Surrey Roof improvements - Part II

[bobfather]

Following on from the 'Surrey Roof improvements' topic

The replacement swing-eye bolts as explained in the previous topic have worked perfectly but there is still a natural angle that forms between the rear section and the main roof. This causes the window flap to twist and deform. A great pity this wasn't designed better in the first place but there is a simple fix to make the flap lie flat to the side windows.







The annoying window flap twist can easily be pulled flat but securing it in this position is not easy. I first tried to stitch it with twine but this didn't have the strength to hold it firm so I resorted to a small tie-wrap which easily holds the required crease in place.







I followed with a hot steam iron to flatten out the remaining twists and refitted the roof panel. As shown, the flap now sits flat onto the side windows

[bobfather]

mk1fan said:

The shortest distance etc........

I meant to post it on the other thread but I think the flaps need to go outside the window, not inside. That said, this little tweak would help that too.

I wonder if the manufacturer is watching?

Definitely inside! The flaps aren't far enough out to sit neatly outside. I do know someone who pulls them outside if he's parked up and it's raining

[bobfather]

portzi said:

I don't own a Surrey Roof so cannot comment on experience, but without some sort of rubber seal pressed against the window top would not the water simply run off the roof and onto the roof underside and bead down between the flap which is positioned on the inside of the window and the inside and the glass, as it is not sealed?

The roof has a 'drip lip' so rain drips off the roof about 10mm beyond the glass surface. I've only had mine since December but it has been out in hard rain a couple of times without any water ingress and with flaps inside both driving and parked

[bobfather]

ray von said:

In the picture of the passenger side, how does the window get under the 'lip' when you close the door? It looks too high.

Yes, I spotted that and went back to look, it looks worse in the picture but it is still higher than the drip lip at the very back. The top of the window relaxes inwards a few mm as the door opens and that lowers the height plenty to get under the lip.

ETA it was quickly refitted for the photos so it may not be evenly positioned

Edited by bobfather on Thursday 25th August 14:00

[bobfather]

^^Nice solution^^

I can see from your roof that the orientation that the fabric is bonded onto the rear hard section is flat, that'll mean tightening the stretcher bars will push it home. My fabric is glued on with the rear section twisted up-over so my roof could never sit properly into the rear gutter and tightening the stretchers only pushes it up, opening the gaps further. Hence my addition of swing-eyes rather than the rose joints



It's a pity Roger can't get consistency into the build process

[bobfather]

ChimpOnGas said:

Agreed mate, not sure why mine is different unless Roger had improved the design by the time his trimmer made mine?

Mine is new, bought last December, I think looking at others that either the design is worsening or I was just unlucky. What ever the case I have to say Roger did not want to help and that left a bad taste in my mouth, these items are flipping expensive

ChimpOnGas said:

My solution to the bowing inner flap takes a different approach to yours, I will shortly have Dave The Trimmer stitch a small pochet to each end of the flap to which will be inserted a flexible steel rule, by a happy coincidence I found just the right size for the job and with careful spacing of the little stitched pockets at each end I will be able to spring the flexible steel rule in place when fitting the Surrey top.

I'd be very interested to see that, it sounds like a much better solution than my tie-wrap

ChimpOnGas said:

Try the Sugru stuff Bob, I bet you'll like it

Mine fits well now that I've fixed the upward rotation of the rear section. I would also worry that matching the green would be a bit hit & miss with Sugru




The front has always fitted well

ChimpOnGas said:

Since the above photos were taken I've also built up the underside of the rear header lip to lift the N/S drip rail away from the very rear corner of the window at that side of the car only, this has worked nicely stopping the glass just catching drip rail at that point.

Same here, I cut a spare length of fuel hose down the length then tapered the ends. Those are glued to the underside outer edges of the rear flange. This pushes out the edges to align them with the folding section and pushes the drip lip out to improve rain protection

[bobfather]

ChimpOnGas said:

The nylon bead inside your drip lip looks twisted. Both sides on mine are straight so the drip lip gap is constant all the way along. Depending how tight the stitching is it may be possible to pull the bead out and replace it with a straight piece

[bobfather]

Mine's on and off a lot but when not in use it's normally on so perhaps my beads are better able to stay straight

[bobfather]

ChimpOnGas said:

Net curtain wire sounds a bit of a comical choice but it's super flexible, always returns to straight and because it's a effectively a steel spring it shouldn't warp in heat like the nylon beading does.

I think it sounds perfect Dave, I do recall removing some from a bathroom during a house renovation and noticing rust inside so I would suggest you pack and seal the ends so that moisture can't get to the inner spring

[bobfather]

Just arrived back from touring Derbyshire for a week and thought it time to add a positive comment about the Surrey Roof. Having suffered the worst downpour in memory with several lightening flashes per second and flash flooding. The interior of my car was totally dry.

Now for the main reason for buying a Surrey Roof

Full boot, roof on



Full boot, roof off

[bobfather]

Matthew Poxon said:

Good to hear your improvements have paid off. Blimey you don't travel light do you!

We have a husky so the rear shelf is taken, everything in the boot, we just keep filling until it's full

[bobfather]

Bassfiendnoideawhathp said:

Bet that's a cracking sight to see...

Phil

Matthew Poxon said:

Husky, very cool.

Any pictures of the dog in the Tiv?

Here she is from an earlier trip

[bobfather]

ray von said:

After seeing first hand the surrey top and reading some of the fettling on here. I'm wondering whether the answer would be to get an untrimmed top from the supplier and get it to fit first?
I'm thinking more Dave's sugru fix rather than the curtain wire obviously.

Yes that would work better.

Roger sends the hard pieces out to be trimmed by a third party. Looking at mine I see that the mohair has been glued onto the rear section at an inappropriate angle. Dave's sugru fix may be due to his front section being affixed to the mohair wrongly. I was thinking he needs to have a jig of some sort to hold the front and rear in the right orientation while the mohair is laid on.

There is a lot of talk about there being differences between cars due to them being hand built and Roger used that excuse when I asked for help. I believe there may be small variations but the individual parts were produced from moulds so I doubt that could account for the variable fitment issues people are having with the Surrey unit. They are replacing a mould produced solid section that fitted properly

[bobfather]

I would have to say a Surrey Roof whether it be a good or bad fit. The issue for me is to do with enabling me to use the car as a tourer. I have a later Chimaera with the vertically opening boot lid, it has never been an issue for me to get the hard top in the boot. I just need to minimise the stowage space that the lid consumes, the Surrey wins hands down.

I'm doing further fettling right now trying to encourage an ever better rear section fit. If I had the courage for the task I'd peel the rear mohair corners and reattach so that the fit could be perfect, I'm worried that the mohair surface would suffer

[bobfather]

The answer is to return the item and make Roger feel the pain. My problem was that Roger did not accept that he is running a business so hid behind 'private seller' rights, buyer beware. I suspect this was a lot to do with mine being a green one and therefore a one off that he would struggle to resell

[bobfather]

Dave, I'm not grumbling about this, as per the title, I'm sharing my solutions. I admit however that the tone of my words is sometimes coloured by my feelings regarding Roger's unwillingness to accept any accountability. He provided me with a product that had an obvious and problematic manufacturing error and apparently that was my fault. I eventually decided to accept the 'cottage industry' nature of the product as you say, but I think it is fair to voice this so that potential future buyers become informed. I certainly thought I was buying from a business and may have approached the purchase differently had I had foresight

[bobfather]

bobfather said:

ChimpOnGas said:

My solution to the bowing inner flap takes a different approach to yours, I will shortly have Dave The Trimmer stitch a small pochet to each end of the flap to which will be inserted a flexible steel rule, by a happy coincidence I found just the right size for the job and with careful spacing of the little stitched pockets at each end I will be able to spring the flexible steel rule in place when fitting the Surrey top.

I'd be very interested to see that, it sounds like a much better solution than my tie-wrap

Back on topic...

I've been playing with this stainless steel rule idea. I have one rule long enough and narrow enough to achieve it. I split the stitched seam at the rear of the existing flaps. The mohair is doubled over and partially glued but with a little manipulation I was able to ease the glue apart and insert the rule.

I have now ordered two stainless rules and intend to add a 'stop' to the end of each to ensure they don't go too far in. I need to leave the far front of the flaps flexible because the flaps needs to bend around the aluminium window frames

Edited by bobfather on Wednesday 21st September 15:37

[bobfather]

As this thread has been resurrected I thought I should share my further improvement. I bought a couple of thin 500mm steel rulers and unglued the folded wind-flaps so that I could insert the steel rulers into the flaps to make them more rigid. I did this mod a couple of years ago and have found this a very effective way of keeping the flap firmly pressed on the inside of the window. The roof can be half folded with the rulers in place but they need to be withdrawn for full folding.

Shaped steel rule





Inserting the rule





In position





Half folded, Great for days out when showers threaten