My son has been scammed
Discussion
Hi
My lad in his naivety, put through 3 separate transactions via the craigslist.org website, to buy some cheap iPhones so that he could sell them on. As this was obviously too good to be true, he didn't wait until the first phone arrived before going through the process of "buying" 2 more
He entered into conversations via email with the vendors; he also got their sort code and bank account details so that he could transfer the money. He transferred the money from his savings account at Halifax.
Quelle surpise...the goods never arrived and the vendor stopped answering emails!
He contacted the website who are not interested as they are just an intermediary. He spoke with Halifax who said they could do nothing as it was a transfer from a savings account. He went to the Police who didn't take any details and did not appear interested. They gave him a leaflet on fraud so he emailed the email address on that with all the details and they said there was not a lot they could do.
This happened in October and has just come to light now. The kid has lost c£350!
Short of just taking it as a 'life lesson'...is there anything else that can be done to try and recoup his money?
Cheers
My lad in his naivety, put through 3 separate transactions via the craigslist.org website, to buy some cheap iPhones so that he could sell them on. As this was obviously too good to be true, he didn't wait until the first phone arrived before going through the process of "buying" 2 more
He entered into conversations via email with the vendors; he also got their sort code and bank account details so that he could transfer the money. He transferred the money from his savings account at Halifax.
Quelle surpise...the goods never arrived and the vendor stopped answering emails!
He contacted the website who are not interested as they are just an intermediary. He spoke with Halifax who said they could do nothing as it was a transfer from a savings account. He went to the Police who didn't take any details and did not appear interested. They gave him a leaflet on fraud so he emailed the email address on that with all the details and they said there was not a lot they could do.
This happened in October and has just come to light now. The kid has lost c£350!
Short of just taking it as a 'life lesson'...is there anything else that can be done to try and recoup his money?
Cheers
You could complain to the police a bit more, they may be able to force the bank to give the details of the person the money was sent to if you can convince them it is theft, but this is really a civil matter due to non-completion of a contract.
Caveat Emptor as the saying goes. And TBH that's a better lesson than "you can get what you want if you stamp your feet hard enough".
Caveat Emptor as the saying goes. And TBH that's a better lesson than "you can get what you want if you stamp your feet hard enough".
Move on
I paid cash into a chap's account for an eBay purchase. I walked into a fairly well planned fraud. Lost a four figure sum
No one was interested. I found out details of the fraudster but since I voluntarily paid in money, I had nothing against him, legally. And I'm not the type to find him and extract the money forcibly
I paid cash into a chap's account for an eBay purchase. I walked into a fairly well planned fraud. Lost a four figure sum
No one was interested. I found out details of the fraudster but since I voluntarily paid in money, I had nothing against him, legally. And I'm not the type to find him and extract the money forcibly
davepoth said:
You could complain to the police a bit more, they may be able to force the bank to give the details of the person the money was sent to if you can convince them it is theft, but this is really a civil matter due to non-completion of a contract.
Caveat Emptor as the saying goes. And TBH that's a better lesson than "you can get what you want if you stamp your feet hard enough".
Its not theft though the kid paid the money across willingly. Caveat Emptor as the saying goes. And TBH that's a better lesson than "you can get what you want if you stamp your feet hard enough".
The local police only deal with fraud in limited circumstances so they were right to point him elsewhere. It sounds like criminal fraud to me.
He needs to go here: http://www.actionfraud.police.uk/
He needs to go here: http://www.actionfraud.police.uk/
bhstewie said:
Curious - how is it civil and not criminal?
Because they had an agreement to buy/sell phones. The bloke paid, and the goods just have not been supplied yet.I lost a car in a well timed scam many years ago. In my case the bloke used his own bank account, and I knew his real address. police were uninterested and he is free to continue scamming.
98elise said:
bhstewie said:
Curious - how is it civil and not criminal?
Because they had an agreement to buy/sell phones. The bloke paid, and the goods just have not been supplied yet.I lost a car in a well timed scam many years ago. In my case the bloke used his own bank account, and I knew his real address. police were uninterested and he is free to continue scamming.
There must be some point at which this becomes outright fraud and criminal surely?
bhstewie said:
98elise said:
bhstewie said:
Curious - how is it civil and not criminal?
Because they had an agreement to buy/sell phones. The bloke paid, and the goods just have not been supplied yet.I lost a car in a well timed scam many years ago. In my case the bloke used his own bank account, and I knew his real address. police were uninterested and he is free to continue scamming.
There must be some point at which this becomes outright fraud and criminal surely?
When you handover goods or services you did it freely in exchange for money. If one party dosen't follow through with their end of the bargain its simply a civil matter.
I am staggered too. It was an expensive school day for me.
Edited by 98elise on Sunday 15th March 17:05
It would seem that this is why such "crime" is so prolific, with a very high chance of getting away with it must make it a far more attractive proposition than straight forward robbery. I've got some magic beans for sale if anyone wants to send me a few hundred quid they can have them.
shovelheadrob said:
It would seem that this is why such "crime" is so prolific, with a very high chance of getting away with it must make it a far more attractive proposition than straight forward robbery. I've got some Iphone 6s for sale if anyone wants to send me a few hundred quid they can have them.
Replace magic beans with Iphone 6 and you have a legitimate criminal business. How much do you have to con people out of before the police become interested. 3, 4, 5 6,7 or 8 figures?eldar said:
Replace magic beans with Iphone 6 and you have a legitimate criminal business. How much do you have to con people out of before the police become interested. 3, 4, 5 6,7 or 8 figures?
That's what I was getting at in my previous post. If I post an item and you say you haven't received it then it makes some sense that it's civil.If I advertise that I have 10 iPhones at £100 each and people give me £1000 but I never had a single iPhone that seems like plain simple criminal fraud to me?
bhstewie said:
That's what I was getting at in my previous post. If I post an item and you say you haven't received it then it makes some sense that it's civil.
If I advertise that I have 10 iPhones at £100 each and people give me £1000 but I never had a single iPhone that seems like plain simple criminal fraud to me?
If I set up a few gumtree and the like accounts and advertise Iphone 6s at £300, and sell these virtual phones, but never deliver the police will say 'civil matter, go away' to the victims. Cool.If I advertise that I have 10 iPhones at £100 each and people give me £1000 but I never had a single iPhone that seems like plain simple criminal fraud to me?
Happily, I happen to have a couple of thousand Iphone6/6S/Ipads (unwanted prizes/gifts) for sale to established PHers - at least 6 months membership - at 50% discount. 60% off for plod, as a bonus (need to email a photo of their truncheon to prove it).
Finally, which engine should I specify in the Audi A8 I'm going to order soon?
eldar said:
shovelheadrob said:
It would seem that this is why such "crime" is so prolific, with a very high chance of getting away with it must make it a far more attractive proposition than straight forward robbery. I've got some Iphone 6s for sale if anyone wants to send me a few hundred quid they can have them.
Replace magic beans with Iphone 6 and you have a legitimate criminal business. How much do you have to con people out of before the police become interested. 3, 4, 5 6,7 or 8 figures?eldar said:
If I set up a few gumtree and the like accounts and advertise Iphone 6s at £300, and sell these virtual phones, but never deliver the police will say 'civil matter, go away' to the victims. Cool.
Or they investigate as a fraud, arrest suspect and secure prosecution, as I and many of my colleagues have done on more than one occasion.But whatever suits your issues best...
Mk3Spitfire said:
Or they investigate as a fraud, arrest suspect and secure prosecution, as I and many of my colleagues have done on more than one occasion.
But whatever suits your issues best...
I'm genuinely glad to hear that. So why go people get told 'it's civil'?But whatever suits your issues best...
I assume that a single complaint isn't acted on, but multiples are.
eldar said:
Mk3Spitfire said:
Or they investigate as a fraud, arrest suspect and secure prosecution, as I and many of my colleagues have done on more than one occasion.
But whatever suits your issues best...
I'm genuinely glad to hear that. So why go people get told 'it's civil'?But whatever suits your issues best...
I assume that a single complaint isn't acted on, but multiples are.
Often general lack of knowledge in relation to fraud by Police call handlers and some cops
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