Discussion
I'll soon be looking for a fast estate car.
Originally I had thoughts of getting an old-ish RS4, 2.7 biturbo model.
Then I spotted how much cheaper S4s of the same vintage are - maybe 7k vs 14k for a high mileage year 2000 car.
Is the RS4 really that much better?
Originally I had thoughts of getting an old-ish RS4, 2.7 biturbo model.
Then I spotted how much cheaper S4s of the same vintage are - maybe 7k vs 14k for a high mileage year 2000 car.
Is the RS4 really that much better?
Edited by NDT on Wednesday 24th June 18:32
S4 (which I run) is such a bargain car now, but with the RS4 prices lower than ever, in your position I would be going for the RS.
Unless you are going for a low mileage, mint S4 example (in which case you could buy mine) they are toally different price ranges though, with the S4 being great value if your budget doesn't stretch the gap.
Or keep your eye out for a well upgraded S4. With a competent K04 upgrade the S4 can run more power than a even a remapped RS4 and prices fall nicely between the two. There are a surprising number of examples out there, not all of them good though.
Try both and go with which one you like for the outlay. The 2.7tt in either car is amazing. Not driven an RS4 but think there is little that will give the you kick mid revs like a B5 S4 and the relentless pull in any gear, particularly a remapped example.
Have a read on www.audisrs.com hwere there is a big B5 S/RS community.
Unless you are going for a low mileage, mint S4 example (in which case you could buy mine) they are toally different price ranges though, with the S4 being great value if your budget doesn't stretch the gap.
Or keep your eye out for a well upgraded S4. With a competent K04 upgrade the S4 can run more power than a even a remapped RS4 and prices fall nicely between the two. There are a surprising number of examples out there, not all of them good though.
Try both and go with which one you like for the outlay. The 2.7tt in either car is amazing. Not driven an RS4 but think there is little that will give the you kick mid revs like a B5 S4 and the relentless pull in any gear, particularly a remapped example.
Have a read on www.audisrs.com hwere there is a big B5 S/RS community.
Come to www.gtiinternational.co.uk this weekend and have a look at a few and speak to some owners.
great day out!
great day out!
A good question and one that I had to chooose myself only very recently.
Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
I have owned a B5 S4 and now have a B5 RS4, and both cars are very good, but both display the same sort of faults, clunky gearbox, variable power in hot weather, bogging down that sort of thing. Plus you can tune an S4 to be more powerful than an RS4, but you can also tune the RS4, so it is a bit of swings and roundabouts.
Obviously the RS4 is avant only whereas the S4 could be saloon or avant.
If you get the S4 you are missing out on the super cool body kit of the RS4 and the rarity factor, but have 100bhp less out of the box to play with, however in the real world, it isn't that far behind in terms of performance over the RS4.
I dont think running costs will be much different unless things start blowing up, but check the insurance also, I was quoted less for the RS4 than an S4!
Personally I like the RS4 over the S4, but only because of the wider body and as it is rarer is likely to hold its value better in the long term.
Now if you are thinking B7 S4 that is a different proposition, but just bear in mind it is very hard to tune the V8 whereas the 2.7 can be tuned to nutter power very easily!
Obviously the RS4 is avant only whereas the S4 could be saloon or avant.
If you get the S4 you are missing out on the super cool body kit of the RS4 and the rarity factor, but have 100bhp less out of the box to play with, however in the real world, it isn't that far behind in terms of performance over the RS4.
I dont think running costs will be much different unless things start blowing up, but check the insurance also, I was quoted less for the RS4 than an S4!
Personally I like the RS4 over the S4, but only because of the wider body and as it is rarer is likely to hold its value better in the long term.
Now if you are thinking B7 S4 that is a different proposition, but just bear in mind it is very hard to tune the V8 whereas the 2.7 can be tuned to nutter power very easily!
Edited by Seez on Thursday 25th June 14:46
TonyHetherington said:
A good question and one that I had to chooose myself only very recently.
Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
Good points.Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
I'm very flexible on budget - I genuinely might spend anywhere between 5 and 18k.
When you think about it in your budget terms, the 15k B7 S4 definitely appeals more than an older B5 RS4....
But overall, turbo power appeals, so I'll probably be after the B5 S4 - much cheaper plus a lot more discrete (occasionally I leave my car overnight in a station car park with no security).
Seez said:
You are of course in RS6 territory at that sort of money, that is very subtle indeed, I did consider one, but dropped it because of the auto box and I think if they go wrong they can be very expensive.
Good point... probably a bit bigger than I was thinking.... but maybe....NDT said:
TonyHetherington said:
A good question and one that I had to chooose myself only very recently.
Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
Good points.Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
I'm very flexible on budget - I genuinely might spend anywhere between 5 and 18k.
When you think about it in your budget terms, the 15k B7 S4 definitely appeals more than an older B5 RS4....
But overall, turbo power appeals, so I'll probably be after the B5 S4 - much cheaper plus a lot more discrete (occasionally I leave my car overnight in a station car park with no security).
)mel said:
NDT said:
TonyHetherington said:
A good question and one that I had to chooose myself only very recently.
Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
Good points.Budget is key I think.
I had around £15k to spend. An RS4 was logical, but I'd have been looking at a 10+ yr old car with 370bhp. I certainly couldn't have afforded the B7 shape (still high £20k's). So the S4 was a '54 plate, so only 4yrs old, and had a much more modern interior with only 30bhp less than the RS4.
The S4 continues to impress me, - that 4.2 v8 engine is just superb - and the level of kit it comes with is huge, as well as looking very modern still where (in my humble opinion) the old B5 RS4 does look a little dated. In a classy, retro way, but I was looking for more modern.
So - don't be put off by the S4 just because it has no " R " - it's only 30bhp difference and yet still a cracking cracking car.
I'm very flexible on budget - I genuinely might spend anywhere between 5 and 18k.
When you think about it in your budget terms, the 15k B7 S4 definitely appeals more than an older B5 RS4....
But overall, turbo power appeals, so I'll probably be after the B5 S4 - much cheaper plus a lot more discrete (occasionally I leave my car overnight in a station car park with no security).
)It's a fully specced Manual Estate (the best) with virtually every option and the V8 is just mind bogglingly good, I drove my old bosses B5 RS4 and it was no where near as good.
Also you may want to consider the running costs, I looked into it and basically the B6 S4 just runs a normal Audi service schedule (24K intervals) whereas the RS4 particularly the B5 require alot more attention.
Fort Jefferson said:
The thing to remember about the B6S4 is. No cambelts, no turbos, no DRC and no FSi. They are the things that go wrong, and cost money.
Yeah, I was speaking to a technician at an Audi dealer about the engine in mine when we were testing the shocks and he said he didn't know anything about the engine as he has never had to take one out or take one apart.Mine's done 80K now and I don't worry in the slightest, just keep it serviced.
T89 Callan said:
Fort Jefferson said:
The thing to remember about the B6S4 is. No cambelts, no turbos, no DRC and no FSi. They are the things that go wrong, and cost money.
Yeah, I was speaking to a technician at an Audi dealer about the engine in mine when we were testing the shocks and he said he didn't know anything about the engine as he has never had to take one out or take one apart.Mine's done 80K now and I don't worry in the slightest, just keep it serviced.
This is what they look like.....
Fort Jefferson said:
T89 Callan said:
Fort Jefferson said:
The thing to remember about the B6S4 is. No cambelts, no turbos, no DRC and no FSi. They are the things that go wrong, and cost money.
Yeah, I was speaking to a technician at an Audi dealer about the engine in mine when we were testing the shocks and he said he didn't know anything about the engine as he has never had to take one out or take one apart.Mine's done 80K now and I don't worry in the slightest, just keep it serviced.
This is what they look like.....
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