Teamleader / Managing People / Annoying Member of Staff
Discussion
Recently been promoted to a teamleader of two people which will rise to three very shortly.
Im currently having trouble with one of them who feels a bit of a power struggle and trying to but in and make decisions above his station.
We were at the same level till I got put as teamleader which he hasnt taken kindly too. Iam the youngest one in the team(not by much. couple of years range) but have been with the company since I left school which is nearing 5years and have been within the department for 4years therefore giving me more experience within the organisation and I feel Iam the better worker. Im punctual, never ill, and work all the extra hours needed.
The lad in question has worked within our department previously but walked out in a bit of a huff when he was given a warning for attitude and sick days. We had a change of heart and took him back on after 2weeks when he had sorted himself out which was well beyond the call of duty. I have a feeling he has slipped back into his comfort zone that is just not acceptable. At every opportunity there is the quiet little jibes and just basic t
ttishness. The Systems manager has mentioned his behaviour to him but as the SysAdmin was off this afternoon he has just slipped and got back to his usual self. I dont mind the jokey sarcastic comments but there comes a point where its counter productive.
Short of dragging him into an office which is the likelyhood I will do tomorrow and show him the error of his ways are there any ways I could be suggestive that his behaviour is just not acceptable. The lad is on a very very strict 3months probation with a review in early Jan08 so he is literally hanging on by a thread. Im puzzled that he hasnt realised this and sorted him self out..I dont want it to get to the point where he is going to go because once he is working he can do his job very well. The two were left alone last week as I were on a training course but with this they got all work done( I had them do more work on monday upon my return than they had done all week).
So.. PH any ideas which I could try to sort him out or just techniques of putting people in their place?
No middle manager/useless tt jokes please and no I do not have a BMW 3series rep-mobile. Im 20 and feel I have already done bloody well for myself in the scheme of things up north!
Im currently having trouble with one of them who feels a bit of a power struggle and trying to but in and make decisions above his station.
We were at the same level till I got put as teamleader which he hasnt taken kindly too. Iam the youngest one in the team(not by much. couple of years range) but have been with the company since I left school which is nearing 5years and have been within the department for 4years therefore giving me more experience within the organisation and I feel Iam the better worker. Im punctual, never ill, and work all the extra hours needed.
The lad in question has worked within our department previously but walked out in a bit of a huff when he was given a warning for attitude and sick days. We had a change of heart and took him back on after 2weeks when he had sorted himself out which was well beyond the call of duty. I have a feeling he has slipped back into his comfort zone that is just not acceptable. At every opportunity there is the quiet little jibes and just basic t
ttishness. The Systems manager has mentioned his behaviour to him but as the SysAdmin was off this afternoon he has just slipped and got back to his usual self. I dont mind the jokey sarcastic comments but there comes a point where its counter productive. Short of dragging him into an office which is the likelyhood I will do tomorrow and show him the error of his ways are there any ways I could be suggestive that his behaviour is just not acceptable. The lad is on a very very strict 3months probation with a review in early Jan08 so he is literally hanging on by a thread. Im puzzled that he hasnt realised this and sorted him self out..I dont want it to get to the point where he is going to go because once he is working he can do his job very well. The two were left alone last week as I were on a training course but with this they got
all work done( I had them do more work on monday upon my return than they had done all week).So.. PH any ideas which I could try to sort him out or just techniques of putting people in their place?
No middle manager/useless t
t jokes please and no I do not have a BMW 3series rep-mobile. Im 20 and feel I have already done bloody well for myself in the scheme of things up north!You've done very well, keep it up.
I have a few suggestions, it's up to you whether or not you decide to take notice of my ramblings.
This kind of behaviour in the workplace is a little unprofessional and, while I'm happy to have a jovial and good humoured workplace, it needs to be caught and stopped now. Ultimately, it can reduce motivation in the workplace amongst colleagues, and may reduce productivity, which will reflect upon your leadership.
First thing: DON'T read the riot act just yet (leave that for another occasion). Take him to one side, perhaps get him a coffee (or something) and have a quiet chat. Make a point of commenting how much improved he was when he was re-employed, and then point out that his behaviour is slipping back below the standards required. Don't let the discussion escalate into an argument (I appreciate this can be tricky), and do what you can to keep it good humoured. Ask him what he thinks, and where he wants to go in the company. He may want your job, and thus you can discuss the hypothetical situation of you getting promoted again and your job being available. Point out, if you can without patronising him (unintentionally or otherwise) that hard work and a professional attitude get rewarded, eventually. If he's got any sense, the implication (of not doing so) should be obvious.
I wouldn't threaten the 3 month probation, if he's not intelligent enough to realise it's looming, it's his problem. If his work/attitude improves, great, if not, either kick him out at the 3 month review or give him a proper verbal warning, ensuring you stick rigidly to proper procedure of course.
Personally, if he's unwilling or unable to change his behaviour for long, I would have no qualms with replacing him. There are plenty of good workers available, many of whom have great attitudes.
Hope this is helpful.
I have a few suggestions, it's up to you whether or not you decide to take notice of my ramblings.
This kind of behaviour in the workplace is a little unprofessional and, while I'm happy to have a jovial and good humoured workplace, it needs to be caught and stopped now. Ultimately, it can reduce motivation in the workplace amongst colleagues, and may reduce productivity, which will reflect upon your leadership.
First thing: DON'T read the riot act just yet (leave that for another occasion). Take him to one side, perhaps get him a coffee (or something) and have a quiet chat. Make a point of commenting how much improved he was when he was re-employed, and then point out that his behaviour is slipping back below the standards required. Don't let the discussion escalate into an argument (I appreciate this can be tricky), and do what you can to keep it good humoured. Ask him what he thinks, and where he wants to go in the company. He may want your job, and thus you can discuss the hypothetical situation of you getting promoted again and your job being available. Point out, if you can without patronising him (unintentionally or otherwise) that hard work and a professional attitude get rewarded, eventually. If he's got any sense, the implication (of not doing so) should be obvious.
I wouldn't threaten the 3 month probation, if he's not intelligent enough to realise it's looming, it's his problem. If his work/attitude improves, great, if not, either kick him out at the 3 month review or give him a proper verbal warning, ensuring you stick rigidly to proper procedure of course.
Personally, if he's unwilling or unable to change his behaviour for long, I would have no qualms with replacing him. There are plenty of good workers available, many of whom have great attitudes.
Hope this is helpful.
How about thinking about this - do the opposite. To win someone on side embrace their ideas and give them praise and support them in what they do. If you do it well you can win him over and use his skills/ideas to the greater good. The alternative of reading him the riot act will do nothing to help hi, the team and the business. If you can, give him stuff to do - a small sub-project, some 'leading' of his own. Win him over, make him part of the group. Be positive - it's a powerful technique that can work highly effectively. It takes time and patience and some basic observation of him in the understanding of what makes him 'tick'.. Then use it to get the best out of him 
You'll never have anything but trouble from someone like this. Happily, it looks like he's busy shooting himself in the foot, reloading and pulling the trigger again.
Have one, (just one, to cover your arse with senior management, showing them you made efforts) serious discussion with him. Say nothing about his attitude (cos no-one responds to that) but tell him what changes you want in his behaviour.
Of course he'll change nothing except for the worse, which is when you tell senior management that you tried and find him beyond redemption. It's their problem then, which should be resolved nicely at his review.
I may sound cold and cynical, but I've been there, where you are now. Whish I'd had someone tell me this long ago.....
Have one, (just one, to cover your arse with senior management, showing them you made efforts) serious discussion with him. Say nothing about his attitude (cos no-one responds to that) but tell him what changes you want in his behaviour.
Of course he'll change nothing except for the worse, which is when you tell senior management that you tried and find him beyond redemption. It's their problem then, which should be resolved nicely at his review.
I may sound cold and cynical, but I've been there, where you are now. Whish I'd had someone tell me this long ago.....
drivin_me_nuts said:
How about thinking about this - do the opposite. To win someone on side embrace their ideas and give them praise and support them in what they do. If you do it well you can win him over and use his skills/ideas to the greater good. The alternative of reading him the riot act will do nothing to help hi, the team and the business. If you can, give him stuff to do - a small sub-project, some 'leading' of his own. Win him over, make him part of the group. Be positive - it's a powerful technique that can work highly effectively. It takes time and patience and some basic observation of him in the understanding of what makes him 'tick'.. Then use it to get the best out of him
That's not a bad idea, may definitely be worth a shot. Guess it's the difference between being an average manager and a good one.Not everyone will respond to it mind, and while anyone with an ounce of decency will leap to the challenge, I've come across a number of people in the past who'd just take advantage of you, and revert to type when you're not around/not looking. Some people just seem to be programmed to be take the proverbial regardless.
Just out of interest when did you / your team last have a night out? I know it's unlikely to seriously change the attitude of someone who is unruly or unwilling to toe the line, but it could change the whole dynamic of your team.. It cannot be underestimated at how well it sorts out problems and can bring people together. Maybe make out that it's "on you" as part of you being made team leader and you'll pay for drinks or something.. Or organise a few teams together - it puts faces to people on other teams / at the end of a phone / in another building and can also show people they have common interests/ground outside of just work. It might give him the chance to see you as a person as opposed to a former peer and now senior member of staff.. but junior in age.. It will also show people another side to people's personalities.. Just keep it simple. These sort of things definitely help with new members joining a team.. If you haven't been remunerated for your promotion, maybe ask the company for a few quid to boost team morale.. This would be in addition to a Christmas do.. People love it if they think they're getting something for free from the company and it can help bring people together. Or do something at a lunchtime - allow the time off and arrange things in a proper manner, i.e. at least 1 hour away. Doesn't have to be swish, but should give people a good time away from the office, but together. and of course arrange cover or make sure other teams know you're not there!!
In the end, it's not up to you - if you give him a chance and he doesn't take it the best thing would be to allow him to leave. It may well be that if it wasn't expressly pointed out when he returned that he was being given a final chance that he may feel that the company caved in because "they needed him"..
Let us know how it goes, it's absolutely the worst part to any job. I worked with a couple of teams where there was only 1 person who I had to deal with and they just seemed intent on not giving as much as everyone else. In the end they left, but it was managed in a way that made it look like they'd returned to their original post back in their country. It was very awkward!! Another team I worked with there was a known problem person - but the company were unwilling to do anything about them and allowed them to carry out tasks that they started to depend on with an ineffective manager above....
You definitely need a strong person above you, and keep them informed. Too many, these days, don't want to confront people or stir things up - in the short term it is easier, but in the long term they'll be taken for granted and have someone working for them who they know is inept..
In the end, it's not up to you - if you give him a chance and he doesn't take it the best thing would be to allow him to leave. It may well be that if it wasn't expressly pointed out when he returned that he was being given a final chance that he may feel that the company caved in because "they needed him"..
Let us know how it goes, it's absolutely the worst part to any job. I worked with a couple of teams where there was only 1 person who I had to deal with and they just seemed intent on not giving as much as everyone else. In the end they left, but it was managed in a way that made it look like they'd returned to their original post back in their country. It was very awkward!! Another team I worked with there was a known problem person - but the company were unwilling to do anything about them and allowed them to carry out tasks that they started to depend on with an ineffective manager above....
You definitely need a strong person above you, and keep them informed. Too many, these days, don't want to confront people or stir things up - in the short term it is easier, but in the long term they'll be taken for granted and have someone working for them who they know is inept..
Is there a danger that this person will run you into the buffers if you don't do something now? What I mean is that their probation is up in January. If you don't talk with him and document it, he may rightly claim in January that as nobody has said his work performance isn't good enough he should be confirmed in role.
I have had a number of staff over the years where it has been left too late to highlight and document the problem, and whe we have tried to get rid they have played the 'you didn't tell me I was doing anything wrong' card when you are then faced with extending the probabtion or confirming them and most organisations do the later. Invariably we have then had to live with that decesion for years to come until we have real ground to sack them.
I woukd try the above, but would have the conversation, remind him that his probation is still running and that you will document the behaviour and this conversation and see if you can agree some way where you can both agree what needs to be done so that the problem is no longer a problem and you will therefore be able to confirm him in January.
I have had a number of staff over the years where it has been left too late to highlight and document the problem, and whe we have tried to get rid they have played the 'you didn't tell me I was doing anything wrong' card when you are then faced with extending the probabtion or confirming them and most organisations do the later. Invariably we have then had to live with that decesion for years to come until we have real ground to sack them.
I woukd try the above, but would have the conversation, remind him that his probation is still running and that you will document the behaviour and this conversation and see if you can agree some way where you can both agree what needs to be done so that the problem is no longer a problem and you will therefore be able to confirm him in January.
I really wouldn't try to turn this person around by spending too much of your time on them- focus your time on your best people.
That said, go with your initial feelings- that it wasn't going to work out with this employee. If he can't take the warnings and expectations seriously, he has a problem. Make sure you involve HR at every step and follow all the procedures, don't let one bad apple affect the rest of your team for the coming months and years.
Good on you for looking for a solution, stick with it; these things are horrible to deal with but part of why you get paid unfortunately... keep your standards, and those of your team at a high level, don't let him set the tone!
best of luck,
Poly
That said, go with your initial feelings- that it wasn't going to work out with this employee. If he can't take the warnings and expectations seriously, he has a problem. Make sure you involve HR at every step and follow all the procedures, don't let one bad apple affect the rest of your team for the coming months and years.
Good on you for looking for a solution, stick with it; these things are horrible to deal with but part of why you get paid unfortunately... keep your standards, and those of your team at a high level, don't let him set the tone!
best of luck,
Poly
Edited by Polynesian on Thursday 22 November 14:27
thinking about this more... have a constructive chat with him about what's coming in Jan and show him that you want to see him succeed, and that it's in his hands to do so. Don't get sucked into any personal comments or accusation making if it's just one to one, keep it factual and objective. Just lay out the facts that are ahead of him if he doesn't change. I wouldn't feel like you have to drag this out. He doesn't deserve your time and the worst bit of these chats is trying to close them up. Just say what you need to say and then get out of there.
I take it the course that you were on was related to your new role. If so you will no doubt learn about assertive behaviour. Being assertive towards somebody you have known for a while isn't easy. In fact it's awkward. But it is necessary.
I used to work at a place that had teamleaders for the sake of having them (I kid you not). Most of them were brown nosers or not really good at the job they taken on for which was a kick in the teeth for the hard workers. Nobody respected some of them because they did not lead by example and were aggressive rather than assertive....and lazy buggers too. It got to a point where the company actually had a teamleader and a person below them because they did bugger all.
It may not be personal, perhaps he expects you to delegate too much onto your team. In which case it's just a question of reassuring him that you are 1st and foremost a team.
Otherwise you will have no option than to go down the route of discipliniary procedures.
Good luck.
I used to work at a place that had teamleaders for the sake of having them (I kid you not). Most of them were brown nosers or not really good at the job they taken on for which was a kick in the teeth for the hard workers. Nobody respected some of them because they did not lead by example and were aggressive rather than assertive....and lazy buggers too. It got to a point where the company actually had a teamleader and a person below them because they did bugger all.
It may not be personal, perhaps he expects you to delegate too much onto your team. In which case it's just a question of reassuring him that you are 1st and foremost a team.
Otherwise you will have no option than to go down the route of discipliniary procedures.
Good luck.
I agree with much of the above, in terms of explaining to him how his behaviour affects the team and so on. I would recommend addressing comments at his behaviour, not his personality. And ask questions also - people often switch off when told how to change, especially more junior staff who seem to treat work as a continuation of school, with manager in the role of teacher.
So not so much "you annoy other people" but "when you <whatever>, have you noticed how it affects your colleagues?" Observe behaviour, question to see if he understands, then explain consequences if it doesn't change.
Then fire his ass
My sugestion would be to explain to him on a one to one but informal what needs to happen *globally" within the company for it to make money, and what each persons responsibility and minimum standards of behaviour are required.
You will to have examples of the issues that you concerned about so that they can be discussed.
If this doesn't improve the situation then you must revert to the correct legal ways of parting company.
HTH
You will to have examples of the issues that you concerned about so that they can be discussed.
If this doesn't improve the situation then you must revert to the correct legal ways of parting company.
HTH
Interesting dilemma.
With someone like this, first thing tomorrow, I'd 'gang up' with him (against the Company) and explain:
If he fails, you fail so this gives you a bit of a problem.
At the moment would he not agree he's slipped back into his bad old ways which already resulted in a warning?
And if he agree's, what sort of position does he think he's putting you in?
You are are running out of options.
You are only as good as your weakest link.
It's getting a bit late but is there anything you can do to help him, ask him?
Otherwise, the situation cannot be maintained.
So the answer is clear.
If he doesn't give you sufficient reassurance, he goes.
With someone like this, first thing tomorrow, I'd 'gang up' with him (against the Company) and explain:
If he fails, you fail so this gives you a bit of a problem.
At the moment would he not agree he's slipped back into his bad old ways which already resulted in a warning?
And if he agree's, what sort of position does he think he's putting you in?
You are are running out of options.
You are only as good as your weakest link.
It's getting a bit late but is there anything you can do to help him, ask him?
Otherwise, the situation cannot be maintained.
So the answer is clear.
If he doesn't give you sufficient reassurance, he goes.
slow_poke said:
You'll never have anything but trouble from someone like this. Happily, it looks like he's busy shooting himself in the foot, reloading and pulling the trigger again.
Have one, (just one, to cover your arse with senior management, showing them you made efforts) serious discussion with him. Say nothing about his attitude (cos no-one responds to that) but tell him what changes you want in his behaviour.
Of course he'll change nothing except for the worse, which is when you tell senior management that you tried and find him beyond redemption. It's their problem then, which should be resolved nicely at his review.
I may sound cold and cynical, but I've been there, where you are now. Whish I'd had someone tell me this long ago.....
Unfortunately this is a very true post. It is easy to teach someone new skills and processes, but it's almost impossible to teach someone a good attitude.Have one, (just one, to cover your arse with senior management, showing them you made efforts) serious discussion with him. Say nothing about his attitude (cos no-one responds to that) but tell him what changes you want in his behaviour.
Of course he'll change nothing except for the worse, which is when you tell senior management that you tried and find him beyond redemption. It's their problem then, which should be resolved nicely at his review.
I may sound cold and cynical, but I've been there, where you are now. Whish I'd had someone tell me this long ago.....
Well currently im out of the country till tomorrow afternoon so Im not too sure what is going on today. Ive got a very strong feeling hes after my job. Friday was his attempt at a shitty smear campaign which failed due to his own ego and just not wanting to do anything.
I were moving some desks/pc`s around and were quite busy and any little thing I asked him to do was just a grunt and "cant you do it yourself?". Not very helpful at all as being on half day I were trying my damned hardest to arrange things and get the some jobs done.
I this week im going to try helping him out on jobs that he has got lying around and see if I can get him a bit more on side but if it fails im going to make it known im not happy at all with his performace. Id rather not go the HR route and get him stuffed but if needs must I will.
If it continues its not going to be good as Im getting another memeber of staff before the end of this year and him being in his current ways will not help getting the new one integrated.
Anywayll Im going to enjoy my last day in Holland with a lovely cold fresh beer and see what tomorrow brings
Thanks for the above replies as its getting ideas planted in my head to try
I were moving some desks/pc`s around and were quite busy and any little thing I asked him to do was just a grunt and "cant you do it yourself?". Not very helpful at all as being on half day I were trying my damned hardest to arrange things and get the some jobs done.
I this week im going to try helping him out on jobs that he has got lying around and see if I can get him a bit more on side but if it fails im going to make it known im not happy at all with his performace. Id rather not go the HR route and get him stuffed but if needs must I will.
If it continues its not going to be good as Im getting another memeber of staff before the end of this year and him being in his current ways will not help getting the new one integrated.
Anywayll Im going to enjoy my last day in Holland with a lovely cold fresh beer and see what tomorrow brings
Thanks for the above replies as its getting ideas planted in my head to try
Do you not have any one to one meetings on a monthly basis? That would be a good idea, the initial questions should be more like how do you think you are doing, where do you want to be, what can we do to help you achieve this - kind of thing, plus as others have said, praise where it is due. Then the second half of the meeting is where you (as the company) think he is, what you (both) suggest to put in place to get him where he wants to be. Kind of an action plan that gets reviewed every month. Then you have a fixed base to show what you have done, and what he has done and how he is progressed.
Its more like coaching as opposed to managing, it will work if he wants to fit in and work there. It wont if he is a distructive employee who basicaly wants to stuff you and get your job.
Its more like coaching as opposed to managing, it will work if he wants to fit in and work there. It wont if he is a distructive employee who basicaly wants to stuff you and get your job.
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