Evasive Driving Techniques
Discussion
Just wondered everyone’s experience on evasive driving techniques / defensive/offensive driving?
I.e. any scenario's you’ve experienced or have been taught to share?
Understandably everyone should be driving to the road conditions and hazards but the roads aren’t necessarily accident free.
Child ran out in front of road
Car sudden pulled out from single carriageway national speed limit
Truck Pull out from motorway
Car being nudged from behind
Aquaplane
Black ice
And so forth...
Some entertaining videos aswell! Please add some more if you find any!
Tiff Needel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haJuwAINADI
I.e. any scenario's you’ve experienced or have been taught to share?
Understandably everyone should be driving to the road conditions and hazards but the roads aren’t necessarily accident free.
Child ran out in front of road
Car sudden pulled out from single carriageway national speed limit
Truck Pull out from motorway
Car being nudged from behind
Aquaplane
Black ice
And so forth...
Some entertaining videos aswell! Please add some more if you find any!
Tiff Needel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haJuwAINADI
I've had 3 "emergency braking" experiences.
The first was a few months after passing my test. Driving at 30mph on a frosty road when a van pulls out of a McDonalds to the left, right in front of me. Brain switched off, brake pedal and clutch slammed down. Skidded to a halt inches from the side of the van.
Second was after a couple of years of being interested in advanced driving, but only a few months of putting much effort in. At night doing 50mph on NSL country road, I knew there was nobody oncoming and no headlights on bend coming up, I knew there was a VW Golf fairly close behind and a pick-up truck very close behind him. Suddenly notice a large (van?) wheel and tyre on my lane in front of me (dark - so blended into road until very late!) I knew I could stop in time but if I did I would be the bread in a VW Golf sandwich. I braked just hard enough to make sure the VW would stop, knowing that I would still be doing 15mph or so when I hit the wheel. I was, and I did. No serious damage luckily and although I gave the Golf enough time to stop he wasn't so generous with the pick-up truck behind who skidded to a halt and just managed to avoid him.
I realised after this incident that although I was happy with my observation, I did not consider all options properly because I could have swerved around it if I was quick enough Cue some extra practice...
Third was on my IAM test
. 70mph on dual carriageway and a pheasant hopped out in front of my car from the bushes to my left, and just stood there, looking at me. I had done a mirror and hard shoulder check a second before and knew how much braking distance I had, hard shoulder was clear, but there was a car beside me in lane 2. I slowed sharply to 40mph before deciding I could either have pheasant for dinner or use the hard shoulder, which I did.
Examiner was happy
. I was happy I've learned from my mistakes.
If I keep improving maybe I won't even know the 4th and all subsequent incidents took place
The first was a few months after passing my test. Driving at 30mph on a frosty road when a van pulls out of a McDonalds to the left, right in front of me. Brain switched off, brake pedal and clutch slammed down. Skidded to a halt inches from the side of the van.
Second was after a couple of years of being interested in advanced driving, but only a few months of putting much effort in. At night doing 50mph on NSL country road, I knew there was nobody oncoming and no headlights on bend coming up, I knew there was a VW Golf fairly close behind and a pick-up truck very close behind him. Suddenly notice a large (van?) wheel and tyre on my lane in front of me (dark - so blended into road until very late!) I knew I could stop in time but if I did I would be the bread in a VW Golf sandwich. I braked just hard enough to make sure the VW would stop, knowing that I would still be doing 15mph or so when I hit the wheel. I was, and I did. No serious damage luckily and although I gave the Golf enough time to stop he wasn't so generous with the pick-up truck behind who skidded to a halt and just managed to avoid him.
I realised after this incident that although I was happy with my observation, I did not consider all options properly because I could have swerved around it if I was quick enough Cue some extra practice...
Third was on my IAM test
. 70mph on dual carriageway and a pheasant hopped out in front of my car from the bushes to my left, and just stood there, looking at me. I had done a mirror and hard shoulder check a second before and knew how much braking distance I had, hard shoulder was clear, but there was a car beside me in lane 2. I slowed sharply to 40mph before deciding I could either have pheasant for dinner or use the hard shoulder, which I did.Examiner was happy
. I was happy I've learned from my mistakes.If I keep improving maybe I won't even know the 4th and all subsequent incidents took place
Thankyou for starting this topic, finally somewhere to vent my anger and hopefully feel that my sentiment is echoed somewhere!
The most prevalent evasive driving maneuvers, in my mind, that I've had to perform have all been someone pulling on to the main road from a connecting T-junction, in the opposite direction to my direction of travel.
As a bit of background, I've been driving legally since 14th August '07 so not the most vast driving experience to draw from. However, I feel I've done well to still be driving the car I'm driving today. 3 times on the same country road, 40mph limit I have approached a T-junction, at which there is a stop sign for those wishing to pull onto the road, only to have someone try to pull out to turn against my direction of travel.
The first time a van pulled out in front - I braked, realizing I wouldn't stop in time I stopped braking and swerved to the middle of the road, the van couldn't have missed me by more than an inch. This time I beeped as a reflex - surprisingly as I had never had to beep before in my life.
The second time was a merc, or a jag, my memory lets me down, similar to the first one, only this time I had to swerve completely to the other side of the road. I beeped again but so did the other driver! That got my blood boiling, ever a time for road rage that was it.
The third time I didn't brake, nor did I beep but I did have to swerve again fully to the other side of the road.
On a separate occasion I was traveling at 50mph in a national speed limit country road, though it was a fast road and my speed was completely acceptable. Coming out of a sweeping left hander I noticed a 4x4 racing up a joining side road and come to a stop half way over my side of the road. This time I swerved to the other side of the road, had there been oncoming traffic there would definitely have been some form of accident. I was angry after that, unfortunately I was traveling too fast to gesture or beep.
Hopefully you'll agree that I wasn't in the wrong on any of these occasions, I try my best to drive sensibly, I won't deny putting my foot down on occasion (my little 1.2
) but there's a time and a place for that sort of driving.
Hope I wasn't too boring,
Cheers.
The most prevalent evasive driving maneuvers, in my mind, that I've had to perform have all been someone pulling on to the main road from a connecting T-junction, in the opposite direction to my direction of travel.
As a bit of background, I've been driving legally since 14th August '07 so not the most vast driving experience to draw from. However, I feel I've done well to still be driving the car I'm driving today. 3 times on the same country road, 40mph limit I have approached a T-junction, at which there is a stop sign for those wishing to pull onto the road, only to have someone try to pull out to turn against my direction of travel.
The first time a van pulled out in front - I braked, realizing I wouldn't stop in time I stopped braking and swerved to the middle of the road, the van couldn't have missed me by more than an inch. This time I beeped as a reflex - surprisingly as I had never had to beep before in my life.
The second time was a merc, or a jag, my memory lets me down, similar to the first one, only this time I had to swerve completely to the other side of the road. I beeped again but so did the other driver! That got my blood boiling, ever a time for road rage that was it.
The third time I didn't brake, nor did I beep but I did have to swerve again fully to the other side of the road.
On a separate occasion I was traveling at 50mph in a national speed limit country road, though it was a fast road and my speed was completely acceptable. Coming out of a sweeping left hander I noticed a 4x4 racing up a joining side road and come to a stop half way over my side of the road. This time I swerved to the other side of the road, had there been oncoming traffic there would definitely have been some form of accident. I was angry after that, unfortunately I was traveling too fast to gesture or beep.
Hopefully you'll agree that I wasn't in the wrong on any of these occasions, I try my best to drive sensibly, I won't deny putting my foot down on occasion (my little 1.2
) but there's a time and a place for that sort of driving.Hope I wasn't too boring,
Cheers.
nats1rt said:
People keep trying to drive into me
I'd be worried by that. What you're describing is exceptionally unusual and for it to have happened to you so frequently must suggest that you may be doing something to provoke it. For example it may be that they tend to misjudge your closing speed or not notice you. It may be that they are assuming you will slow down (being pushy) and that you are failing to react and blasting straight through regardless. It may be that in a line of traffic you're holding back and they are misinterpreting this as an invitation to go in front of you. It may be that you're misjudging the closing speed and in fact if you carried on they would have been clear by the time you reached them - by trying to drive round them you would then be *causing* the problem and putting you both at risk.I don't don't whether any of these are occurring, but I suggest you sit back and take a long hard look at the way you're approaching these situations because the problem you're describing is not normal.
It's not my speed, nor am I hanging back, each of these have occurred while traveling without traffic. I put it down to lack of care or attention from the other driver and I have been slowing for the junction. The only time I didn't slow down was when the person started pulling out and slowing down wouldn't have helped the situation.
I've started to drive with my headlights on, hopefully make it easier for people to see me.
I've started to drive with my headlights on, hopefully make it easier for people to see me.
nats1rt said:
It's not my speed, nor am I hanging back, each of these have occurred while traveling without traffic. I put it down to lack of care or attention from the other driver and I have been slowing for the junction. The only time I didn't slow down was when the person started pulling out and slowing down wouldn't have helped the situation.
I've started to drive with my headlights on, hopefully make it easier for people to see me.
I suppose you could just be extremely unlucky with those you're meeting on the road, but I agree with what Peter (GreenV8S) says. Maybe it needs a bit of further thought about what you may be doing to contribute to the problem. Sorry to sound critical, but do keep thinking about it.I've started to drive with my headlights on, hopefully make it easier for people to see me.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
There's a STOP sign at the junction for those pulling on to the main road and at peak traffic it can take a few minutes for a gap to appear.
I could slow down more than I have been to 30mph when approaching the junction but there's little else I could have done to avoid being pulled out in front of. It's not like I was bombing through and came round a corner to find someone pulling out, it's been people pulling out as I passed the junction, clearly having not seen me coming.
I appreciate the constructive criticism but I have to defend myself as I take pride in doing the right thing at the right time (that as well as being male
). Each swerve has been to avoid the imminent collision, when I was within meters of the junction, rather than tens of meters.
My original post wasn't really to see if there was anything I could have done to avoid the incident merely to vent my frustration at other people's lack of attention and concentration.
I mean this by no means as an affront but would the view that I was a contributing factor to the situation be different were I not a new driver?
I could slow down more than I have been to 30mph when approaching the junction but there's little else I could have done to avoid being pulled out in front of. It's not like I was bombing through and came round a corner to find someone pulling out, it's been people pulling out as I passed the junction, clearly having not seen me coming.
I appreciate the constructive criticism but I have to defend myself as I take pride in doing the right thing at the right time (that as well as being male
). Each swerve has been to avoid the imminent collision, when I was within meters of the junction, rather than tens of meters.My original post wasn't really to see if there was anything I could have done to avoid the incident merely to vent my frustration at other people's lack of attention and concentration.
I mean this by no means as an affront but would the view that I was a contributing factor to the situation be different were I not a new driver?
Edited by nats1rt on Sunday 9th March 14:44
vonhosen said:
Have you mentioned this to the local council highways department so that an engineer can look at the junction if it's proving problematic ?
No; However, they are aware there is an issue at this junction as there have been many accidents at it over the years (my brother wrote his car off there last year)May I add that one of the reasons I take care over my driving, especially at this junction, is due to being in the accident in which my brother's car was totaled. I try to take driving seriously as a result.
All these incidents happened at the same junction? I hadn't appreciated that. That gives us another common factor which is a handy excuse to exonerate your driving. I would encourage you to step back and consider it dispassionately though, because unless you're spending all day driving back and forth past this junction you would expect to be seeing dozens of other people involved in similar accidents every day if your behaviour wasn't contributing to it somehow.
Setting aside the issue of why they're doing, a lesson to learn is that you assume that everyone is going to pull out in front of you unless you have a definite reason to think otherwise. Don't ever rely on them having noticed you, understood your intentions and responded sensibly, because the one in a thousand who c*cks up will kill you.
Setting aside the issue of why they're doing, a lesson to learn is that you assume that everyone is going to pull out in front of you unless you have a definite reason to think otherwise. Don't ever rely on them having noticed you, understood your intentions and responded sensibly, because the one in a thousand who c*cks up will kill you.
I drive past every day on the way to school (2 months left, woo!!!)
Thanks for your comments, same thing my dad told me, defensive driving it's called? Whenever I see someone waiting to pull out I will them to just wait till I've gone past, that coupled with covering the brake pedal.
You get told you never stop learning despite getting your "full" UK license (first motorway was interesting - kept worrying about hidden speed cameras lol), hopefully I've learnt something from these.
Thanks for your comments, same thing my dad told me, defensive driving it's called? Whenever I see someone waiting to pull out I will them to just wait till I've gone past, that coupled with covering the brake pedal.
You get told you never stop learning despite getting your "full" UK license (first motorway was interesting - kept worrying about hidden speed cameras lol), hopefully I've learnt something from these.
just a thought, you say you slow for this junction & cover the brake. i find doing this causes people to pull out in front of me.
yes its the correct thing to do however considering the following.
your sat at a junction looking for a gap. there is nearly a gap except one car approaching who then slows noticably on approach to the junction - it'd be very easy to assume your taking the junction & not bothered to indicate. i've almost done it myself a few times so im sure its not uncommon.
maybe adjust your speed further back or with less deaccleration? possibly lifting off the power slighty rather than totally?
i've found from cars/bikes/coaches over the years that not only do you have to do the right thing yourself but what you do has to appear as what your doing to the other people around. I know others here have a lot more experience, so any comments welcome.
yes its the correct thing to do however considering the following.
your sat at a junction looking for a gap. there is nearly a gap except one car approaching who then slows noticably on approach to the junction - it'd be very easy to assume your taking the junction & not bothered to indicate. i've almost done it myself a few times so im sure its not uncommon.
maybe adjust your speed further back or with less deaccleration? possibly lifting off the power slighty rather than totally?
i've found from cars/bikes/coaches over the years that not only do you have to do the right thing yourself but what you do has to appear as what your doing to the other people around. I know others here have a lot more experience, so any comments welcome.
Sorry, it seems I'm not making myself clear.
People have been pulling out directly in front of me, i.e. not sitting at the junction waiting for a gap but getting to the junction and then pulling out despite the fact that I am meters from the junction (i.e. close enough to see the whites of their eyes) clearly driving past it.
I'm confident it's not that they're looking to push out in front of me as I have been too close to the junction on each occasion to get out in time - had i not braked and swerved, the nearside front corner of my car would have hit the offside front corner of their car. Hopefully that's a little clearer
People have been pulling out directly in front of me, i.e. not sitting at the junction waiting for a gap but getting to the junction and then pulling out despite the fact that I am meters from the junction (i.e. close enough to see the whites of their eyes) clearly driving past it.
I'm confident it's not that they're looking to push out in front of me as I have been too close to the junction on each occasion to get out in time - had i not braked and swerved, the nearside front corner of my car would have hit the offside front corner of their car. Hopefully that's a little clearer
Is the topology of the road layout such that you are getting hidden behind their A-pillar as you approach? Perhaps you could try positioning yourself differently in your lane, and/or put your headlights on before you come in sight of the junction (before, so that people don't think you're flashing them out).
What's it like when you approach the junction by the side road? Come up the side road and look in the direction you're normally coming from... what makes approaching traffic easier or harder to see?
What's it like when you approach the junction by the side road? Come up the side road and look in the direction you're normally coming from... what makes approaching traffic easier or harder to see?
It's not an easy junction to pull out of, granted, there is a stop sign there as a result. I don't hold any hard feelings over the matter and I do put it down to a simple mistake made on their part. (Having said that I've managed to pull out of that junction many a time without nearly causing an accident).
My car is dark blue clio (soon to be replaced) and I have taken to turning my headlights on to dipped beam on approaching the junction.
Cheers.
My car is dark blue clio (soon to be replaced) and I have taken to turning my headlights on to dipped beam on approaching the junction.
Cheers.
nats1rt said:
It's not an easy junction to pull out of, granted, there is a stop sign there as a result. I don't hold any hard feelings over the matter and I do put it down to a simple mistake made on their part. (Having said that I've managed to pull out of that junction many a time without nearly causing an accident).
My car is dark blue clio (soon to be replaced) and I have taken to turning my headlights on to dipped beam on approaching the junction.
Cheers.
Perhaps this is what you actually do, but I would suggest putting your headlights on before you come into the view of anybody waiting to turn out of the junction, rather than as you're approaching it. What I'm concerned about is the possibility of a waiting driver seeing your headlights come on, and taking it to be a flashed invitation to emerge from the side road. I know they shouldn't, but you never know. HTH.My car is dark blue clio (soon to be replaced) and I have taken to turning my headlights on to dipped beam on approaching the junction.
Cheers.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
I would bear the point about taking it as an invitation to pull out in mind... you would need to switch them on well before they can see you if you do this.
Having a junction near me, where people tend to be impatient has made me think about this in detail... it's a staggered junction on an NSL which crosses another NSL road, it's not totally blind on the busier side but it is hard to see further than 30m due to some tall hedges.
In my experience, a steady 45-50mph sees me well through the junction as people can take an approach that is too slow to mean you're either turning in, or letting them out. I have attended 2 RTC's where this has happened at this location.
Consider your approach speed, not too slow, try not to appear like you're decelerating too much, but obviously don't go storming through there as you will find the odd person who just isn't paying attention, or is being impatient. They are out there, but for this to happen so often (and please don't take this as a put-down) to a new driver, it suggests there are ways to modify your behaviour to make your intentions clearer to other motorists.
HTH
ETA - 45-50 sees me through that junction in specific... the safe speed will always vary depending on the view from the side roads (ie: how far they can see ahead)... plus numerous other factors.
Having a junction near me, where people tend to be impatient has made me think about this in detail... it's a staggered junction on an NSL which crosses another NSL road, it's not totally blind on the busier side but it is hard to see further than 30m due to some tall hedges.
In my experience, a steady 45-50mph sees me well through the junction as people can take an approach that is too slow to mean you're either turning in, or letting them out. I have attended 2 RTC's where this has happened at this location.
Consider your approach speed, not too slow, try not to appear like you're decelerating too much, but obviously don't go storming through there as you will find the odd person who just isn't paying attention, or is being impatient. They are out there, but for this to happen so often (and please don't take this as a put-down) to a new driver, it suggests there are ways to modify your behaviour to make your intentions clearer to other motorists.
HTH
ETA - 45-50 sees me through that junction in specific... the safe speed will always vary depending on the view from the side roads (ie: how far they can see ahead)... plus numerous other factors.
Edited by JamesFiesta on Tuesday 11th March 15:09
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