Worn out or press on...

[dern]

My bike (2001 929 y2k blade, 35k miles) is starting to become unreliable. Although this is a relative term it's let me down a couple of times of late and work on it had turned from solely being preventative servicing to fixing stuff that's actually broken and much as I love the bike it's starting to get on my tits. Today I'll rolled up at work only to find the battery is completely dead and now I have to arrange to get the rac to take me home which will take hours, then I have to diagnose it and then fix the fking thing.

I love this bike to bits but I need to it to be reliable. Basically I don't know whether to fix it and press on understanding that in all likelyhood this is just a blip and hondas being hondas it will last forever or give it a miss, put it in the shed as a toy (track/sundays) and buy something sensible to commute on.

Thanks for listening

Mark

[hiccy]

I know you had problem with the forks, and now this. You could get this sorted and the bike could last for years without missing a beat. Or it could break down next week. You need a commuter to be reliable and buying new is no guarantee of this, just a lot more likely.

[N Dentressangle]

Having had to jump start SWMBO's Hornet this morning (see this thread), it's noticeable how much of the unreliability in older cars and bikes can be electrical.

It would probably be worth having a look at the electrical systems.

- are there any drains on the battery which there shouldn't be?
- is the alternator in good shape and charging properly?
- is the starter motor in good condition?
- are all cables and switches in good nick, and properly lubricated / WD40'd?
- is the battery old or past its best?

I wonder whether a weekend of pre-emptive fettling might help - its easy to get very pissed off with a bike for a serious of minor, preventable electrical problems, when the basic mechanics of the thing are still strong.

Edited by N Dentressangle on Monday 23 June 10:10

[dern]

N Dentressangle said:

Having had to jump start SWMBO's Hornet this morning (see other thread), it's noticeable how much of the unreliability in older cars and bikes can be electrical.

It would probably be worth having a look at the electrical systems.

- are there any drains on the battery which there shouldn't be?
- is the alternator in good shape and charging properly?
- is the starter motor in good condition?
- are all cables and switches in good nick, and properly lubricated / WD40'd?
- is the battery old or past its best?

I wonder whether a weekend of pre-emptive fettling might help - its easy to get very pissed off with a bike for a serious of minor, preventable electrical problems, when the basic mechanics of the thing are still strong.

Diagnosing it isn't a problem and I spent a full weekend getting it ready for a track day and normal usage and I didn't catch this. It's not a case of letting the bike go as it gets much more premptive servicing than most bikes do.

I'll get it home, charge the battery and then check the battery voltage to see if it's charging and so on... usual drill.

Cheers though.

[dern]

hiccy said:

I know you had problem with the forks, and now this. You could get this sorted and the bike could last for years without missing a beat. Or it could break down next week. You need a commuter to be reliable and buying new is no guarantee of this, just a lot more likely.

An attractive proposition is to buy a second bike which is cheaper to commute on and keep the blade rather than replacing the blade and putting all my eggs in a slightly newer basket

[black-k1]

Isn’t it a shame that the motorcycle world seems to accept a product life expectancy of 7 years and 35k miles for a ‘top of the range’ item form a manufacture with a reputation for reliable products? We should expect and demand better.

If the bike is already starting to pee you off and you need it to be reliable for daily commuting then the only answer is to replace it. Once you are pee’d off with a vehicle then even the smallest things that are not absolutely perfect (that you will happily forgive a new vehicle) will become a major source of irritation and frustration. Your 7 years of fun, reliable commuting will fade into distant memories and you will spend each journey just looking for what is going to go wrong next. Small ‘rattles’ and ‘clunks’ will, in your mind, become precursors to major component failures which will mean that, regardless how reliable the bike is from this point on, you will start to dread each journey.

But then, you knew all of this before you posted!!!! – Buy something new!

[hornetrider]

N Dentressangle said:

Having had to jump start SWMBO's Hornet this morning (see this thread)

Not to rub it in but my Hornet (98S, 21k on the clock) started on the 2nd thumb of the starter after sitting for approximately 4 months. Superb bike.

My advice to the OP would be to resolve the current gremlin and continue as I'm sure the Blade will continue to be reliable in the main. Mind, at 35k and 7 years old, its getting to the age where certain items will need replacing or refurbishing.

[dern]

hornetrider said:

My advice to the OP would be to resolve the current gremlin and continue as I'm sure the Blade will continue to be reliable in the main. Mind, at 35k and 7 years old, its getting to the age where certain items will need replacing or refurbishing.

The difficulty is that stuff wearing out and needing fixing isn't an issue as I can fix all this sort of stuff myself. The main issue is being left at the side of the road when I should be at work and then being without the bike until it's fixed. I suspect that I can't eliminate the former completely as even if I buy a new bike it will become a used bike immediately and these things happen. Having two bikes sorts out the latter though.

[Kiwi_uk]

black-k1 said:

Isn’t it a shame that the motorcycle world seems to accept a product life expectancy of 7 years and 35k miles for a ‘top of the range’ item form a manufacture with a reputation for reliable products? We should expect and demand better.

Dam straight!!!

black-k1 said:

Small ‘rattles’ and ‘clunks’ will, in your mind, become precursors to major component failures which will mean that, regardless how reliable the bike is from this point on, you will start to dread each journey.

Great thing for rattles and clunks is bloody good ear plugs Works a treat on the XT

[smack]

dern said:

My bike (2001 929 y2k blade, 35k miles) is starting to become unreliable. Although this is a relative term it's let me down a couple of times of late and work on it had turned from solely being preventative servicing to fixing stuff that's actually broken and much as I love the bike it's starting to get on my tits. Today I'll rolled up at work only to find the battery is completely dead and now I have to arrange to get the rac to take me home which will take hours, then I have to diagnose it and then fix the fking thing.

I love this bike to bits but I need to it to be reliable. Basically I don't know whether to fix it and press on understanding that in all likelyhood this is just a blip and hondas being hondas it will last forever or give it a miss, put it in the shed as a toy (track/sundays) and buy something sensible to commute on.

Thanks for listening

Mark

High mileage bikes do need a bit more love to keep them reliable, but the same goes with cars. My current road bike is a 02 GSXR near 40k, and the problems I have had mostly have been electrical. Mainly corrosion within connectors, which require a spring cleanout after sitting in the garage over winter.

And the generator which two of the windings didn't produce enough volts (the generator produces AC, three phase if I remember right, which goes to the rectifier making lovely DC for electrical system). Resulted in a dead battery was being drained by the electrics and spark plugs. If I was changing gear and using the brake, the current drain was too much for the duff generator and drained battery and the bike conked out. That was a fun 40 mile ride home I tell you!
Suzuki had no stock in the country for a few weeks, but I found a breaker up north that had one. But I enjoy getting my hands dirty, so I don't mind it. Besides, it justifies my expensive tool fetish habit I have

I have seen Blades/Hornets/CBR600's with over 60k miles on them - Honda's will happily do it! So I say fix it and keep it going. The mileage is going to scare most buyers away, and as a commuter it has paid for itself - so go talk to your Blade nicely, tell it you really do love it, and you are going to have a wonderful summer together, and you will be in it's good books again

"Buy a sensible bike for commuting"? After a nice powerful sports bike, will you be able to lower yourself to something, well, normal?

[Rick448]

I'd say fix it and you will probably have no more problems, if the mileage is a worry why not get a CB500 or similar, mine has done 56K and is still going strong, my ZX9R has 14k on it and will hopefully last me a long time yet as I don't get it crudded up all winter like I do with the Honda.

[dern]

smack said:

And the generator which two of the windings didn't produce enough volts (the generator produces AC, three phase if I remember right, which goes to the rectifier making lovely DC for electrical system). Resulted in a dead battery was being drained by the electrics and spark plugs. If I was changing gear and using the brake, the current drain was too much for the duff generator and drained battery and the bike conked out. That was a fun 40 mile ride home I tell you!

That's what's wrong with mine. The rac man said the battery was shagged and the charging circuit was not charging (below about 7k rpm). Rode the 10 miles to the local honda garage to get a new battery which got me home but everytime the revs dropped to anything sensible the clocks went dead and it started misfiring. Character building stuff.

Honda want £300 quid for a new stator!!!

[Rick448]

Are you sure it is that and not the rectifier? I think they are common faults on Hondas aren't they.

[dern]

Rick448 said:

Are you sure it is that and not the rectifier? I think they are common faults on Hondas aren't they.

I'm not sure yet. I'll diagnose it after work.

[smack]

dern said:

smack said:

And the generator which two of the windings didn't produce enough volts (the generator produces AC, three phase if I remember right, which goes to the rectifier making lovely DC for electrical system). Resulted in a dead battery was being drained by the electrics and spark plugs. If I was changing gear and using the brake, the current drain was too much for the duff generator and drained battery and the bike conked out. That was a fun 40 mile ride home I tell you!

That's what's wrong with mine. The rac man said the battery was shagged and the charging circuit was not charging (below about 7k rpm). Rode the 10 miles to the local honda garage to get a new battery which got me home but everytime the revs dropped to anything sensible the clocks went dead and it started misfiring. Character building stuff.

Honda want £300 quid for a new stator!!!

The way to check according to my workshop manual (from memory) for Suzuki's is to pull off the connector for the generator, and measure the volts produced on each phase at something like 4000rpm. The Blade has to be similar. If that is fine, then the rectifier could be the problem.

I think I downloaded a workshop manual a few months ago on my work laptop, I'll see if I can find it as I can't be arsed doing any work

[smack]

Hi Dern,

"Found" a workshop manual for your bike - got a FTP site handy? It's 46Mb

[dern]

smack said:

dern said:

smack said:

And the generator which two of the windings didn't produce enough volts (the generator produces AC, three phase if I remember right, which goes to the rectifier making lovely DC for electrical system). Resulted in a dead battery was being drained by the electrics and spark plugs. If I was changing gear and using the brake, the current drain was too much for the duff generator and drained battery and the bike conked out. That was a fun 40 mile ride home I tell you!

That's what's wrong with mine. The rac man said the battery was shagged and the charging circuit was not charging (below about 7k rpm). Rode the 10 miles to the local honda garage to get a new battery which got me home but everytime the revs dropped to anything sensible the clocks went dead and it started misfiring. Character building stuff.

Honda want £300 quid for a new stator!!!

The way to check according to my workshop manual (from memory) for Suzuki's is to pull off the connector for the generator, and measure the volts produced on each phase at something like 4000rpm. The Blade has to be similar. If that is fine, then the rectifier could be the problem.

I think I downloaded a workshop manual a few months ago on my work laptop, I'll see if I can find it as I can't be arsed doing any work

Don't worry, I have the workshop manual for the blade, thanks though

[dern]

smack said:

Hi Dern,

"Found" a workshop manual for your bike - got a FTP site handy? It's 46Mb

Very kind of you to look but I've already got the honda one. Thanks very much though

[Rubin215]

black-k1 said:

Small ‘rattles’ and ‘clunks’ will, in your mind, become precursors to major component failures which will mean that, regardless how reliable the bike is from this point on, you will start to dread each journey.

A workmate who was previously an RAF fitter told how newly qualified (and undoubtedly nervous) pilots would frequently report aircraft to have "unfamiliar noises from engine."
While every reported fault was always investigated, the standard term used in logging the action taken was; "Having listened to engine for thirty minutes, all noises produced are now familiar."

I regularly drive a 37 year old VW Beetle; if all the rattles and clunks it makes preyed on my mind I would be a nervous wreck!

The simple answer is ride it until it breaks down, fix it when you have to.

[smack]

dern said:

smack said:

Hi Dern,

"Found" a workshop manual for your bike - got a FTP site handy? It's 46Mb

Very kind of you to look but I've already got the honda one. Thanks very much though

Ah no problem. Page 16-7 in the Honda one. Check for short in the alternator. Mine tested fine, but the Suzuki manual says to also check the output AC voltage, which was duff on mine, and yours by the sounds of it.

In the specifications on page 16-2, it talks of capacity .421kW/5000rpm, which is probably the rpm it makes the peak AC Voltage.

I can check my Suzuki workshop manual when I get home and take a photo of the page for you with the AC test - the Blade and GSXR look exactly the same.