Consumer Rights Act dispute
Discussion
Consumer Rights Act advice
Chaps, I am in a dispute with the people that fitted a rather expensive domestic alarm system (Risco Agility 3). They are members of Checkatrade and Trustpilot
They fitted the system on 16th December. We used it until 27th February with what we thought were no problems. That morning, I walked out of the house without unsetting the alarm, for the first time. It failed to sound. To this day, I have no idea if it ever worked.
I contacted the company, who sent an engineer out the next day. Communications were cordial until this point. They supposedly fixed the alarm. I sent a friendly e-mail thanking them for great service (if only I knew!), and for turning up the next day.
On 2nd March, the alarm failed to sound. I tested various sensors around the house: PIR and door/shock. None of them triggered the alarm.
At this point, I wrote to them, stating that I wanted them to come and take the alarm away, and to refund both its cost and the installation costs, as well as making good the damage where sensors were removed etc.
They wrote back to me stating that they would refund the alarm, but not the installation. I (perhaps incorrectly) cited the Consumer Rights Act at them, stating that I wanted my money back for the installation charge. They came back at me stating that they would not refund this charge as a) I had had the system for more than 30 days and had stated that I was happy with the installation. They would offer £75 for inconvenience.
I am royally pissed off as as far as I am concerned, they provided a paid service (installation) that has not resulted in what I consider to be the desired result (a working system).
Somewhat unfortunately, the Act only requires that a service be provided with reasonable care and skill. The alarm not working could be their fault, but it may not be (defective equipment).
1) Do I basically have to give them endless chances to rectify the problem?
2) Do they have to continue to try to rectify until it works? Their latest e-mail states that they will make “one last attempt” to remedy the situation, by replacing the alarm panel. Or is their only obligation to take the alarm back and refund its cost, leaving me with no working alarm and no refund of the installation fee?
2) the attempts at rectification (2 so far). I have not paid for these. Are they covered by the Act?
Basically, I need to assert that their service was sub-standard, de facto, as the alarm stopped working. Their argument is that their service was fine, but the alarm is faulty. They have recently tried to assert that the alarm manufacturer is saying that the issue is “environmental”. I fail to see how this could be the case – we are in London, with perfect broadband and phone line, rather than the Outer Hebrides!
What has annoyed me is their attitude here, and the fact that I may have to pay for a service that in my mind was not adequately performed (result bad) but in their mind was just fine (alarm worked, and then broke, so installation itself was fine).
They are also I feel relying on the amounts being small enough for me to not make a fuss. If the case is clear cut, I’d actually spend a few thousand and some days off in court to bring them to heel and make sure they do not do this to anyone else…
Chaps, I am in a dispute with the people that fitted a rather expensive domestic alarm system (Risco Agility 3). They are members of Checkatrade and Trustpilot
They fitted the system on 16th December. We used it until 27th February with what we thought were no problems. That morning, I walked out of the house without unsetting the alarm, for the first time. It failed to sound. To this day, I have no idea if it ever worked.
I contacted the company, who sent an engineer out the next day. Communications were cordial until this point. They supposedly fixed the alarm. I sent a friendly e-mail thanking them for great service (if only I knew!), and for turning up the next day.
On 2nd March, the alarm failed to sound. I tested various sensors around the house: PIR and door/shock. None of them triggered the alarm.
At this point, I wrote to them, stating that I wanted them to come and take the alarm away, and to refund both its cost and the installation costs, as well as making good the damage where sensors were removed etc.
They wrote back to me stating that they would refund the alarm, but not the installation. I (perhaps incorrectly) cited the Consumer Rights Act at them, stating that I wanted my money back for the installation charge. They came back at me stating that they would not refund this charge as a) I had had the system for more than 30 days and had stated that I was happy with the installation. They would offer £75 for inconvenience.
I am royally pissed off as as far as I am concerned, they provided a paid service (installation) that has not resulted in what I consider to be the desired result (a working system).
Somewhat unfortunately, the Act only requires that a service be provided with reasonable care and skill. The alarm not working could be their fault, but it may not be (defective equipment).
1) Do I basically have to give them endless chances to rectify the problem?
2) Do they have to continue to try to rectify until it works? Their latest e-mail states that they will make “one last attempt” to remedy the situation, by replacing the alarm panel. Or is their only obligation to take the alarm back and refund its cost, leaving me with no working alarm and no refund of the installation fee?
2) the attempts at rectification (2 so far). I have not paid for these. Are they covered by the Act?
Basically, I need to assert that their service was sub-standard, de facto, as the alarm stopped working. Their argument is that their service was fine, but the alarm is faulty. They have recently tried to assert that the alarm manufacturer is saying that the issue is “environmental”. I fail to see how this could be the case – we are in London, with perfect broadband and phone line, rather than the Outer Hebrides!
What has annoyed me is their attitude here, and the fact that I may have to pay for a service that in my mind was not adequately performed (result bad) but in their mind was just fine (alarm worked, and then broke, so installation itself was fine).
They are also I feel relying on the amounts being small enough for me to not make a fuss. If the case is clear cut, I’d actually spend a few thousand and some days off in court to bring them to heel and make sure they do not do this to anyone else…
Good advice - if the alarm is not working due to interference, this changes things. I would rather it was fixed.
However, if they, as a competent installer, failed to test and advise that the system would have difficulties, surely this means that their service is not adequate? They sold and fitted something not fit for purpose, after putting themselves out as experts!
If they can fix it, fine. If not - I want my money back!
PS - second rectification attempt was made 3rd March. First was made 28th Feb. Both times they tested it, ot worked, then stopped working.
However, if they, as a competent installer, failed to test and advise that the system would have difficulties, surely this means that their service is not adequate? They sold and fitted something not fit for purpose, after putting themselves out as experts!
If they can fix it, fine. If not - I want my money back!
PS - second rectification attempt was made 3rd March. First was made 28th Feb. Both times they tested it, ot worked, then stopped working.
TooMany2cvs said:
Harry Flashman said:
However, if they, as a competent installer, failed to test and advise that the system would have difficulties
You tell us whether they tested... You were the one who was there...Harry Flashman said:
If they can fix it, fine. If not - I want my money back!
They can't fix it if you won't let 'em.Perhaps the interference wasn't present at the time of install?
And as I also said, I have asked them to fix - twice. They are coming for the third time on Monday.
FurtiveFreddy said:
The way this often works is a company will supply goods and/or a service which are inadequate in some way.
The customer complains and asks for their money back.
The company then refers to their terms and conditions which state "blah blah blah" and refuse to pay up.
What you have to establish first is whether "blah blah blah" is the law or whether they have just made it up. Consumer rights cannot be overridden by someone making up their own Ts&Cs, but companies often make out they can so they don't have to abide by the law.
Services are covered by the Consumer Rights Act 2015, so they cannot say they are only legally obliged to refund the cost of the alarm itself.
Go after them in the right way and you will probably get your money back without having to go near a Court. Or just get them to fix it once and for all.
BTW, 30 days is a red herring. You have 6 months to go back to them and demand a full refund or make it work.
Thank you. This was my reading of the ACt.,The customer complains and asks for their money back.
The company then refers to their terms and conditions which state "blah blah blah" and refuse to pay up.
What you have to establish first is whether "blah blah blah" is the law or whether they have just made it up. Consumer rights cannot be overridden by someone making up their own Ts&Cs, but companies often make out they can so they don't have to abide by the law.
Services are covered by the Consumer Rights Act 2015, so they cannot say they are only legally obliged to refund the cost of the alarm itself.
Go after them in the right way and you will probably get your money back without having to go near a Court. Or just get them to fix it once and for all.
BTW, 30 days is a red herring. You have 6 months to go back to them and demand a full refund or make it work.
They sent an e-mail stating that as I said I was happy with their installation (I was, until the alarm stopped working), they are entitled to keep that cost.
To my mind, this service subsequently has proved to be inadequately provided and thus, if I can prove they performed it to a substandard level, I can.
If they didn't test to make sure the system would be suitable for its application, this is unlikely to be service to the correct standard.
Alucidnation said:
Harry Flashman said:
Damned annoying as a wired system would have been easy to install when we were renovating. Now, post decorating, a lot less so.
I am really cross with these fools.
Reads to me like you are mad with yourself for not getting a proper system installed and are now pissed off with the wireless system not functioning correctly.I am really cross with these fools.
That said, neighbours have a wireless system (not Risco). Works perfectly, so...
Thanks - I have numerous mesh systems running, which could be a problem: Sonos, Lightwaverf and Honeywell Evohome.
These could well cause a problem: but again, installed knew, and all of these systems were running when the alarm was installed. And they are all still working perfectly...
These could well cause a problem: but again, installed knew, and all of these systems were running when the alarm was installed. And they are all still working perfectly...
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