Utility cost in Florida

[warmfuzzies]

Folks,

Looking to buy a townhouse in Orlando, and have been given an outline number of costs by the management company over there who look after a number of clients houses, if I give a breakdown, can you sugest if they are reasonable or not, some like the maint costs are fixed, no negotiation, but I guess items like the phone I could always charge as an extra for rentals.

Its not a scheme for me to make millions, but largely capital growth, so go easy on me.

Thanks

Kevin

[Matt Harper]

Not sure I understand your intentions. Is this a proposed long-term rental property or a vacation let?

[warmfuzzies]

Matt Harper said:

Not sure I understand your intentions. Is this a proposed long-term rental property or a vacation let?

Vacation let, with us using it inbetween.

Thanks.

Kevin

[saleen836]

I have a place over there so list me your breakdown of costs and I will let you know.
If you charge guests extra to use the phone you will find prospective guests put off by this.

Edited by saleen836 on Friday 31st July 16:00

[Matt Harper]

A townhouse - actually in Orlando, or out by the attractions? i.e. zoned for short-term rental. In Orange, Polk or Lake - or other county? Property tax bands vary greatly from county to county - as do short-term letting regs.
What square footage? Pool? How many floor levels? Garage? Shared amenities?
Give us something to work with.

[warmfuzzies]

Ok, something to work with, sorry for being vague, its just my way of starting things.

In Orlando, 2 miles or so from Disney, a townhouse on 2 floors, 3 bedrooms on upper floor, about 1300 sq ft, splash pool about 4ft deep 10x10 roughly. built in 06, 2 bathrooms. Private gated community. No garage, shared twin pools in main complex, club house and gym etc.

surely enough for the time being? :-)

Kevin.

Edited by warmfuzzies on Friday 31st July 21:21

[Matt Harper]

OK - so not in Orlando then, from a property tax assessment POV. Is the property located in Orange County - or Osceola, or Polk? County location makes a big property tax and insurance difference.
I live in the metro Orlando area. In terms of utility costs, I can share the following with you.
Bear in mind that I live in the property rather than vacation in it. (Consequently, I turn the lights off when I'm not using them - don't have my pool heater on full blast in the height of the summer - or leave all the sliding doors open so that my HVAC tries to cool the entire state etc. These are things that folks on vacation tend to do).
My home is 2600sq ft and all electric. Power is provided by Progress Energy. My monthly power bills vary from $300 in 'winter' to around $450 during the summer months. Most of this consumption is my HVAC system and pool pump. My water comes from OUC and costs around $100 per month in the summer and $150 in the winter (diff. mainly due to lawn irrigation).
My combined TV/internet service comes from Brighthouse and costs about $120 per month. I use Vonage for phone service (which is for nowt - say $25 per month).
My property taxes come out around $4600 pa. That includes my homestead exemption, which you will not be able to apply, given the rental status. (Without this exemption, it would be closer to $6k) That said, my place is detatched and in a quite nice area, which also affects the assessment. My home/contents/hurricane/flood insurance is around $1700 pa. I don't pay for lawn or pool service, because I do those chores myself - but if I did, it would amount to about $150 a month combined.
I think I've covered the basics - let me know if you need anything else - but as stated, a lot depends on which county your property is in - and how much of community fees are shared.
Is there an HOA, for instance? HOA's are robbing bds, in my experience.

[Deva Link]

Jeepers - that's a lot of (pretty well) fixed cost.

[warmfuzzies]

Matt Harper said:

OK - so not in Orlando then, from a property tax assessment POV. Is the property located in Orange County - or Osceola, or Polk? County location makes a big property tax and insurance difference.
I live in the metro Orlando area. In terms of utility costs, I can share the following with you.
Bear in mind that I live in the property rather than vacation in it. (Consequently, I turn the lights off when I'm not using them - don't have my pool heater on full blast in the height of the summer - or leave all the sliding doors open so that my HVAC tries to cool the entire state etc. These are things that folks on vacation tend to do).
My home is 2600sq ft and all electric. Power is provided by Progress Energy. My monthly power bills vary from $300 in 'winter' to around $450 during the summer months. Most of this consumption is my HVAC system and pool pump. My water comes from OUC and costs around $100 per month in the summer and $150 in the winter (diff. mainly due to lawn irrigation).
My combined TV/internet service comes from Brighthouse and costs about $120 per month. I use Vonage for phone service (which is for nowt - say $25 per month).
My property taxes come out around $4600 pa. That includes my homestead exemption, which you will not be able to apply, given the rental status. (Without this exemption, it would be closer to $6k) That said, my place is detatched and in a quite nice area, which also affects the assessment. My home/contents/hurricane/flood insurance is around $1700 pa. I don't pay for lawn or pool service, because I do those chores myself - but if I did, it would amount to about $150 a month combined.
I think I've covered the basics - let me know if you need anything else - but as stated, a lot depends on which county your property is in - and how much of community fees are shared.
Is there an HOA, for instance? HOA's are robbing bds, in my experience.

Looking at your figures, I'm pretty close to that on the figures the management company have given me as examples of what their other clients pay.
The property is in Osceola.

HOA is 862/qtr.......yep robbing is a phrase I could envisage.

Thanks for the honest answers.

Kevin

[Matt Harper]

Deva Link said:

Jeepers - that's a lot of (pretty well) fixed cost.

It's all relative, I suppose.
The mitigating factor is that I probably pay half of what you do, proportionally, in income and sales taxes.
Additionally, if I teleported my property to a civilised neighborhood in UK it would cost, at the very minimum, twice as much to buy in the first place, so I think it kind of evens-out.

[Matt Harper]

warmfuzzies said:

Looking at your figures, I'm pretty close to that on the figures the management company have given me as examples of what their other clients pay.
The property is in Osceola.

HOA is 862/qtr.......yep robbing is a phrase I could envisage.

Thanks for the honest answers.

Kevin

You're very welcome, Kevin.
If it's any consolation Osceola is less punitive than Orange, when it comes to property tax.
By the sound of things, you are doing some extensive research - and so you should.
I have no personal experience of vacation letting, but I know a few UK residents who have experienced this - and there are lots of potential pitfalls.
As you will be aware, the local economy is on it's arse right now - but there is still an utterly gigantic amount of competition in the vacation rental market. The surplus of property vs demand is a bit scary. I'm not certain that this is quite the time to embark on a project like this - unless you have a nice big financial cushion that will comfortably see you through lean times (i.e. no bookings). There are many, many landlords offering 5 bed pool homes in Kissimmee and around Davenport for 3-400 quid a week.
Beware of American property management companies, because some of them will tell you absolutely anything to get money out of you. It really is like the wild west when it comes to business practices.
Just a thought, but you might want to consider buying a residential property, away from the tourons - and look at a long-term rental option. This is a growing sector, due to idiots who bit-off more than they could chew during the recent boom and then got foreclosed on, who are still employed, have families and need somewhere to live - in established neighborhoods, with schools etc. Maybe more trouble than it's worth, but perhaps an option that pays the bills with more continuity - and if you buy right, is likely to be worth more, faster, if and when this slump starts to turn around again.

[Deva Link]

If you haven't looked already, have a look at the forums on http://www.thedibb.co.uk - there are a number of owners on there.

My BIL has a 4 bed villa off Highway27 (a little north of I-192) kind of at the back of WDW but that makes it a fair old distance from anything else. We've been to WDW maybe a dozen times since he bought the villa but have never stayed in it - we much prefer "on-property" WDW hotels, although I can see the attraction of villas.

He really struggled in the rental market and took it off altogether about 3 years ago as it was being so little utilised that the cost of keeping it up to standard with wear and tear plus the management company fees etc meant it just wasn't worthwhile vs the pretty low amounts they were having to accept to get bookings. I know they hoped to more or less break even but they're way, way off that (and they bought about 10yrs ago). I have no idea, but with so many available villas with pools etc, I would be dubious that there's much demand for townhouses for holiday rental unless they're extremely cheap.

I think if you get the right house though it still could do well - there's one couple on TheDibb who quite recently completed a 7/8 bedroom place just behind Medieval Times near I-192/SR535. I thought their timing was unfortunate as it must have cost an absolute fortune but it's solidly booked out.

[Matt Harper]

Deva Link said:

I think if you get the right house though it still could do well - there's one couple on TheDibb who quite recently completed a 7/8 bedroom place just behind Medieval Times near I-192/SR535. I thought their timing was unfortunate as it must have cost an absolute fortune but it's solidly booked out.

The payback for fulfilling an unmet need. Ideal for the cohorts of mouthy, heavily tattooed bog-trotters who will insist on coming here and lowering the tone. I guess a small consolation is that some of them get so blitzed and unruly on the way over, that they are either arrested or sent straight back.
I can't imagine the worry of being the owner of a property I cared about that's been rented to 16 brain-dead yobbos for a fortnight.

[Deva Link]

Matt Harper said:

Deva Link said:

I think if you get the right house though it still could do well - there's one couple on TheDibb who quite recently completed a 7/8 bedroom place just behind Medieval Times near I-192/SR535. I thought their timing was unfortunate as it must have cost an absolute fortune but it's solidly booked out.

The payback for fulfilling an unmet need. Ideal for the cohorts of mouthy, heavily tattooed bog-trotters who will insist on coming here and lowering the tone. I guess a small consolation is that some of them get so blitzed and unruly on the way over, that they are either arrested or sent straight back.
I can't imagine the worry of being the owner of a property I cared about that's been rented to 16 brain-dead yobbos for a fortnight.

For the price the place I referred to goes for, I doubt it's occupied by such people. Anyway, I'd have thought Orlando would be grateful for all the visitors it can get at the moment.

[warmfuzzies]

Deva Link said:

Matt Harper said:

Deva Link said:

I think if you get the right house though it still could do well - there's one couple on TheDibb who quite recently completed a 7/8 bedroom place just behind Medieval Times near I-192/SR535. I thought their timing was unfortunate as it must have cost an absolute fortune but it's solidly booked out.

The payback for fulfilling an unmet need. Ideal for the cohorts of mouthy, heavily tattooed bog-trotters who will insist on coming here and lowering the tone. I guess a small consolation is that some of them get so blitzed and unruly on the way over, that they are either arrested or sent straight back.
I can't imagine the worry of being the owner of a property I cared about that's been rented to 16 brain-dead yobbos for a fortnight.

For the price the place I referred to goes for, I doubt it's occupied by such people. Anyway, I'd have thought Orlando would be grateful for all the visitors it can get at the moment.

Not sure if thats what I saw last week, as Univesal etc were absolutely rammed full, even the shopping malls were stuffed to capacity, so some one somewhere must have money to spend.

The cost of the townhouses is about $100,000, about $10k/yr to run........looking at figures from other renters on the same site, I am hoping to just break even in year 2, that's all I need,

Kevin

[saleen836]

warmfuzzies said:

Deva Link said:

Matt Harper said:

Deva Link said:

I think if you get the right house though it still could do well - there's one couple on TheDibb who quite recently completed a 7/8 bedroom place just behind Medieval Times near I-192/SR535. I thought their timing was unfortunate as it must have cost an absolute fortune but it's solidly booked out.

The payback for fulfilling an unmet need. Ideal for the cohorts of mouthy, heavily tattooed bog-trotters who will insist on coming here and lowering the tone. I guess a small consolation is that some of them get so blitzed and unruly on the way over, that they are either arrested or sent straight back.
I can't imagine the worry of being the owner of a property I cared about that's been rented to 16 brain-dead yobbos for a fortnight.

For the price the place I referred to goes for, I doubt it's occupied by such people. Anyway, I'd have thought Orlando would be grateful for all the visitors it can get at the moment.

Not sure if thats what I saw last week, as Univesal etc were absolutely rammed full, even the shopping malls were stuffed to capacity, so some one somewhere must have money to spend.

The cost of the townhouses is about $100,000, about $10k/yr to run........looking at figures from other renters on the same site, I am hoping to just break even in year 2, that's all I need,

Kevin

Good luck!

[warmfuzzies]

saleen836 said:

warmfuzzies said:

Deva Link said:

Matt Harper said:

Deva Link said:

I think if you get the right house though it still could do well - there's one couple on TheDibb who quite recently completed a 7/8 bedroom place just behind Medieval Times near I-192/SR535. I thought their timing was unfortunate as it must have cost an absolute fortune but it's solidly booked out.

The payback for fulfilling an unmet need. Ideal for the cohorts of mouthy, heavily tattooed bog-trotters who will insist on coming here and lowering the tone. I guess a small consolation is that some of them get so blitzed and unruly on the way over, that they are either arrested or sent straight back.
I can't imagine the worry of being the owner of a property I cared about that's been rented to 16 brain-dead yobbos for a fortnight.

For the price the place I referred to goes for, I doubt it's occupied by such people. Anyway, I'd have thought Orlando would be grateful for all the visitors it can get at the moment.

Not sure if thats what I saw last week, as Univesal etc were absolutely rammed full, even the shopping malls were stuffed to capacity, so some one somewhere must have money to spend.

The cost of the townhouses is about $100,000, about $10k/yr to run........looking at figures from other renters on the same site, I am hoping to just break even in year 2, that's all I need,

Kevin

Good luck!

Lol,

nervous thanks, Looks like I could end up signing the contract today.........

Kevin

[GavinPearson]

I would also check the cost of homeowners insurance. If you are renting the place out and it has a pool that will greatly increase the costs. No point in having a lengthy discussion on tort reform - it's just the way it is.

[saleen836]

So all signed and sealed?

[warmfuzzies]

saleen836 said:

So all signed and sealed?

Nope,

Offer went in on a short sale, and now waiting to see if accepted.......I was told this may take some time, but I'm patient.

K.