Discussion
I'm confused here...for eons it's been known that the FCO was 'arabist' - for reasons I don't even begin to understand (maybe it's to do with T.E. Lawrence). Israel was a pariah state and the noble Arab was an admirable and learned fella (if only you took the time to get to know him).
Anyhow, now we're here and nobody seems to know sweet FA about what comes next, who is controlling who, and why ISIS/ISIL became heir apparent.
Tunisia, Algeria, Egypt, Libya, Syria, Iraq - they're not really taking part in modern world living at the moment, are they?
And yet, only a little while back things were relatively settled. Forty years ago we had a Tunisian student stay for two weeks - he was impeccably dressed, very polite, and quite at ease in London, Paris, Tunis or even Haifa, such was his well-travelled life. He had friends from places like Beirut (still cosmopolitan then), ALgeria and Libya.
I only put this here because occasionally my children ask why we're seeing various bloodshed on the TV and I try to construct a narrative (in the modern idiom) that they might understand. Not easy, is it?
Anyhow, now we're here and nobody seems to know sweet FA about what comes next, who is controlling who, and why ISIS/ISIL became heir apparent.
Tunisia, Algeria, Egypt, Libya, Syria, Iraq - they're not really taking part in modern world living at the moment, are they?
And yet, only a little while back things were relatively settled. Forty years ago we had a Tunisian student stay for two weeks - he was impeccably dressed, very polite, and quite at ease in London, Paris, Tunis or even Haifa, such was his well-travelled life. He had friends from places like Beirut (still cosmopolitan then), ALgeria and Libya.
I only put this here because occasionally my children ask why we're seeing various bloodshed on the TV and I try to construct a narrative (in the modern idiom) that they might understand. Not easy, is it?
skynews said:
"Two Libyan Soldiers Jailed For Raping UK Man
Two Libyan soldiers stationed in the UK have each been sentenced to 12 years in prison for raping a man in Cambridge.
Moktar Ali Saad Mahmoud, 33, and Ibrahim Abugtila, 23, were found guilty of raping and aiding and abetting the rape of the man in his 20s on Christ's Pieces on October 26.
The pair were arrested while undergoing training at Bassingbourn Barracks in Cambridgeshire as part of an agreement by the British Government to help war-torn Libya after the 2011 collapse of Muammar Gaddafi's regime.
Cambridge Crown Court heard the pair acted like "hunting dogs", targeting their victim who was drunk and vulnerable after a night out.
They both "took him to a deserted park in the early hours of the morning and then took it in turns to hold him down while the other raped him", the Crown Prosecution Service said in a statement."
http://news.sky.com/story/1484836/two-libyan-soldiers-jailed-for-raping-uk-manTwo Libyan soldiers stationed in the UK have each been sentenced to 12 years in prison for raping a man in Cambridge.
Moktar Ali Saad Mahmoud, 33, and Ibrahim Abugtila, 23, were found guilty of raping and aiding and abetting the rape of the man in his 20s on Christ's Pieces on October 26.
The pair were arrested while undergoing training at Bassingbourn Barracks in Cambridgeshire as part of an agreement by the British Government to help war-torn Libya after the 2011 collapse of Muammar Gaddafi's regime.
Cambridge Crown Court heard the pair acted like "hunting dogs", targeting their victim who was drunk and vulnerable after a night out.
They both "took him to a deserted park in the early hours of the morning and then took it in turns to hold him down while the other raped him", the Crown Prosecution Service said in a statement."
Training a few hundred or even a few thousand squaddies is all very well but it remains that little was done to stabilise Libya in the aftermath of Ghaddafi's overthrow; that was the opportunity to flood in UN peacekeepers when there was peace to be kept, disarm the militias or at least stop them looting Ghaddafi's arsenals and enact some kind of Marshall plan to rebuild infrastructure and form the basic organisations of secular government. Not the work of moments but it might have helped avoid the s
tty mess we've ended up with.
tty mess we've ended up with.Two F-15E from RAF Lakenheath UK, armed to the teeth with JDAM's flew a secret 12 hour round strike trip from the UK, across the Med to Libya. The two aircraft were supported by refuelling tankers along the route.
It seems there was support from assets in the US Mediterranean fleet as the strike aircraft arrived in the region for the strike on Memorial Day.
Still no word on what they hit. However, there was presidential authority and a COBRA meeting in the UK for the Prime Minister and Defence Chiefs to authorise a strike from UK soil.
The smart money says that an ISIS base was hit in support of special forces with precision targeting requiring aircraft on station (rather than just fire and forget Cruise missiles out of the Med)
It seems there was support from assets in the US Mediterranean fleet as the strike aircraft arrived in the region for the strike on Memorial Day.
Still no word on what they hit. However, there was presidential authority and a COBRA meeting in the UK for the Prime Minister and Defence Chiefs to authorise a strike from UK soil.
The smart money says that an ISIS base was hit in support of special forces with precision targeting requiring aircraft on station (rather than just fire and forget Cruise missiles out of the Med)
Libya trial: Gaddafi son sentenced to death over war crimes
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-33688391
Should the UK/US/Italy/France mount a rescue attempt to free him and install him as the Libyan leader?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-33688391
Should the UK/US/Italy/France mount a rescue attempt to free him and install him as the Libyan leader?
Saif is the "normal" one of the group.
Khamis is the nut job - far more than Hannibal and he is so far over the nutjob horizon he is coming back on himself - and Khamis is a horrible person to deal with.
He is/was a proper DontyaKnowWhoIam?, actually mate no I don't and I don't give a fk either, you don't hang up on me then go complaining to my boss when I have a go back at you for being a knob.
Mutassem is also nutty and a bit of a wannabe hero.
Out of all of them, Saif is the one who has the best chance of getting Libya back under control I reckon. The others are just too deranged IMHO
I miss the old Libya, it was fun
Claire
Khamis is the nut job - far more than Hannibal and he is so far over the nutjob horizon he is coming back on himself - and Khamis is a horrible person to deal with.
He is/was a proper DontyaKnowWhoIam?, actually mate no I don't and I don't give a f
k either, you don't hang up on me then go complaining to my boss when I have a go back at you for being a knob.Mutassem is also nutty and a bit of a wannabe hero.
Out of all of them, Saif is the one who has the best chance of getting Libya back under control I reckon. The others are just too deranged IMHO
I miss the old Libya, it was fun
Claire
Gaffer said:
Saif is the "normal" one of the group.
Khamis is the nut job - far more than Hannibal and he is so far over the nutjob horizon he is coming back on himself - and Khamis is a horrible person to deal with.
He is/was a proper DontyaKnowWhoIam?, actually mate no I don't and I don't give a fk either, you don't hang up on me then go complaining to my boss when I have a go back at you for being a knob.
Mutassem is also nutty and a bit of a wannabe hero.
Out of all of them, Saif is the one who has the best chance of getting Libya back under control I reckon. The others are just too deranged IMHO
I miss the old Libya, it was fun
Claire
Wasn't quite so fun when I was there in December. I was serenaded to sleep by the sound of small arms fire.Khamis is the nut job - far more than Hannibal and he is so far over the nutjob horizon he is coming back on himself - and Khamis is a horrible person to deal with.
He is/was a proper DontyaKnowWhoIam?, actually mate no I don't and I don't give a f
k either, you don't hang up on me then go complaining to my boss when I have a go back at you for being a knob.Mutassem is also nutty and a bit of a wannabe hero.
Out of all of them, Saif is the one who has the best chance of getting Libya back under control I reckon. The others are just too deranged IMHO
I miss the old Libya, it was fun
Claire
Poor buggers.
Asterix said:
Wasn't quite so fun when I was there in December. I was serenaded to sleep by the sound of small arms fire.
Poor buggers.
I have no idea what happened to my old work colleagues, some were young girls (very early 20's) right through to old timers in their 70's.Poor buggers.
I hope they managed to stay safe
Claire
guardian said:
Three Libyan soldiers who were convicted of sexual assaulting women while stationed at an army base are seeking asylum in the UK, police have said.
Khaled El Azibi, Naji El Maarfi and Mohammed Abdalsalam carried out the attacks while stationed at Bassingbourn barracks last October.
Cambridge police said the men had been released from prison and transferred to secure immigration units, according to the BBC. The grounds on which the men are claiming asylum have not been revealed.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/sep/30/libyan-soldiers-assaulted-women-seek-asylum-ukKhaled El Azibi, Naji El Maarfi and Mohammed Abdalsalam carried out the attacks while stationed at Bassingbourn barracks last October.
Cambridge police said the men had been released from prison and transferred to secure immigration units, according to the BBC. The grounds on which the men are claiming asylum have not been revealed.
BlackLabel said:
Just read this story on BBC as well:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshir...
If they are granted asylum then I'd say this country is well and truely f
ked, if it isn't already.Bluedot said:
BlackLabel said:
Just read this story on BBC as well:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshir...
If they are granted asylum then I'd say this country is well and truely f
ked, if it isn't already.You couldn't make it up...
Andy Zarse said:
Yet it's the rapists and sex attackers who caused the training program to fail are now the ones being allowed to remain in the UK.
You couldn't make it up...
You appear to have.You couldn't make it up...
They have applied for asylum, they have not been granted it. Anybody is free to apply for asylum, it's part of what makes Britain a nice place to live. Also what makes Britain a nice place to live is we retain the right to reject peoples applications. I expect these guys will find their application rejected.
If true, this makes interesting reading;
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/17/sec...
- supposedly secret mission photographed and image put on Facebook. Hmmm....
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/17/sec...
- supposedly secret mission photographed and image put on Facebook. Hmmm....
The Don of Croy said:
If true, this makes interesting reading;
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/17/sec...
- supposedly secret mission photographed and image put on Facebook. Hmmm....
Not tier one operators operating. No beards or shemaghs.http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/17/sec...
- supposedly secret mission photographed and image put on Facebook. Hmmm....
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