Troubles at sliproads...

[Miffy84]

Hi guys. This is just my second post in the forums though i've been reading for a while now, and the advanced driving topics have been enlightening. There's a situation that often arises on my daily drive I hoped some of you advanced drivers could shed some light on.

On my route between Bicester and Oxford (A41 and A34South) there are many short slip roads. Personally I tackle these (when joining the main carriageways) by entering them slowly and speeding up when I know there is a gap available for me. Unfortunately, most people potter onto them at 30-40mph to join a NSL dual carriageway and get stuck at the end of them with nowhere to go. My situation in question is when you are in lane 1 and have someone cruising at your own speed alongside in lane 2, and there is a car trying to join the carriageway at a speed/position that would put you in the same place at the same time by the end of the very short slip road.

Basically, do you a) slow down, or b) drop a gear and accelerate past the slip?

Personally, I tend to take option b) when appropriate as I've seen many occassions when both parties slow to a standstill by the end of the sliproad amidst much confusion!

Thanks in advance

Smithy

[Dogwatch]

Probably what you are after:

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

Dr Local wearing his serious hat (he has an alter ego on a rather different forum). Worth digging out his other stuff here too....

[BOF]

Miffy,

Someone more experienced than I will come along and give you better advice - but, in the meantime, I try to practise and teach my punters NOT to be anywhere near another car on approach from a sliproad to an A road or an M road.

You have more than enough things to think about controlling your car, without having to be concerned about the plonkers near you?

Create, and maintain, your own 'bubble of safety' ...it is so difficult, it's easy...with a wee bit of thought...sit back, relax, and look for the bubble...

BOF.

[Miffy84]

yeah, cheers BOF. that's how I always 'try' to drive on said roads. when approaching slip roads in lane 2, i always leave a gap for people ahead in lane 1 to move across if necessary. it was today on the way home, i had passed a few other slower vehicles before moving back into lane 1 (without even breaking 65mph) and there was a Toyota Avensis about 100yards behind me. he quickly caught up with me, but as we were approaching the next junction (i was thinking around 300yrds in advance), he was too close for me to move into lane 2. when i could see headlight glow coming from the sliproads i started backing off to allow him to pass and make lane 2 available for me. but he never passed and just sat alongside me. therefore i dropped into 4th to accelerate and clear the junction before cars began trying to join.

not read the full articles posted by R U Local yet. be interested to see what they state. very interesting so far!

Smithy

[brisel]

Hmm. Personally I wouldn't accelerate to get ahead of the numpty on the phone/sat nav in lane 2. I would just be reducing reaction time for everyone, especially the joining traffic. Drop back a bit or get into lane 2 much earlier would be the best way for me.

Just my humble opinion.

[LaSarthe+Back]

Welcome to PH! People asking questions is a great thing to see. Some may say "that was close" and forget about it, only for it to happen the next day, the one after that and so on.

By dropping a cog and accelerating past, you may have changed the "carriage-joiner's" interpretation of what you are doing. Say he has just checked where you are, then decided that he will join ahead of you. If you boot it, you will then enter the gap he may be planning on taking, making him choose a new gap to enter.

If forced to stay in lane 1, I would drop back, and plan for him to join at the speed he's currently doing. However, I would expect there to be a car or cars wanting to join at every slip road and plan accordingly. If no car appears, then fine, but you must have a plan for the unseen.

Activity on the road can be summed up in three sentences:

1. What can be seen
2. What can't be seen
3. What can be expected to be seen

Cars joining from sliproads would fall under 3 and you should plan for them.

Have you thought about signing up for Skill for Life (IAM) or RoSPA or other advanced driving courses?

Cheers,
Andy

[WeirdNeville]

The classic for this is the Southbound A3 at guildford - A very short sliproad on a left hand bend so it's only visible at the last moments if you don't know it's there. It's also uphill meaning that slower cars can't get up to the speed of the traffic very quickly. I've seen countless nearmisses at that junction, and more often than not there is a poor micra sat at the end of the slip with no where to go.

Personally I will always try and create a safe space for the vehicle to emerge into, so long as I have space to drop back a little. If I have time and space I will move into lane two t allow vehicles to join into a clear carriageay and bring themselves up to speed. If that's not possible, then I maintain my speed and course and let the other car find a gap later on. Sometimes there's nowhere to go, and it is their responsibiltiy to give way before merging....

[saxmund]

WeirdNeville said:

The classic for this is the Southbound A3 at guildford - A very short sliproad on a left hand bend so it's only visible at the last moments if you don't know it's there. It's also uphill meaning that slower cars can't get up to the speed of the traffic very quickly. I've seen countless nearmisses at that junction, and more often than not there is a poor micra sat at the end of the slip with no where to go.

I usually join the A3 at this junction, and it really is appalling for right hand vision until you get right up to the junction (and even then you're looking right over your shoulder). As it's the junction off the A31 it's quite a busy junction as well. However I'm not sure what could be done about it. Signs advsing drivers to pull over for it would only cause congestion in the right hand lane.

Edited by saxmund on Thursday 10th January 12:56

[saxmund]

brisel said:

Drop back a bit or get into lane 2 much earlier would be the best way for me.

The problem with getting into Lane 2 early - and I'm sure it's no-one on this forum - is that a lot of people pull over even where there is no need to do so and when it impedes the traffic in Lane 2. I'm sure this is one of the causes of congestion around motorway junctions. I usually drop back to leave a bigger space, but sometimes accelerate if there's non-one in front and it will clear the space quicker. However a lot of the time it's down to the joining motorists - they make no attempt to match speed or find gaps to slot into and just accelerate to the end of the slipway expecting someone to have made room for them. Often I find there is a half mile gap behind me but Joe Numpty is insistent on thrashing his Corsa to within an inch of its life so he can just about get in front of me. For some reason pulling in behind someone seems to be verboten.

[The Black Flash]

saxmund said:

brisel said:

Drop back a bit or get into lane 2 much earlier would be the best way for me.

The problem with getting into Lane 2 early - and I'm sure it's no-one on this forum - is that a lot of people pull over even where there is no need to do so and when it impedes the traffic in Lane 2. I'm sure this is one of the causes of congestion around motorway junctions. I usually drop back to leave a bigger space, but sometimes accelerate if there's non-one in front and it will clear the space quicker. However a lot of the time it's down to the joining motorists - they make no attempt to match speed or find gaps to slot into and just accelerate to the end of the slipway expecting someone to have made room for them. Often I find there is a half mile gap behind me but Joe Numpty is insistent on thrashing his Corsa to within an inch of its life so he can just about get in front of me. For some reason pulling in behind someone seems to be verboten.

Same as you - depends on what the guy on the sliproad is doing. Will usually drop back and "flash" them in, but occaisionally accelerate if they're alongside my rear quater.

[Get Karter]

Dogwatch said:

Probably what you are after:

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

Dr Local wearing his serious hat (he has an alter ego on a rather different forum). Worth digging out his other stuff here too....

What's become of R U Local?
Not seen a post from him for a long time.

[henrycrun]

I just hope he hasn't come a cropper overtaking on a LH bend........
(takes coat and leaves the room quickly !)

If its a sliproad that has been problematic in the past, I will be either checking it as soon as visible for traffic (I'm looking left) ready to anticipate a merge or if its busy, try to be in lane 2 well before the junction appears

Edited by henrycrun on Thursday 10th January 22:22

[Miffy84]

Thanks for all the replies guys. By 'short sliproads' I mean ones that meet the carriageway at 90degrees, then leave around 75 yards for cars to merge with the main carriageway. I ALWAYS try to ensure I can move into lane 2 IF a car enters the sliproad. However, in the situation in question, with the car hanging alongside me at the same speed, I was left with the choice to either jam on the brakes, have a collision with the guy joining the carriageway, or accelerate past the junction before the chap had chance to think he had a gap (at my current speed, we would have met at the end of the sliproad).

So really, with these VERY short sliproads, would I be better making plans to move into lane 2 well in advance? I passs around 5 of these twice a day, and would like to know how to ensure that I don't end up in the same situation again

Smithy

[saxmund]

To be honest I'm not sure if normal lane discipline applies on busy dual carriageways in heavy traffic, especially where there are a lot of junctions, as there often are on urban DCs.

For example, I used to commute from Newcastle to Durham on the A1(M). Through the busy stretch past the Metrro Centre and Gateshead, which has a lot of exits and (IIRC) only two lanes, I used to stick in the RH lane, assuming that the RH lane was for through traffic and the LH for joining and leaving the motorway, and local traffic which might hop on and off for one or two junctions.

I believe there were "stay in lane" signs which gave me some support for this possibly unorthodox interpretation of the Highway Code.

[saxmund]

Miffy84 said:

in the situation in question, with the car hanging alongside me at the same speed, I was left with the choice to either jam on the brakes, have a collision with the guy joining the carriageway, or accelerate past the junction before the chap had chance to think he had a gap (at my current speed, we would have met at the end of the sliproad)

I think I would have done the same, after all acceleration is more controlled than jamming on the brakes, which could lead to being rear-ended or at very least the car behind having the brake sharply. However, one option when approaching a junction when you really can't pull over to lane 2 is to ease off a bit, this increases the gaps and gives you a bit more time to react. However, although it's nice to show other drivers the sort of courtesy you would like them to show you, when it comes down to it, the joining motorist needs to cooperate - it's the cars already on the carriageway who have right of way.

[LaSarthe+Back]

Miffy84 said:

Thanks for all the replies guys. By 'short sliproads' I mean ones that meet the carriageway at 90degrees, then leave around 75 yards for cars to merge with the main carriageway.

Can you see the road on which they approach? The earlier you are able to see them, even if they do not see you, the better and easier it is to start planning.

[SLCZ3]

Miffy84 said:

Hi guys. This is just my second post in the forums though i've been reading for a while now, and the advanced driving topics have been enlightening. There's a situation that often arises on my daily drive I hoped some of you advanced drivers could shed some light on.

On my route between Bicester and Oxford (A41 and A34South) there are many short slip roads. Personally I tackle these (when joining the main carriageways) by entering them slowly and speeding up when I know there is a gap available for me. Unfortunately, most people potter onto them at 30-40mph to join a NSL dual carriageway and get stuck at the end of them with nowhere to go. My situation in question is when you are in lane 1 and have someone cruising at your own speed alongside in lane 2, and there is a car trying to join the carriageway at a speed/position that would put you in the same place at the same time by the end of the very short slip road.

Basically, do you a) slow down, or b) drop a gear and accelerate past the slip?

Personally, I tend to take option b) when appropriate as I've seen many occassions when both parties slow to a standstill by the end of the sliproad amidst much confusion!

Thanks in advance

Smithy

Driving on the motorway
259
Joining the motorway. When you join the motorway you will normally approach it from a road on the left (a slip road) or from an adjoining motorway. You should

give priority to traffic already on the motorway
check the traffic on the motorway and match your speed to fit safely into the traffic flow in the left-hand lane
not cross solid white lines that separate lanes or use the hard shoulder
stay on the slip road if it continues as an extra lane on the motorway
remain in the left-hand lane long enough to adjust to the speed of traffic before considering overtaking

The above should be applicable to most slip roads.

Unfortuantely there is a large proportion of the driving fraternity in the UK at present, who seem to think that the person joining a motorway, or similar, have the right that traffic on the motorway should give way, which causes interuption to the motorway traffic flow, and potential accident scenarios.
This is one reason why traffic lights have been installed on the slip roads to some motoways controlling the access from the slip roads.