LS parts swap question

[Omerta]

2003 Corvette LS6 with winged sump. If I want to change the sump for the C6 LS2 version (no wings = more room for exhaust collectors, recognised superior design for track use) what other parts do I need from the C6 LS2. Dipstick tube, pickup, gasket....?

ETA - it's not in a Corvette any more, it's transplanted into a Cerbera.

Cheers
Don

Edited by Omerta on Friday 11th April 00:01

[Boosted LS1]

You may be lucky with the dipstick and tube and you could reuse the sump gasket. I'd double check the pickup though, it may be different. Once you see inside the pan you'll be unimpressed. It's nowhere near as sophisticated as the one you're removing and it's bound to be a lot cheaper to produce. That said I can see why the winged item won't fit.

[Omerta]

Thanks Mike. There's a lot of Googlable comment and reviews saying the C6 pan is superior to the C5, people swap it for the winged sump for no other reason than that, etc... I'm no expert and I've not seen either of them internally as you obviously have, but its dimensions would certainly make the exhaust routing a lot easier and it's only a 1/4" deeper so no change to the engine positioning required. The LS6 sump has already had its wings clipped (its the LS6 from Paul) to fit inside the TVR rails so perhaps that would reduce its performance anyway.

[Boosted LS1]

The later pan, if it's the one I have is just a pan with a couple of raised ribs in it. That's it, nothing else inside at all. It may as well be a camaro pan with a couple of ribs added to it. If there's something newer then this I haven't yet seen it. Of all the pans I have I like the split level big wing unit best (like Pauls). It's certainly the most expensive one GM made and at the time they claimed it's superiority over the C5 1 piece big wing sump which in turn was superior to the camaro unit. I just see pans getting cheaper

[stevieturbo]

Any sump swap will require a matching oil pickup pipe, and dipstick tube/dipstick.

Although you may be able to work with the dipstick and tube.


For a reasonably compact, albeit slightly winged sump. Check out the Autokraft one.

Yes, it looks cheap and nasty, and is made of steel with crappy looking welds. But at $400, it isnt too bad, and is decent in terms of oil control.

All the sump gaskets will be the same ( and of course re-usable )

[Omerta]

Here's some pics of the one I'm looking at:

[Boosted LS1]

^ Yep, those are the ones I have, impressive aren't they! Makes you wonder why those thickies at GM went to the hassle of developing both types of big wing pans. It'll be good in your application but I'm pretty sure it's all about GM cost cutting at the end of the day.

[Brummmie]

The batwing dipstick is shorter, so you end up putting too much oil into it, therefore it appears to use more as you've overfilled it, that looks really similar to the F-body sump that we have all used.

[Boosted LS1]

Brummmie said:

that looks really similar to the F-body sump that we have all used.

Yep, although the F body has a metal plate over the pan iirc. Makes you wonder if the F body item could be better given the metal plate costs extra money to produce and install. Call me an old cynic.....

[Brummmie]

Yep, it has the metal/tin baffle plate screwed on the inside.

[stevieturbo]

The only thing about those sumps ( pans lol...damn yank speak ) is they are very long.

Which I guess is a bad thing, for fore/aft oil control.

This is the cheapish, and nasty looking sump Ive ended up using.

Edited by stevieturbo on Tuesday 15th April 00:06

[Omerta]

stevieturbo said:

The only thing about those sumps ( pans lol...damn yank speak ) is they are very long.

Which I guess is a bad thing, for fore/aft oil control.

This is the cheapish, and nasty looking sump Ive ended up using.

How deep is it? The winged sump is 4.75" and LS2 5".

[Omerta]

Boosted LS1 said:

Brummmie said:

that looks really similar to the F-body sump that we have all used.

Yep, although the F body has a metal plate over the pan iirc. Makes you wonder if the F body item could be better given the metal plate costs extra money to produce and install. Call me an old cynic.....

One like this?

[Boosted LS1]

^ Yep, that's the fellah. A camaro (F body) pan. It's a little bit deeper then the vette item.

[Omerta]

These pics & specs copied from a thread on lsitech.com suggest the LS2 and F-Body pans are the same depth although the F-body diagram isn't clear on whether 5" is the deepest point. Only a 1/2" in it, if anything?

F-Body
Camaro / Firebird
Capacity: 5.5 qts
Oil pan , List Price $266.39: 12558762
Oil pump pickup: 12558251
Windage tray: 12558253
Dipstick tube: 12551577
Dipstick: 12551581
O-ring for Oil pump pickup: 12557752 (Same as Corvette LS1/LS6)


Corvette LS2 with filter:
Corvette "Y" (not LS7)
Capacity: 5.5 qts
Oil pan: 12581810
Oil pump pickup: ?
Windage tray: ?
Dipstick tube: ?
Dipstick: 12570788
O-ring for Oil pump pickup:?

[Brummmie]

I think the F body sump is the best for tight applications, especially if your trying to squeeze the exhaust past. That aftermarket sump is still a bit bat wingy so impedes exhaust route, on a Cerbera anyways.

[Boosted LS1]

Don, it is about 1/2" deeper for the F body. Certainly not much more and less then 1".

[Omerta]

Thanks guys - got my bid in...

[Omerta]

Just to close out this thread with some detail for future reference - parts needed to put the f-body sump onto another LS engine and have it all work together are below with pricing from Pace Performance who are happy to ship internationally. Some of these maybe are the same as my LS6 parts but I wasn't sure so ordered them anyway.

12598151 -1998-2002 Camaro/Firebird LS1 Oil Pan Pan
Part#: 12598151
Manufacturer Part#: 12598151
(Qty: 1 x $189.95)

12558253 - DEFLECTOR (windage tray)
Part#: 12558253
Manufacturer Part#: 12558253
(Qty: 1 x $19.06)

12558251 - SCREEN (oil pickup)
Part#: 12558251
Manufacturer Part#: 12558251
(Qty: 1 x $36.56)

12551577 - TUBE (dipstick tube)
Part#: 12551577
Manufacturer Part#: 12551577
(Qty: 1 x $7.97)

12551581 - INDICATOR (dipstick)
Part#: 12551581
Manufacturer Part#: 12551581
(Qty: 1 x $12.09)

The pan on ebay is now selling at the same price you can buy new for