Minister warns of ‘inbred’ Muslims
Discussion
This seem very un-politically correct coming from a governement minister?
said:
From The Sunday Times February 10, 2008
Dipesh Gadher, Christopher Morgan and Jonathan Oliver
Phil Woolas, an environment minister, said the culture of arranged marriages between first cousins was the “elephant in the room”. Woolas, a former race relations minister, said: “If you have a child with your cousin the likelihood is there’ll be a genetic problem.”
The minister, whose views were supported by medical experts this weekend, said: “The issue we need to debate is first cousin marriages, whereby a lot of arranged marriages are with first cousins, and that produces lots of genetic problems in terms of disability [in children].”
Woolas emphasised the practice did not extend to all Muslim communities but was confined mainly to families originating from rural pakistan. However, up to half of all marriages within these communities are estimated to involve first cousins.
Medical research suggests that while British pakistanis are responsible for 3% of all births, they account for one in three British children born with genetic illnesses.
The minister’s comments come as Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury, rejected calls to resign over claims that Islamic law should be introduced in Britain. “I’m not contemplating resignation,” he told friends.
Williams insists his remarks were misinterpreted and that he was not advocating a parallel sharia jurisdiction for Muslims, but Lord Carey, his predecessor, warned acceptance of Muslim laws in Britain would be "disastrous".
The archbishop is believed to have received hate mail since he made his controversial comments but has rejected offers of round-the-clock police protection.
Williams is set to clash with the government again this week by voicing opposition to plans to extend detention without charge for terrorist suspects to 42 days.
Woolas, who represents the ethnically mixed seat of Oldham East and Saddleworth, has previously warned that Muslim women who wear headscarves could provoke “fear and resentment”. Yesterday, he was similarly outspoken.
“If you talk to any primary care worker they will tell you that levels of disability among the . . . pakistani population are higher than the general population. And everybody knows it’s caused by first cousin marriage.
“That’s a cultural thing rather than a religious thing. It is not illegal in this country.
“The problem is that many of the parents themselves and many of the public spokespeople are themselves products of first cousin marriages. It’s very difficult for people to say ‘you can’t do that’ because it’s a very sensitive, human thing.”
He added that the issue is not talked about. “The health authorities look into it. Most health workers and primary care trusts in areas like mine are very aware of it. But it’s a very sensitive issue. That’s why it’s not even a debate and people outside of these areas don’t really know it exists.”
Woolas was supported by Ann Cryer, Labour MP for Keighley, who called for the NHS to do more to warn parents of the dangers of inbreeding.
“This is to do with a medieval culture where you keep wealth within the family,” she said.
“If you go into a paediatric ward in Bradford or Keighley you will find more than half of the kids there are from the Asian community. Since Asians only represent 20%-30% of the population, you can see that they are over represented.
“I have encountered cases of blindness and deafness. There was one poor girl who had to have an oxygen tank on her back and breathe from a hole in the front of her neck.
“The parents were warned they should not have any more children. But when the husband returned again from pakistan, within months they had another child with exactly the same condition.”
Minister warns of ‘inbred’ Muslims
Dipesh Gadher, Christopher Morgan and Jonathan Oliver
A government minister has warned that inbreeding among immigrants is causing a surge in birth defects - comments likely to spark a new row over the place of Muslims in British society.
Phil Woolas, an environment minister, said the culture of arranged marriages between first cousins was the “elephant in the room”. Woolas, a former race relations minister, said: “If you have a child with your cousin the likelihood is there’ll be a genetic problem.”
The minister, whose views were supported by medical experts this weekend, said: “The issue we need to debate is first cousin marriages, whereby a lot of arranged marriages are with first cousins, and that produces lots of genetic problems in terms of disability [in children].”
Woolas emphasised the practice did not extend to all Muslim communities but was confined mainly to families originating from rural pakistan. However, up to half of all marriages within these communities are estimated to involve first cousins.
Medical research suggests that while British pakistanis are responsible for 3% of all births, they account for one in three British children born with genetic illnesses.
The minister’s comments come as Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury, rejected calls to resign over claims that Islamic law should be introduced in Britain. “I’m not contemplating resignation,” he told friends.
Williams insists his remarks were misinterpreted and that he was not advocating a parallel sharia jurisdiction for Muslims, but Lord Carey, his predecessor, warned acceptance of Muslim laws in Britain would be "disastrous".
The archbishop is believed to have received hate mail since he made his controversial comments but has rejected offers of round-the-clock police protection.
Williams is set to clash with the government again this week by voicing opposition to plans to extend detention without charge for terrorist suspects to 42 days.
Woolas, who represents the ethnically mixed seat of Oldham East and Saddleworth, has previously warned that Muslim women who wear headscarves could provoke “fear and resentment”. Yesterday, he was similarly outspoken.
“If you talk to any primary care worker they will tell you that levels of disability among the . . . pakistani population are higher than the general population. And everybody knows it’s caused by first cousin marriage.
“That’s a cultural thing rather than a religious thing. It is not illegal in this country.
“The problem is that many of the parents themselves and many of the public spokespeople are themselves products of first cousin marriages. It’s very difficult for people to say ‘you can’t do that’ because it’s a very sensitive, human thing.”
He added that the issue is not talked about. “The health authorities look into it. Most health workers and primary care trusts in areas like mine are very aware of it. But it’s a very sensitive issue. That’s why it’s not even a debate and people outside of these areas don’t really know it exists.”
Woolas was supported by Ann Cryer, Labour MP for Keighley, who called for the NHS to do more to warn parents of the dangers of inbreeding.
“This is to do with a medieval culture where you keep wealth within the family,” she said.
“If you go into a paediatric ward in Bradford or Keighley you will find more than half of the kids there are from the Asian community. Since Asians only represent 20%-30% of the population, you can see that they are over represented.
“I have encountered cases of blindness and deafness. There was one poor girl who had to have an oxygen tank on her back and breathe from a hole in the front of her neck.
“The parents were warned they should not have any more children. But when the husband returned again from pakistan, within months they had another child with exactly the same condition.”
It is a bit of an 'elephant in the room thing', from less than 3% of the UK population something like 30% of serious birth defects occur.
If animals were suffering like this, e.g. the outcry over the BBC programme about the Kennel Club, all sorts of noise would be made, yet for PC reasons this is being kept low profile.
It is not a 'Muslim' issue as such, more prevalent in certain sections of the pakistani community, probably for what were good reasons hundreds of years ago in a remote area, but the cumulative effect through genetic concentration is taking a terrible toll.
In many ways its similar to the objection to contraception from religious nutters, it's all about keeping numbers and wealth up, despite the damage to lives caused.......
If animals were suffering like this, e.g. the outcry over the BBC programme about the Kennel Club, all sorts of noise would be made, yet for PC reasons this is being kept low profile.
It is not a 'Muslim' issue as such, more prevalent in certain sections of the pakistani community, probably for what were good reasons hundreds of years ago in a remote area, but the cumulative effect through genetic concentration is taking a terrible toll.
In many ways its similar to the objection to contraception from religious nutters, it's all about keeping numbers and wealth up, despite the damage to lives caused.......
MX7 said:
The Sunday Times February 10, 2008
Sorry yep I posted a link to an old story which was a link to a new story. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/health/article7069255.ece
SmoothRB said:
MX7 said:
The Sunday Times February 10, 2008
Sorry yep I posted a link to an old story which was a link to a new story. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/health/article7069255.ece
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/health/ar...
A friend of mine is a teacher in an area with a high immigrant population. He was telling me that his school has an unusually high amount of less abled pupils, which, in turn, has quite a negative effect on his budget. He's not a Daily Mail type, in fact he's very Guardian, so when mentions something like this, I guess it has some substance.
I must say, I'm quite surprised by the figures. 33% of all new born British pakistanis have recessive disorders? It clearly does need addressing, and having read what Deech has to say, it seems like she has some good ideas.
munroman said:
It is a bit of an 'elephant in the room thing', from less than 3% of the UK population something like 30% of serious birth defects occur.
If animals were suffering like this, e.g. the outcry over the BBC programme about the Kennel Club, all sorts of noise would be made, yet for PC reasons this is being kept low profile.
It is not a 'Muslim' issue as such, more prevalent in certain sections of the pakistani community, probably for what were good reasons hundreds of years ago in a remote area, but the cumulative effect through genetic concentration is taking a terrible toll.
In many ways its similar to the objection to contraception from religious nutters, it's all about keeping numbers and wealth up, despite the damage to lives caused.......
The rate of serious birth defects are around 0.1% of live births, so if the rates for pakistani descended people were ten times this that would still only be 1%. As a result for an individual parent the chances of them having a child with a serious birth defect is still quite low.If animals were suffering like this, e.g. the outcry over the BBC programme about the Kennel Club, all sorts of noise would be made, yet for PC reasons this is being kept low profile.
It is not a 'Muslim' issue as such, more prevalent in certain sections of the pakistani community, probably for what were good reasons hundreds of years ago in a remote area, but the cumulative effect through genetic concentration is taking a terrible toll.
In many ways its similar to the objection to contraception from religious nutters, it's all about keeping numbers and wealth up, despite the damage to lives caused.......
The elephant in the room as far as marrying first cousins goes in my opinion isn't biological it is cultural. The practise of marrying first cousins (who are generally brought over from pakistan) reinforces ghettoisation and imports all the issues of poor education, religious extremism, and low opportunities that people were trying to escape from by coming here. Not marrying cousins is probably one of the reasons for the difference between the relative outcomes of Indian verses pakistani immigrants to the UK.
SmoothRB said:
shauniebabes said:
Almost 100 percent of Muslim parents go on to have Muslim children. A far more worrying statistic
That is a truism since Islam mandates that if one parent is a Muslim then the child automatically is.It's a clever way for the meme of Islam to pertetuate.
What a great British import!
Heliosphan said:
SmoothRB said:
shauniebabes said:
Almost 100 percent of Muslim parents go on to have Muslim children. A far more worrying statistic
That is a truism since Islam mandates that if one parent is a Muslim then the child automatically is.It's a clever way for the meme of Islam to pertetuate.
What a great British import!
anonymous said:
[redacted]
No I mean if local 'white' people start marrying their cousins most people are going to view that with some prejudice and think that is a bit 'off'.Somehow though if it is pakistani families we take a more patronising attiude as in 'that is just what they do'.
Double standard.
"East is East" had the mother sling out two comedy inbred 'possible wives' for her sons. That was, what, ten years ago?
Not a new issue at all. It does remain an "elephant in the room". So, well said that man. But, what are we going to do? No doubt any legislation change would be race carded before it was even discussed.
Not unique to the pakistanis, mind. Our "travelling" community seem to give close marriage little thought. I wasn't aware of it for the Jews, though I guess it makes sense.
Not a new issue at all. It does remain an "elephant in the room". So, well said that man. But, what are we going to do? No doubt any legislation change would be race carded before it was even discussed.
Not unique to the pakistanis, mind. Our "travelling" community seem to give close marriage little thought. I wasn't aware of it for the Jews, though I guess it makes sense.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff