How to drive an R500 D properly...
Discussion
Check out this for comittment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxwRgSZiKTk&fea...
Imagine if he was running stickier tyres than CR500s....
Check out the save at 2.10 at the bump prior to Sx and the sideways correction coming out of the Karussel!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxwRgSZiKTk&fea...
Imagine if he was running stickier tyres than CR500s....
Check out the save at 2.10 at the bump prior to Sx and the sideways correction coming out of the Karussel!
430scuderia1 said:
the porsche should really have nailed him.
Neads a better driver in the caterham if you ask me........i will post my vids up in the snow
Agreed, that the GT2 probably should have had the legs on him, however, they aren't much off the lower classed VLN cars' pace. Also, the 7 is on crappy CR500s. Neads a better driver in the caterham if you ask me........i will post my vids up in the snow
Are you referring to the lap of a 911 driving in deep snow around the Ring? If so, that is
Not you driving is it?
PS how's the scud?
To those that have actually driven several laps at the Ring - yes the car clearly needs setting up, but the driver is still pressing on a bit
If you haven't been, the Ring is not like a UK circuit with loads of run off and predictable surfaces. It was just a bit of fun after all.
If anyone can do better, let's see your efforts!
If you haven't been, the Ring is not like a UK circuit with loads of run off and predictable surfaces. It was just a bit of fun after all. If anyone can do better, let's see your efforts!
James.S said:
What would those negative posters know about pedalling a caterham quickly anyhow, yer right, armchair bloody Schumachers the lot of 'em!
I'm joining you guys, he's a great driver, must be cos he has got it going sideways and the Stig got one sideways aswell, and that lap on TV wasn't edited for effect at all cos TG aint like that, so if he's doing what the stig did he's got to be a god
The commitment to get the car sideways (accidental or not) at the points where he did requires large balls.
Tell us about your 'Ring experience (not your UK circuit racing experience)?
pw75 said:
Armchair schey. Sweet.
Ok lets get this straight. There are tonnes of Caterham laps up on you tube posted by r300/400/500 who are quick in a straight line and that's about it. In comparison this guy is committed, but fact is he is not committed in comparison to what the car is capable of.
Go and look at the new radical lap record if you want to see comitted.
Agreed, but the Rad is a slightly different kettle of fish. The Rad guys went there in a (technically) road legal SR8 with 460hp with Verge, a professional driver, in the hope of beating the 'production' car lap record....Ok lets get this straight. There are tonnes of Caterham laps up on you tube posted by r300/400/500 who are quick in a straight line and that's about it. In comparison this guy is committed, but fact is he is not committed in comparison to what the car is capable of.
Go and look at the new radical lap record if you want to see comitted.
I think any attempt to get close to a 7.30 BTG time in an R500D would result in disaster for 99% of people, including those who may race in various UK series, who consider themselves able to 'commit' to a corner.... Unless you're trying to achieve a specific aim (like Michael Vergers), driving at more than 90% committment on the Ring can be a very dangerous pursuit - notwithstanding the fact that the video was shot on a closed circuit Pistenclub trackday)...
There are those that have driven the 'Ring, and those that comment on others' driving at the 'Ring, *sometimes* with nothing upon which to base their comments?
Edited by fergus on Thursday 29th October 13:18
James.S said:
fergus said:
James.S said:
James, having almost 1000 laps of the Ring under my belt, the laps in the video are committed. I suspect that even one of the Euro Masters CSR champions may not be as quick despite being able to 'pedal their car quickly'. (Mr. Hoffman excluded, as he's a local to the Ring!)
The commitment to get the car sideways (accidental or not) at the points where he did requires large balls.
Tell us about your 'Ring experience (not your UK circuit racing experience)?
Don't undestand what sideways and commitment have to do with one another. Are you suggesting that sideways shows commitment?
Never been round the 'ring, have managed to work out that it is twisty bits of tarmac joined by staight bits of tarmac........just like any other circuit. Am I missing something?
Sideways and commitment are not related, however, getting the power down when still in the Karussel to get the rear end step out (on the heavily cambered banking) is pushing on a fair bit. Also having the rear step out at circa 145mph over a bump is also pushing on a bit. Google "Schwedencreuz" and see what people say about this 'bend'. Notice that Verge in the SR8 Rad video, whilst 'showing commitment', dropped a gear and braked over here, despite his aero....
I think until you've been there and can speak from experience, then yes, you are missing the point here. Go there, and experience the camber changes, the surface irregularities and the lack of run off, then let us know how you got on....
James.S said:
you feel it is the way to drive so we will agree to differ.
I agree with you - the initial comment was more related to the way he was 'ragging' his car, rather than p1ssing about with it on the road and polishing it. i.e. driving it in the style in which the makers intended! Granted, his technical driving skills, and hence circuit times could be improved a bit, but full marks for effort!James.S said:
Your on Simon.....i had just googled RMA to look at prices.....GLOL
go on a public day, rather than on a closed trackday and cut your teeth properly, whilst getting buzzed by locals in Opal Kaddetts and GT3s and superbikes whilst you're still learning your way around. Only 13 odd miles to learn and 140 odd corners! pw75 said:
To make claims on what 99% of people (clubman racers or otherwise) may be able to achieve round there is nonsense
pw75 said:
...I've not driven the ring
..... Wait until you've driven there and then see how difficult it is to get within the realm of a ~ 7.30 BTG time. I suspect most, even in an R500D would not be able to manage it. I think you'd be surprised how much commitment is needed to do this. What may appear quick in a video (i.e. perhaps smoother style and better lines) is different to what is actually quick versus the clock...
For an example of this, see if you can see Richard Ince's 8 odd year old clip of his yellow R500K at the Ring. This is smoother, but slower...
Edited by fergus on Thursday 29th October 17:26
thequietone said:
I'm with a few other guys on this....most of the speed is in the car, not the driver, if you see what I mean. Lots and lots of time slipping away but that's not what it's always about. Cracking viewing though!
The ring is a bit like a hillclimb, in that a fast car does not a quick lap make! You need to be able to string the corners together well to go quickly there. Pointing and squirting is what the UK registered bikes do, and hold everyone up (they seem to forget they have mirrors)...James.S said:
fergus said:
thequietone said:
I'm with a few other guys on this....most of the speed is in the car, not the driver, if you see what I mean. Lots and lots of time slipping away but that's not what it's always about. Cracking viewing though!
The ring is a bit like a hillclimb, in that a fast car does not a quick lap make! You need to be able to string the corners together well to go quickly there. Pointing and squirting is what the UK registered bikes do, and hold everyone up (they seem to forget they have mirrors)...Unlike moisture.....the chap does Spa in the damp and here you can see the weaker points to his style are magnified massively. I don't mind putting up some wet laps around Spa for comparision. PW75 can you assist fella?
Agreed that to get a quick lap, everything must come together, but there are few UK circuits that I can think of where the 1st corner affects the exit speed of the 3rd corner for example (other than the maggotts/beckets complex at slitherstone).... Several corners are also blind, unlike most UK circuits...
FFS - the link was put up as a bit of fun to show a relatively committed lap at the 'Ring. It wasn't an illustration of driving finesse or the perfect line.
James.S said:
fergus said:
James.S said:
fergus said:
thequietone said:
I'm with a few other guys on this....most of the speed is in the car, not the driver, if you see what I mean. Lots and lots of time slipping away but that's not what it's always about. Cracking viewing though!
The ring is a bit like a hillclimb, in that a fast car does not a quick lap make! You need to be able to string the corners together well to go quickly there. Pointing and squirting is what the UK registered bikes do, and hold everyone up (they seem to forget they have mirrors)...Unlike moisture.....the chap does Spa in the damp and here you can see the weaker points to his style are magnified massively. I don't mind putting up some wet laps around Spa for comparision. PW75 can you assist fella?
Agreed that to get a quick lap, everything must come together, but there are few UK circuits that I can think of where the 1st corner affects the exit speed of the 3rd corner for example (other than the maggotts/beckets complex at slitherstone).... Several corners are also blind, unlike most UK circuits...
FFS - the link was put up as a bit of fun to show a relatively committed lap at the 'Ring. It wasn't an illustration of driving finesse or the perfect line.
I should have perhaps titled the thread "An R500 driven with commitment"
jackal said:
fergus said:
jackal said:
this thread is ugly
constructive comment....haven't you got some headlamp bowls that need cleaning with a cotton bud?
Edited by fergus on Thursday 5th November 19:27
sfaulds said:
Bulls
t - it's just a circuit ffs. The principles of driving round it quickly are exactly the same as at any other circuit, there's just more of it to learn and more things to hit if you fk up. If you want to ban people from commenting on it, I'd do it on the grounds that no-one (as far as I'm aware) on this thread has driven *that* car - it could be an evil-handling sack of st you'd be scared of crossing the carpark in for all we know.
Those who are suggesting "it's just another circuit" seem to be the ones who have no experience of the place? t - it's just a circuit ffs. The principles of driving round it quickly are exactly the same as at any other circuit, there's just more of it to learn and more things to hit if you fk up. If you want to ban people from commenting on it, I'd do it on the grounds that no-one (as far as I'm aware) on this thread has driven *that* car - it could be an evil-handling sack of st you'd be scared of crossing the carpark in for all we know. No commentary 'bans' coming from my direction, only those where people are making strong comments based upon no real experience.....Again, for those that know the circuit, I think the car handles OK, other than where it's thrown off line by some of the bumps and cambers. But you knew that already, right?
James.S said:
Please enlighten me as to why things change in the Eifel mountains.......and please don't say odd cambers, lack of run off and blid corners as most circuits have this.
Incidentally the comment about academy/roadsport racers is a little uncalled for, most are very capable and commited to developing further than a trackday warrior........ but you probably noticed that at Rockingham.
As aluded to below, I can't think of many circuits where the 3rd corner is a function of the 1st corner in terms of exit speed?Incidentally the comment about academy/roadsport racers is a little uncalled for, most are very capable and commited to developing further than a trackday warrior........ but you probably noticed that at Rockingham.
Didn't get the Rockingham comment? Care to expand?
James.S said:
fergus said:
James.S said:
Please enlighten me as to why things change in the Eifel mountains.......and please don't say odd cambers, lack of run off and blid corners as most circuits have this.
Incidentally the comment about academy/roadsport racers is a little uncalled for, most are very capable and commited to developing further than a trackday warrior........ but you probably noticed that at Rockingham.
As aluded to below, I can't think of many circuits where the 3rd corner is a function of the 1st corner in terms of exit speed?Incidentally the comment about academy/roadsport racers is a little uncalled for, most are very capable and commited to developing further than a trackday warrior........ but you probably noticed that at Rockingham.
Didn't get the Rockingham comment? Care to expand?
'Tripe' explained: If you screw up the first corner in a sequence of corners, it throws you off line for the second, which then means you exit speed is compromised for the third, hence lowering the overall exit speed for the complex.
Simple enough for you? Ask Staurt if you can't comprehend this.
Edited by fergus on Friday 6th November 17:15
The Wookie said:
Good to see logic is keeping its authority over pack mentality and bloody mindedness on PH as usual.
Not really, people are only providing their opinions based upon their own experiences. If two people's opinions are the same, they now form a 'pack'? Interesting.How has logic been defied below?
Gassing Station | Caterham | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff