The classic... 70 in a 50, A90 Aberdeenshire

[simoid]

Posting on behalf of a good friend.

Story: driving South from Aberdeen on A90 at Laurencekirk, as part of a long journey, didn't slow down from the 70 limit to the 50, and was therefore clocked by a GATSO at 70mph. Dry day, excellent visibility, very light traffic, dual carriageway. Friend suggests they were perhaps concentrating on said light traffic and missed the speed limit countdown (50 in III, II, I) and start signs.

Caught in October, received a letter asking to identify driver a few days later, and now received notification of the court date this week. No FPN was offered, despite being within the "guidance limits" apparently because this is a notoriously dangerous stretch of road.

The court date is in February on a day that my friend normally works.

Question: What's the general concensus on pleading guilty by post/attending? I've had a read about, and am leaning towards advising my friend to take the day off work to travel >100 miles and show up in court. She's a young professional, and when the letter came was utterly utterly distraught (tears, etc) so I think she might be better treated in person as the decision maker will see she is not "a wrong 'un", just made a mistake and got caught. She's also worried about a ban, etc, but I think this is totally unlikely.

I reckon (totally unscientifically):
Turn up, guilty, really sorry, I know how bad the road is, I just missed the change of speed limit, really sorry, clean licence, family members injured by road accidents, takes safety with utmost (+mitigation - quiet day, low traffic etc), probably will end up crying = maybe 3 points and a day's wages? (I assume this can't be shifted to local court).

Write letter (which they read all the time) send back 6 points and a few days wages?

TL;DRCaught speeding @ 70 in a 50. Better going to court or writing letter to plead?

[simoid]

matchmaker said:

If she appears in court personally it will look as if she is taking the matter seriously. Suited & booted, apologies, etc.

It is an accident blackspot though - that's the reason for the 50mph limit!

Thanks MM, that's what I was thinking. Oh she's definitely taking it seriously - is petrified at the possibility of a ban (of which I'm expecting the chances are vanishingly small). I expect the apologies/plea would be made through a stream/flood of tears.

Costs of attendance: a day at work/holiday is probably worth a hundred odd quid or so, best part of 300 mile round trip probably £40 of petrol, also feeling like a criminal.

Benefits of attendance: that's what I wasn't sure about really. I was reading there's hundreds and hundreds of speeding offences every month on the A90 so they've maybe "seen it all before."

[simoid]

TartanPaint said:

There's a 50 sign with 300 yard countdown, a brightly painted gatso, a big signposted staggered crossing, and A BIG FLASHING 50 sign which shouts at you if you're doing more than 50.

I'm at a total loss to understand how you could claim lapse of concentration without ending up with a Driving without due care and attention, which is probably more points than the speeding. Or worse, end up with both.

I'd go with "sorry" but skip the excuses, as they sound completely implausible to me.

Aye I know what you mean. I was in the passenger seat. We actually had a discussion in Dundee about the fact neither of us could remember slowing down for the 50 limit a Laurencekirk...! I'll get a look at the photos to see if there's any reason for missing the signs. I have w feeling I recall passing a city link bus (one of the massive ones) somewhere down the road so perhaps that hid the near side signs and grabbed attention. Who knows.

So "sorry, this isn't like me, I normally take so much care (as you can see I wasn't exceeding the limit in my head (lol))" and she takes her punishment. Thing is, if she takes a day off work to go all the way up there and ends up with loads of points and a massive fine I'll be sent to Coventry

[simoid]

Thanks Andies - duly noted. Kind of worrying, I'm sure we all do it on a longer drive where you can't recall the last however many minutes/miles.

I suppose there could have been other traffic at the time as it has been known for some people to (I hear) set cruise control to c. 80mph for the NSL speed limits. This traffic may have saved more points or even a short ban for 76/77 instead of "just" the 70 in a 50!

[simoid]

WD39 said:

simoid said:

Posting on behalf of a good friend.

Dry day, excellent visibility, very light traffic, dual carriageway.

This is a common excuse on PH for those who are caught speeding.

As if these make a difference.

Speed limits are in force 24/7, regardless of the weather conditions, environment or topographical variations.

It wasn't an excuse, far from it. Just giving the full story to assist others in the provision of opinions.

I think it does make a difference - I imagine the court would have a different outlook if the offence was 70 in a 50 in a foggy blizzard, icy road, heavy traffic, single carriageway, etc.

[simoid]

Crusoe said:

Really should be charged with driving without due care and attention if they claimed not to know the limit was changing. Junction with extra lighting, warning signs for cars crossing, 50 limit signs with lots of repeater signs and count down signs before plus a big board showing if you are breaking the limit before the camera which is in yellow with high reflective stripes. Brother in law did the same early in the morning on cruise control set to 75 all the way from Dundee to Aberdeen and didn't even register the flash (at least his sister pays more attention). Pleaded guilty by post and got 6 points and a £100 fine if I remember correctly.

Thanks, I imagine that'll be a similar outcome to what we're looking at here. We'v both driven the road countless times, and speeding past it really mystifies us too. I was obviously passengering without DCA too

[simoid]

WD39 said:

simoid said:

WD39 said:

simoid said:

Posting on behalf of a good friend.

Dry day, excellent visibility, very light traffic, dual carriageway.

This is a common excuse on PH for those who are caught speeding.

As if these make a difference.

Speed limits are in force 24/7, regardless of the weather conditions, environment or topographical variations.

It wasn't an excuse, far from it. Just giving the full story to assist others in the provision of opinions.

I think it does make a difference - I imagine the court would have a different outlook if the offence was 70 in a 50 in a foggy blizzard, icy road, heavy traffic, single carriageway, etc.

But you mentioned the weather etc. as if in mitigation. Speeding is speeding.

I did indeed. As I said, not an excuse, just giving the circumstances that I thought the court might consider.

Your assertion that "speeding is speeding" is not true in the eyes of the law, where there's "speeding but we'll ignore it", "speeding and we'll jail him" and everything in between

[simoid]

jshell said:

Sorry for her, but not too much as that has historically been a real accident black-spot. But echo others in that I cannot understand not seeing the signs, lights, red/yellow camera and brake lights all around and crossing traffic. I'm through that camera every week, Thurs or Fri night and have seen on a few occasions that there is also a scamera van shortly after the Gatso. I always slow to 56, check for follow-up camera and then boot it - watching for vans on the following long straight section...

Yes indeed, we can't understand it either. We used to do the drive a few times a month a few years ago, but this was the first time for a while.

NB for anyone looking for a "holier than thou" argument, the following is not an excuse, just a theory to serve as a warning/education to others: I reckon there must've been a bus/HGV wandering about in its lane, or equivalent, something to take the attention away from the roadfurniture. You know that video where you're asked to count the basketball passes, and so don't notice the man in the scarily obvious gorilla suit walking through the shot? Be careful out there!

[simoid]

So...

Ended up with £300 and 5 points - reduced to 4 points and £210 for pleading guilty.

Interesting points:

• scrote was up for theft, nicked from his employer (according to scrote) £75 of fags and £175, and got a £110 fine. £5 a week forever as he had no money, apparently, but was wearing a c. £300 jacket.
• someone else was up for 71mph at the same junction, only got 5pts (-1 to 4) and £150 (-to £105 or £110) despite having similar income to my mate. I assume this is because this other speeder had a kid.
• other speeder had a lawyer, who did a little speech similar to what I prepared for my mate, but also included the fact she " missed the change of speed limit" which as others have said, meant failing to see around a dozen pieces of street furniture - DWDCA!?
• matey was in court for speeding at usual FPN levels. Instead of £100 fine and 3 points, how much court time and public money was spent to recoup an additional £110, or £10 in the case of the mother speeder? What a waste of fking money.
• I'm not sure in this instance there was any financial benefit to turning up and saying sorry and looking smart, but we'll never know matey found it a therapeutic and enlightening experience nonetheless.

Thanks for all the comments and help.