verify in the application was actually higher than what you expected to actually earn, he had every right NOT to assist you in the application. I'm not being being stupid or pedantic here. The Money Laundering Regulations and the Proceeds of Crime Act laws are so draconian that an accountant who aids and abets a false claim could end up receiving a WORSE sentence than the perpretator of the original "crime". Not only that, he could be drummed out of his professional body - which would essentially ruin his career.

It's not worth it for the sake of pleasing one client.

He IS being a bit siilly over claiming meals. Legitimate subsistence costs are claimable by a business.

[thewave]

Personally, i'd have written a letter stating something like

Please find enclosed 2 years accounts yada yada yada

Our client anticipates that his contract earnings for the year to 2008 will be £X

That way i'd be covering myself, but suggesting a salary of the above could be achievable, given that the year has not ended yet? Given that no records would have been seen, it's simply a blind guess anyway is it not?

What do you think Eric?

PS Granted ML regs make things very difficult for us. However if we applied the full law on them, i'm pretty sure we'd have very few clients left!

[Eric Mc]

True.

Professional judgement is what it is all about.

But I certainly wouldn't lie on behalf of a client.

[scotal]

You wanted a member of a professional body to lie on your behalf, in order to help you obtain a mortgage fraudulently, and you wonder why he wouldn't do it????

This place stuns me sometimes.

[W4NTED]

scotal said:

You wanted a member of a professional body to lie on your behalf, in order to help you obtain a mortgage fraudulently, and you wonder why he wouldn't do it????

This place stuns me sometimes.

nothing fruadulent about this at all. Last years figures yes okay I needed a slight increase but even if he said no to that he should have put down what I wanted him to for 2008 - business is on the increase and I have no hesitation in thinking that I'll probably cross the £200k mark next year. The mortgage I wanted would have easily be given to me if he based his figures on what I wanted him to for 08. Another way of looking at it is - bigger house with a home based office would easily generate the required boost in income. I have clients waiting but an unable to help due to lack of a home office. BUT this tt was having none of it!

I know this is a public forum with all sorts on it and would have a high chance of getting flamed by people such as yourself BUT speaking to other people around me I understand that accountants can and in most instances will put down a porjection based on what their client tells them too...yes they could have a disclaimer in the letter saving their arses and telling the mortgage company to make their own checks etc etc

[UpTheIron]

W4NTED said:

Time has come to change my accountant as he's acting like a p*ick! I need an accountant with decent sized balls who would not be so shite scared of the Inland Revenue.

You mean using his professional judgement to not put his reputation on the line by recommending you do something you shouldn't.

W4NTED said:

My present accountant does not let me make any claims for meals etc (even genuine one's with clients!) as he doesn't recommend it!

What meals, and what benefit do you think you will get by "claiming" them? Entertaining isn't tax deductible, and if you think you are going to claim lunch etc then you'll find it isn't either in most circumstances.

W4NTED said:

Needed to apply for a mortgage recently and needed an accountants reference letter and the acted like the biggest w*nker ever! Okay I agree he would need to put in actual figures for the last two years of accounting, but my mortgage was to be based on my forcasted contract income for year ending 2008 - I needed him to jack up the figures for last year by £15k (nothing when I actually earn in excess of £150k per annum)and to project my income for 2008 with an increase of £30k. If he did this I could have had a very decent interest rate but he declined outright saying it's wrong!

That because it is wrong, you pillock.

W4NTED said:

Due to this I have had to go with a higher self cert mortgage rate which cost me more than his fee a month!

You mean you got the best rate you could, because you are stretching yourself.

W4NTED said:

arghhhhhh could go on and on but any IT consultants out there would know how fckin hard it is to get a decent mortgage with a decent interest rate and due to my "chicken accountant" I have suffered.

Really? I found it an absolute doddle.

Not half as much as you will suffer when you suddenly find you have taken on a massive mortgage, the house market has suffered a downturn along with the contract market and you are suddenly out of work...

W4NTED said:

I'd be grateful if anyone can recommend an accountant with some Balls!?

Any reputable accountant will probably tell you exactly the same as you have already been told. If you don't want to listen to their advice that is up to you. It's not an accountant with "balls" you need, but a dishonest one. And when/if the IR do catch up with you, you will find it is still YOUR problem, not theirs.

[W4NTED]

another one with his wise words of wisdom about a housing market crash - keep dreaming it's not going to happen (could have added in insult like you did above but it's not worth it with people like you)...and if you aint got the balls to buy the house you want that your problem not mine suppose you're one of those who spend all their money on their women and cars?

Edited by W4NTED on Monday 19th November 19:02

[scotal]

W4NTED said:

scotal said:

You wanted a member of a professional body to lie on your behalf, in order to help you obtain a mortgage fraudulently, and you wonder why he wouldn't do it????

This place stuns me sometimes.

nothing fruadulent about this at all. Last years figures yes okay I needed a slight increase but even if he said no to that he should have put down what I wanted him to for 2008 - business is on the increase and I have no hesitation in thinking that I'll probably cross the £200k mark next year. The mortgage I wanted would have easily be given to me if he based his figures on what I wanted him to for 08. Another way of looking at it is - bigger house with a home based office would easily generate the required boost in income. I have clients waiting but an unable to help due to lack of a home office. BUT this tt was having none of it!

I know this is a public forum with all sorts on it and would have a high chance of getting flamed by people such as yourself BUT speaking to other people around me I understand that accountants can and in most instances will put down a porjection based on what their client tells them too...yes they could have a disclaimer in the letter saving their arses and telling the mortgage company to make their own checks etc etc

The projection figures aren't fraudulent, thats fine, you may genuinely be in a position where your earnings have risen by £30k, and accountant's projections aren't at all uncommon (and I assume that they have to take those figures from the client). Upping your earnings by £15k from last years figures, that was fraudulent. Maybe it was the fact that you asked for this, which meant he wouldn't support you on the projection, after all its his PI, and his future thats down the pan should he be accused of helping you get a mortgage that was outside affordability.

[W4NTED]

Yeh but what are the damn chances of this letter being investigated..for gods sake i've got the income its just a matter of getting the right interest rate...the credit crunch has made the lenders tighten their criteria's..

Edited by W4NTED on Monday 19th November 19:15

[UpTheIron]

W4NTED said:

another one with his wise words of wisdom about a housing market crash - keep dreaming it's not going to happen (could have added in insult like you did above but it's not worth it with people like you)...and if you aint got the balls to buy the house you want that your problem not mine suppose you're one of those who spend all their money on their women and cars?

Edited by W4NTED on Monday 19th November 19:02

Maybe was a bit uncalled for, but sometimes I just want to at some of the things some people try and get away with. And I didn't say crash, I said downturn

Why ask your accountant to lie for what must be a hundred a month? Just pay off some of the loan and remortgage - try www.contractormoney.co.uk if you do - they were good when I needed a mortgage.

And no, I spent all my money on houses too...oh, and cars. What I didn't spend it on was mortgage company profits to then land flat on my face. I've seen those who have, and it's not pretty.

Edited by UpTheIron on Monday 19th November 19:22

[Eric Mc]

Do you know that, by law, he HAS to report YOU to the authorities for requesting this?

By suggesting to him that a fraudulent claim be made, he has a legal OBLIGATION to report that claim to SOCA (the Serious and Organised Crime Authority). For all you know, the authorties might already be aeware of what you intended to do.

If he HSASN'T reported you, he may have already cut you a big break.

I'm afraid the rules and regulations out there are MILES more stringent than they were even four yaers ago.

[W4NTED]

How can it be fraudulent Eric? They are projected figures I have provided based on my last years income + future projects lined up!? Yes okay one little crime was to ask for a slight increase in last years figures now I dont think I'll get arrested for that

Let me tell you all a little story - You have all probably heard of the mobile phone cartel fraud (if not google it!)..well i once knew someone who offered me to join such a cartel, I declined knowing exactly what it was all about - he was initially in to mobile phones and then went in to memory chips for mobile phones and he told me he was earning in excess of £250k a month!

Within a year and a half he moved from a very ordinary area to one of the most up market areas of England, he bought flats in Dubai, Hong Kong, Thailand and all over Europe, he bought a Continental GT, Azure and a top of the range Range Rover Vogue, Diamond Studded Rolexs were all over the place in his "mansion" - wife, kids everyone had rolexes.

I used to meet up with his family quite a bit but then stopped knowing that "one dat this guys gonna get shafted".....we met at a party again after around 2 years and he was like "see I told you to join me dint I" now I thought "in b*stard I aint gonna let him get away with this" so I called up the HMRC complaints line which was set up to give information on this specific crime....I think the trade is now dead as the HMRC have closed the loopholes but it's been over 6-8 months since I complained and he has packed his bags from England taken all his assets and now lives happily fully loaded somewhere in Spain - go figure who the HMRC are after? The don't seem to be interested in the people who are making the BIG BUCK.

I am sorry if I offended anyone on here but asking for a letter projecting my income doesn't make me a criminal

Edited by W4NTED on Monday 19th November 21:41

[Eric Mc]

Asking your accountant to put a false HISTORIC amount on a form makes both you AND him a criminal. Even if he didn't actually comply with your request, he will remain a criminal until he reports you.

That is the law as it stands at the moment, whether you like it or not. Whether you get found out or not is beside the point.

[W4NTED]

Relax - just got off the phone with him and he's confirmed that he's reported me I am now W4NTED

[Eric Mc]

It gets worse. he has now comitted a SECOND crime. Informing the person who has committed a criminal offence that he has reported you to the authorities is in itself a criminal offence (the legal term is "Tipping Off" ).

Yes, I agree, it's all mad.

Edited by Eric Mc on Monday 19th November 22:20

[NoelWatson]

W4NTED said:

Time has come to change my accountant as he's acting like a p*ick! I need an accountant with decent sized balls who would not be so shite scared of the Inland Revenue.

My present accountant does not let me make any claims for meals etc (even genuine one's with clients!) as he doesn't recommend it!

Needed to apply for a mortgage recently and needed an accountants reference letter and the acted like the biggest w*nker ever! Okay I agree he would need to put in actual figures for the last two years of accounting, but my mortgage was to be based on my forcasted contract income for year ending 2008 - I needed him to jack up the figures for last year by £15k (nothing when I actually earn in excess of £150k per annum)and to project my income for 2008 with an increase of £30k. If he did this I could have had a very decent interest rate but he declined outright saying it's wrong! Due to this I have had to go with a higher self cert mortgage rate which cost me more than his fee a month!

arghhhhhh could go on and on but any IT consultants out there would know how fckin hard it is to get a decent mortgage with a decent interest rate and due to my "chicken accountant" I have suffered.

I'd be grateful if anyone can recommend an accountant with some Balls!?

EricMc???????? I hope you understand - I run a legit Ltd company but surely I wasn't asking for too much!?!?!?

There can't be many IT consultants expecting a better 2008 than 2007! With CGT changes, small business corporation tax changes and downturn in banking - I'm dreading it.

[W4NTED]

I've got plenty of contracts lined up - drop me a line if you need any help

[UpTheIron]

NoelWatson said:

There can't be many IT consultants expecting a better 2008 than 2007! With CGT changes, small business corporation tax changes and downturn in banking - I'm dreading it.

I wouldn't go that far.

CGT changes will only have immediate effect on very few who were planning on winding up / selling etc. Depending on your business model (or more accurately, your methods of extracting money from your company) it won't have much effect.

CT is only a 1% increase.

Neither will have a massive effect for small companies in the short term IMHO [not that I agree with either change!]. The "downturn in banking" however, just might.

In the short term: Projects that are planned get placed on hold indefinitely. Must-do projects get stripped back to the bare bones.

In the longer term: People will think harder before starting big projects. Of course, once things stabilise it will all be forgotten and all will return to normal.

I'm not dreading it because I have planned accordingly...however given the requirement for a large mortgage, I'm not sure the OP will be quite so well off should he find himself struggling for a few months

[NoelWatson]

UpTheIron said:

NoelWatson said:

There can't be many IT consultants expecting a better 2008 than 2007! With CGT changes, small business corporation tax changes and downturn in banking - I'm dreading it.

I wouldn't go that far.

CGT changes will only have immediate effect on very few who were planning on winding up / selling etc. Depending on your business model (or more accurately, your methods of extracting money from your company) it won't have much effect.

CT is only a 1% increase.

Neither will have a massive effect for small companies in the short term IMHO [not that I agree with either change!]. The "downturn in banking" however, just might.

In the short term: Projects that are planned get placed on hold indefinitely. Must-do projects get stripped back to the bare bones.

In the longer term: People will think harder before starting big projects. Of course, once things stabilise it will all be forgotten and all will return to normal.

I'm not dreading it because I have planned accordingly...however given the requirement for a large mortgage, I'm not sure the OP will be quite so well off should he find himself struggling for a few months

I thought CT was going from 19% to 22%?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6473993.stm

Perhaps dreading is too strong a word, but after a good couple of years contracting, I have noticed the market in my area having a lot less jobs going - perhaps it is partly due to time of the year