Old fashioned immobiliser woes
Discussion
My 1981 Lancia Beta Spyder has an old fashioned immobiliser. It is one of those which requires you to insert a small cylindrical touch key into a socket. The red light turns green, and you can then start the car. When engaged, the immobiliser prevents sparking.
Yesterday, the red light came on whilst I was driving. The car carried on alright until I reached my destination, but when later on I sought to start the car, the red light would not go out and the immobiliser remained engaged.
I have disconnected the battery, and shall have another go later, but wonder if anyone here has encountered problems with this type of device.
I hate all immobilisers on principle, as they can knock out a perfectly good car. My Lancia has an under bonnet battery cutoff key anyway, so the immobiliser is a redundant system, offering at best a visual deterrent that the average scrote would probably ignore anyway.
I will post a photo of the device later. No doubt it can be bypassed, but right now it's a pain.
Yesterday, the red light came on whilst I was driving. The car carried on alright until I reached my destination, but when later on I sought to start the car, the red light would not go out and the immobiliser remained engaged.
I have disconnected the battery, and shall have another go later, but wonder if anyone here has encountered problems with this type of device.
I hate all immobilisers on principle, as they can knock out a perfectly good car. My Lancia has an under bonnet battery cutoff key anyway, so the immobiliser is a redundant system, offering at best a visual deterrent that the average scrote would probably ignore anyway.
I will post a photo of the device later. No doubt it can be bypassed, but right now it's a pain.
I add that the tiny touchkey does not appear to contain a battery. I have tried each of the two that I have. The fact that the light switched from green to red whilst the car was running suggests to me that the problem lies in the wiring somewhere.
The more modern transponder immobiliser on my Lotus Excel was zapped by the light fittings at a motorway service station in France, according to the tow truck guy who took me 1 km away, whereupon the car started.
The more modern transponder immobiliser on my Lotus Excel was zapped by the light fittings at a motorway service station in France, according to the tow truck guy who took me 1 km away, whereupon the car started.
The car had been standing for ages until last week, awaiting a spare mechanical part. The battery was then given a jump, and I drove the car around with modest vigour. The voltmeter on rhe dash shows a good reading, and the car has started OK and all electrics have been fine, until now.
I have just reconnected the battery. At first no red or green light showed, and the digital clock did not come on. I tried the radio: no power, but all other electrics worked. Starter motor, but no spark.
Then the red light, clock and radio all woke up. So, inmobiliser still on. Now I have to go to a social do, so will investigate further tomorrow.
A pity, as today I could have taken the top off the car for the first time in ages.
I have just reconnected the battery. At first no red or green light showed, and the digital clock did not come on. I tried the radio: no power, but all other electrics worked. Starter motor, but no spark.
Then the red light, clock and radio all woke up. So, inmobiliser still on. Now I have to go to a social do, so will investigate further tomorrow.
A pity, as today I could have taken the top off the car for the first time in ages.
The battery is fine, thanks, and the car is now running.
The voltage was fine. The wiring at the dashboard end meant nothing to me, so I had a look at the coil. It appears that this immobiliser is an integral part of the coil. I had a prod, took connections off and put them back on again, and all that, and even tried swearing at the car in reasonably accented Italian, which is usually a sure fine winner, but still no go.
I rang the RAC, and a bloke turned up within 20 minutes. He had a good root around in the wires at the coil. He could not find any way of disconnecting or bypassing the contraption. We observed that this was a good design from the point of view of being tamper resistant, but a right pain when not working properly. The car used to live in Cheshire, so maybe its 1980s owner (at that time the car would have been considered moderately flash and TWOCworthy) was concerned about teenage Scallies coming out to visit him at night: hence the battery cutoff and an immobiliser that cannot be rapidly overcome.
The RAC bloke suggested that the solution would be to replace the coil with an ordinary one, but he did not have a coil in his truck, and it was too early for car shops to be open. So we tidied up and prepared to jack it in for the time being, but then, on one last try with the jack plug widget, the green light came on. Clearly the RAC bloke's poking at wires powers are greater than mine. Anyway, car home and garaged. I tried repeatedly stopping the engine, waiting a minute, and then starting it, and now the immobiliser works properly and the car starts with ease, but I will still bin the immobiliser/coil.
Thanks for all helpful suggestions above. Dr Mike Oxgreen appears to be the winner of the fiver. I will knock it off what you owe me for all that booze the other week, dear Doctor. Cars, eh? Rubbish, they are.
Here is a picture of the coil, with the immobiliser unit (silver) sat on top of it.
The voltage was fine. The wiring at the dashboard end meant nothing to me, so I had a look at the coil. It appears that this immobiliser is an integral part of the coil. I had a prod, took connections off and put them back on again, and all that, and even tried swearing at the car in reasonably accented Italian, which is usually a sure fine winner, but still no go.
I rang the RAC, and a bloke turned up within 20 minutes. He had a good root around in the wires at the coil. He could not find any way of disconnecting or bypassing the contraption. We observed that this was a good design from the point of view of being tamper resistant, but a right pain when not working properly. The car used to live in Cheshire, so maybe its 1980s owner (at that time the car would have been considered moderately flash and TWOCworthy) was concerned about teenage Scallies coming out to visit him at night: hence the battery cutoff and an immobiliser that cannot be rapidly overcome.
The RAC bloke suggested that the solution would be to replace the coil with an ordinary one, but he did not have a coil in his truck, and it was too early for car shops to be open. So we tidied up and prepared to jack it in for the time being, but then, on one last try with the jack plug widget, the green light came on. Clearly the RAC bloke's poking at wires powers are greater than mine. Anyway, car home and garaged. I tried repeatedly stopping the engine, waiting a minute, and then starting it, and now the immobiliser works properly and the car starts with ease, but I will still bin the immobiliser/coil.
Thanks for all helpful suggestions above. Dr Mike Oxgreen appears to be the winner of the fiver. I will knock it off what you owe me for all that booze the other week, dear Doctor. Cars, eh? Rubbish, they are.
Here is a picture of the coil, with the immobiliser unit (silver) sat on top of it.
Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 27th January 09:27
The voltage was fine with the engine off (indeed, whilst the engine could not be started).
Insurers can be daft, sometimes. Things like a battery cutoff switch do not interest them, but if you have some bit of electronical tat, especially one that has been certified by some bunch of electronical tat certifiers, they give you a whole tenner off, or something.
New immobiliser? No way - they are the spawn of Beelzebub.
Insurers can be daft, sometimes. Things like a battery cutoff switch do not interest them, but if you have some bit of electronical tat, especially one that has been certified by some bunch of electronical tat certifiers, they give you a whole tenner off, or something.
New immobiliser? No way - they are the spawn of Beelzebub.
By the way, the small pipe describing a loop in the lower right of the picture is the incredibly high tech remote dipstick pipe. You are supposed to be able to check the engine oil level by pressing a button whilst sipping a Campari in the driver's seat. This is a rubbish device that never works.
Alas, no large manor, but lots of sheds in sheds. Unless business picks up soon, I may have to put some curtains in the Lancia.
The point about the rubber cover (which conceals a puzzling number of connectors and wires) may be well made, although the car had been in a dry place before the problem started, and it wasn't rained on until it had already conked out.
The point about the rubber cover (which conceals a puzzling number of connectors and wires) may be well made, although the car had been in a dry place before the problem started, and it wasn't rained on until it had already conked out.
Err, what things in the back? I can see the headrests of the front seats.
The dash design dates from 1979, and is better than that on the Series A Spyders. The interior is, however, definitely a sneak preview of that "everything in black plastic" 80s experience (still to be found on Audis and VWs everywhere).
The instrument panel is an over fussy design, with too many needles and knobs.
The dash design dates from 1979, and is better than that on the Series A Spyders. The interior is, however, definitely a sneak preview of that "everything in black plastic" 80s experience (still to be found on Audis and VWs everywhere).
The instrument panel is an over fussy design, with too many needles and knobs.
Here is the horrid contraption minus its rubber hat. Also, another shot of the Barry bling. The cable for the semi automatic choke [EDIT: I talk bollix - it's the throttle, not the choke] can't seem to go anywhere else, neat fiends.
Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 29th January 15:00
na said:
Breadvan72 said:
Err, what things in the back?
I think they're seats but I don't understand why they'd be there Breadvan72 said:
The dash design dates from 1979,
you legal types with your word twistingBreadvan72 said:
Here is the horrid contraption minus its rubber hat. Also, another shot of the Barry bling. The cable for the semi automatic choke can't seem to go anywhere else, neat fiends.
some nasty tight degree bends on the wires off the plugs thereBreadvan72 said:
. . . things like that can cause immobilizer problems
As for the Neat-Nazi points, duly noted, and if I CBA later I might have a tidy up, although I confess that I prefer the sort of car fixing that involves hitting stuff with a big hammer.
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