How best to word a PCN challenge
Discussion
Brief summary of what happened.
In London this weekend. Stayed in an Air B&B just outside the olympic park. Owner gave us a visitors parking permit. Said we could park anywhere in the area. Found a space here on Carpenters Road:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5378466,-0.00626...
We arrived 22:30, in a rush, in a bit of faff after spending an hour trying to actually find the AirBnB and spending 4 hours travelling. OH filled in the permit in the apartment. Couldn't remember the number plate so left that and intended to fill it in at the car. And yeah in the rush to get all the bags sorted and get to bed before competing the next day (6:30 warmup!!) she forgot to put the number plate in the box on the permit and left it in the window.
Roll on about 8:00 next morning. Car is ticketed and towed. Reason: Invalid permit. £40 PCN, £200 to get the car out the impound.
Not sure which part was invalid they don't say on the PCN. To us it looks like we are in the right permit area and the permit says its valid for 24 hrs from the time stated. So I can only surmise it was ticketed and towed on not filling in the number plate box.
Suffice to say we panicked a lot when we came back to the car to find it gone, with no clue as to where. I am sure the police want their hour back dealing with us over a stolen car when actually the council had had it towed!!!
I am quite happy to pay the £40 PCN for a technicality (quite why the number plate needs to be on the temporary permit eludes me, it doesn't seem necessary given it is a temporary permit and even if you transferred to another vehicle, well its still going to expire and you can only use it in one vehicle!) but feel the £200 to tow it a bit over the top and find the fact they did tow it to be way over the top. It wasn't like it was dumped at the side of the road. It was in a proper space with a permit!
I feel aggrieved really. It feels really unjust to have had this happen over a box filling error (genuine error) and it really rather ruined our weekend competing.
I know I am going to get a load of smart asses now telling me to suck it up and that we should have filled the box in. But that is not useful. Thats all in the past now.
Now I am writing on the representations sheet in an effort to challenge the charge. I would be grateful if anyone here has some advice on how best to word my challenge.
Thanks.
In London this weekend. Stayed in an Air B&B just outside the olympic park. Owner gave us a visitors parking permit. Said we could park anywhere in the area. Found a space here on Carpenters Road:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5378466,-0.00626...
We arrived 22:30, in a rush, in a bit of faff after spending an hour trying to actually find the AirBnB and spending 4 hours travelling. OH filled in the permit in the apartment. Couldn't remember the number plate so left that and intended to fill it in at the car. And yeah in the rush to get all the bags sorted and get to bed before competing the next day (6:30 warmup!!) she forgot to put the number plate in the box on the permit and left it in the window.
Roll on about 8:00 next morning. Car is ticketed and towed. Reason: Invalid permit. £40 PCN, £200 to get the car out the impound.
Not sure which part was invalid they don't say on the PCN. To us it looks like we are in the right permit area and the permit says its valid for 24 hrs from the time stated. So I can only surmise it was ticketed and towed on not filling in the number plate box.
Suffice to say we panicked a lot when we came back to the car to find it gone, with no clue as to where. I am sure the police want their hour back dealing with us over a stolen car when actually the council had had it towed!!!
I am quite happy to pay the £40 PCN for a technicality (quite why the number plate needs to be on the temporary permit eludes me, it doesn't seem necessary given it is a temporary permit and even if you transferred to another vehicle, well its still going to expire and you can only use it in one vehicle!) but feel the £200 to tow it a bit over the top and find the fact they did tow it to be way over the top. It wasn't like it was dumped at the side of the road. It was in a proper space with a permit!
I feel aggrieved really. It feels really unjust to have had this happen over a box filling error (genuine error) and it really rather ruined our weekend competing.
I know I am going to get a load of smart asses now telling me to suck it up and that we should have filled the box in. But that is not useful. Thats all in the past now.
Now I am writing on the representations sheet in an effort to challenge the charge. I would be grateful if anyone here has some advice on how best to word my challenge.
Thanks.
Additional details
car parked at 22:30. PCN at 8:30 next day and towed shortly after. We had no idea and assumed it to have been stolen. Wasted about an hour of police time doing so. Apparently this happens a lot.
It just feels like it was done really quickly, it seems suspiciously quick. Additionaly they've knocked the tracking out on the car (wheel is now 10-15 degrees to the left when driving straight) and I had to pick shards of glass out of the front tyres because they'd plonked it down in what seemed like a car park made entirely from smashed glass!
I mean what grounds have I got? They've tweaked my car and it seems like its PCN'd and towed really quickly and as we aren't from the area we didn't have a clue about any of it so to be charged £240 and put through the hassle of retrieving it over gettin 99% of the process right and 1% of it wrong just feels utterly galling. Car damage and appealing for sympathy seem like my only option?
car parked at 22:30. PCN at 8:30 next day and towed shortly after. We had no idea and assumed it to have been stolen. Wasted about an hour of police time doing so. Apparently this happens a lot.
It just feels like it was done really quickly, it seems suspiciously quick. Additionaly they've knocked the tracking out on the car (wheel is now 10-15 degrees to the left when driving straight) and I had to pick shards of glass out of the front tyres because they'd plonked it down in what seemed like a car park made entirely from smashed glass!
I mean what grounds have I got? They've tweaked my car and it seems like its PCN'd and towed really quickly and as we aren't from the area we didn't have a clue about any of it so to be charged £240 and put through the hassle of retrieving it over gettin 99% of the process right and 1% of it wrong just feels utterly galling. Car damage and appealing for sympathy seem like my only option?
Yeah it was parked where the white van is in the street view picture. All we can think of is that the number plate wasn't written in the box. Which was an honest mistake. OH filled it out in the apartment with the intention to complete it at the car. But just forgot! As I say 99% right, 1% wrong and an overly heavy price to pay for it. Feels so unjustified.
Should I actually ring the council up to speak to someone about this or will they just tell me computer says no, fill in the form?
Should I actually ring the council up to speak to someone about this or will they just tell me computer says no, fill in the form?
If the council workers are anything like those who manned the impound (who never once answered the phone in the 30 attempts I made to get hold of them to confirm....and I rang the phone whilst in the queue there. They just let it ring!) then I fully expect computer says no all the way to the bank (theirs).
Totally inept, slow, jobsworthy and intent on destroying a small forest in paper work for every car they release. Doesn't fill me with hope.
Totally inept, slow, jobsworthy and intent on destroying a small forest in paper work for every car they release. Doesn't fill me with hope.
roofer said:
We do a lot of work around there, we use Contractor Permits. If they are not filled in exactly right, the little fat fella whacks the ticket on, then gets straight on the radio to the truck. Scam of the Century.
He did make the mistake of parking his scooter in our site compound once, six hours before we let him have it back
Had half the parking co bosses down , we eventually let him on site to retrieve once he had done the full blown site induction.
You're on a hiding to nothing i'm afraid.
Well that makes me feel a little better. I suspect this kind of thing is the only recompense I'll be getting. Just make sure to do it again for me hahaha! He did make the mistake of parking his scooter in our site compound once, six hours before we let him have it back
Had half the parking co bosses down , we eventually let him on site to retrieve once he had done the full blown site induction.
You're on a hiding to nothing i'm afraid.
Its so unjustified though, its really gotten to me. You do wonder why you bother being a normal law abiding citizen some times. I know people who've done proper crime, with proper victims get away with less than this. Though of course those types generally don't have money to pay them with. We do.
Apparently the police get a lot of calls from people who ring to report their car stolen when really the council have come, slapped and PCN on it and then towed it away 5 minutes later. I just cannot see how that sort of behaviour is allowed to slide. Its wasting police time.
Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Monday 30th May 17:29
vonhosen said:
How have they wasted the Police's time?
I spent a while on the phone trying to report the car stolen. The police found it in the impound. Apparently according to what I have heard this is quite a common occurance. I don't know about you but lots of people ringing the police because their car has disappeared without a trace because the council saw fit to just remove it seems like it might be a waste of police time? Does to me anyway. That is my opinion. Put yourself in my position, I don't live in London and I am not from the area. How was I to know what had happened? All I knew is the car was gone. It was parked in a proper spot with the right permit for the zone so I didn't think it would be towed. So naturally I assumed it had been nicked. Its keyless entry, I know there are methods for taking a car without causing damage or breaking glass.
I suppose now this is the point where we're going to be heading for a pedantic argument in the traditional PH manner. I won't be joining in.
My OH filled the permit in. I presumed she did it right. I didn't realise she'd planned to fill the reg in at the car because she didn't remember it. But in the rush and the tiredness it just slipped her mind by the time she got back down. As I say honest mistake. A mistake, but hardly one worth £240. As said we did think we were all sorted and above board.
Anyway it's in the past now. All I can do is at least try to contest it and see where I get. Probably no where but at least I will try. Already budgeting to write the money off though.
Anyway it's in the past now. All I can do is at least try to contest it and see where I get. Probably no where but at least I will try. Already budgeting to write the money off though.
Thank you for the kind replies and support gentlemen. I did expect to be given a lot of the typical holier than thou responses that you see all over this forum. But glad it has been refrained here. I will ignore them anyway.
Having issues registering for Pepipoo. No validation email coming through. I will sleep on it now and pick it up in the morning. Thanks for the good luck wishes, much appreciated. Though I suspect the likely outcome will be to swallow the pill and chalk it up to experience. I also suspect they won't be paying for repairs to my car either so I'll be another £60 down for the tracking correction.
Having issues registering for Pepipoo. No validation email coming through. I will sleep on it now and pick it up in the morning. Thanks for the good luck wishes, much appreciated. Though I suspect the likely outcome will be to swallow the pill and chalk it up to experience. I also suspect they won't be paying for repairs to my car either so I'll be another £60 down for the tracking correction.
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