0w40 oil too thin for a tuned 1.8k?

0w40 oil too thin for a tuned 1.8k?

Author
Discussion

fergus

Original Poster:

6,430 posts

276 months

Tuesday 2nd June 2009
quotequote all
What oil are people using in their K series R500s, etc? 0-40, 10-40 or 15-50? Or something else.....?

what's recommended?

bikemonster

1,188 posts

242 months

Tuesday 2nd June 2009
quotequote all
Without any specific R-500 knowledge, I will jump in with some of that valuable free Internet advice...

In general, too thick an oil is likely to be more concern than too thin. Maybe it's a guy thing, but we tend to think of "more" in this case, pressure equates to "better". But it's flow that lubricates, not pressure.

When a car is cool oil pressure is at its highest, but so is engine wear.

On that basis, a 0-Something allows for better lubrication at start-up than a 10-something.

I can't imagine that a modern engine would need a something-50 oil unless it was being raced in hot weather, so I would be surprised if a 0W40 is too thin for a tuned K-series. Remember, it's the 40 that applies to the engine when hot; the 0 just means that the oil does not turn to molasses when the engine is cold. A 20w40 and a 0W40 have the same viscosity at operating temperature.

Disclaimers and stuff: I do not claim any special expertise, but this is a topic that I find interesting and I have tried to gather information and discard gumpf as I have learned. Apologies if I have told you stuff that you already know.

FWIW - I run Shell Helix 10w40 fully synth in a Toyota-powered Birkin 7, which I race in Cape Town, and have had no apparent problems. Usual caveats about anecdotal evidence and sample size = 1 apply!

ETA - Opinions on the subject of oil are usually held with the same force of conviction, and willingness to consider alternatives as opinions on religion. For all I know, I am guilty of this too, but I try not to be.


Edited by bikemonster on Tuesday 2nd June 12:56


Edited by bikemonster on Tuesday 2nd June 12:57

slight500

28 posts

191 months

Tuesday 2nd June 2009
quotequote all
I use Halfords 5w50 motorsport oil in my R500.Car is solely used for sprints / hillclimbs.Depending on when you go to buy you can sometimes get it 1/3rd off.

Piers917

558 posts

225 months

Tuesday 2nd June 2009
quotequote all
slight500 said:
I use Halfords 5w50 motorsport oil in my R500.Car is solely used for sprints / hillclimbs.Depending on when you go to buy you can sometimes get it 1/3rd off.
I use the same in my Superlight. It's the same as the Comma 5w/50 that Caterham sell.

Dave L

223 posts

253 months

Tuesday 2nd June 2009
quotequote all
Piers917 said:
slight500 said:
I use Halfords 5w50 motorsport oil in my R500.Car is solely used for sprints / hillclimbs.Depending on when you go to buy you can sometimes get it 1/3rd off.
I use the same in my Superlight. It's the same as the Comma 5w/50 that Caterham sell.
I use it too in my 1900 Scholar K series R500ish spec.


David Long

1,216 posts

180 months

Tuesday 2nd June 2009
quotequote all
bikemonster said:
Without any specific R-500 knowledge, I will jump in with some of that valuable free Internet advice...

In general, too thick an oil is likely to be more concern than too thin. Maybe it's a guy thing, but we tend to think of "more" in this case, pressure equates to "better". But it's flow that lubricates, not pressure.



Edited by bikemonster on Tuesday 2nd June 12:56


Edited by bikemonster on Tuesday 2nd June 12:57
This is good advice. Also: the pressure relief in the oil filters is usually quite low and so the thicker the oil the more likely that oil is not being filtered, particularly when cold. It also means than any crap on the dirty side can find its was into the engine. If you want a fright, then cut an old oil filter open and have a look!

Having said that I use a the Halfords 5W50 at it's what Caterham spec for my car.

bikemonster

1,188 posts

242 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2009
quotequote all
Now I'm intrigued.

Does anybody know why Caterham spec a W50 for the K-engined R500?

Was there a similarly powerful K-series used in any version of the Elise/Exige? What oil was spec'd for that?

Thanks (and apologies for a slight thread hi-jack)

James

fergus

Original Poster:

6,430 posts

276 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2009
quotequote all
Dave Andrews suggested a 5-40 will be fine, as the hot viscosity will be OK at 40W, but 0W may be slightly thin.

thanks for the replies chaps. Halfrauds may get a visit. If I can find some suitable oil in Costco with the relevant API or SAE code (SL, SM, etc) then I'll bang some of that in (means 500 mile oil changes don't become so prohibitive).

bikemonster

1,188 posts

242 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2009
quotequote all
I know that Dave Andrews is revered as being godlike among Caterham circles, and with good reason, whereas I am some anonymous forum guy, but a 0w40 and a 5w40 have exactly the same viscosity at high temperature.

At cold temperatures (i.e., startup), a 0w40 is slightly thinner.

fergus

Original Poster:

6,430 posts

276 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2009
quotequote all
bikemonster said:
I know that Dave Andrews is revered as being godlike among Caterham circles, and with good reason, whereas I am some anonymous forum guy, but a 0w40 and a 5w40 have exactly the same viscosity at high temperature.

At cold temperatures (i.e., startup), a 0w40 is slightly thinner.
Thanks. Aware of the heat ranges. Dave built my engine, that's why I asked him!

bikemonster

1,188 posts

242 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2009
quotequote all
fergus said:
bikemonster said:
I know that Dave Andrews is revered as being godlike among Caterham circles, and with good reason, whereas I am some anonymous forum guy, but a 0w40 and a 5w40 have exactly the same viscosity at high temperature.

At cold temperatures (i.e., startup), a 0w40 is slightly thinner.
Thanks. Aware of the heat ranges. Dave built my engine, that's why I asked him!
It's also why, if I were you, I'd also be following his advice. smile

James


dino ferrana

791 posts

253 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2009
quotequote all
Caterham had the 50 oil developed for them by Comma and then it was sold under the Halford banner later (I think Comma make all their own brand oil).

The Elise never had an engine as powerful as the R500 (230 bhp). They did a limited number of VHPD engined cars with 190bhp that were SVA only, the fully production ones only had 177bhp after being strangled to meet emissions regs.

taffyracer

2,093 posts

244 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2009
quotequote all
Mobil 1 0-40 for me, i think alot of this also has to do with the quality of the fluid in the 1st place, film strength's vary even with similar viscosity

Edited by taffyracer on Wednesday 3rd June 22:54

Ult-Jim

624 posts

191 months

Thursday 4th June 2009
quotequote all
For road use in warmer climates of South France I use Caterham's 5w50 Fully Synthetic in my R500. Its first oil change was at 500 miles + plugs and second oil change recently completed at 2,700 miles. Plan for another oil change at approximately 4,000 miles. Is that too extreme? I really don't know. Filter changes everytime of course. That oil was recommended by the guy who sold me the car, by caterham and Minster, sorry I don't know why though to answer the original question.

James.