Oil usage, 2006 9-5 Aero
Discussion
I recently bought a 120,000 mile 2006 9-5 Aero. Lovely car, and now I have fixed the aircon and fitted new tyres and brakes. It is/was set to be my daily driver for the next 100,000 miles.
So I am puzzled about its oil consumption. Previous 9-5s (1998 and 1999) have used very little oil. This one has used 4.5 litres of 0w40 fully synthetic Mobil/Castrol in 4000 miles.
Yes, I do get a little blue smoke on cold start up first thing, which I put down to valve seals, but no other smoke and no leaks. Plugs are clean, oil is fresh (changed on purchase), but I have had the classic P1312 coil packs ECU code a few times.
Any thoughts?
Also, I may be spoiled these days by a 300 bhp TVR, but this 260 bhp Aero feels frankly sluggish to me. Overtaking trucks has to be planned rather than just done.
Could the two things be linked?
So I am puzzled about its oil consumption. Previous 9-5s (1998 and 1999) have used very little oil. This one has used 4.5 litres of 0w40 fully synthetic Mobil/Castrol in 4000 miles.
Yes, I do get a little blue smoke on cold start up first thing, which I put down to valve seals, but no other smoke and no leaks. Plugs are clean, oil is fresh (changed on purchase), but I have had the classic P1312 coil packs ECU code a few times.
Any thoughts?
Also, I may be spoiled these days by a 300 bhp TVR, but this 260 bhp Aero feels frankly sluggish to me. Overtaking trucks has to be planned rather than just done.
Could the two things be linked?
Thanks - I will either have a look myself, or take it to CVM Saab tomorrow when i am working about 3 miles from their workshops.
Last time I tried to use UK Saabs forums it didn't load - was that just me?
I do remember being mullahed by three Scottish members of UK Saabs on a Marham track day in 2012 - they were producing around 500 bhp each IIRC. I will track down Noobtune I think - thanks for your input
Last time I tried to use UK Saabs forums it didn't load - was that just me?
I do remember being mullahed by three Scottish members of UK Saabs on a Marham track day in 2012 - they were producing around 500 bhp each IIRC. I will track down Noobtune I think - thanks for your input
You have me intrigued.
I have been getting the P1312 coil pack fault code (plugs 1&2) about every fifth journey, always on start-up. The plugs are nice and clean, so I will try a different coil pack. I was going to borrow the coil pack off my wife's 9-5, but I was at a breakers yard this afternoon getting a 5p Ford spring clip for my TVR (you have to buy the entire wiring loom from a Ford dealer), and he happened to have a 9-5 in stock, so I acquired a coil pack, correct part number, on sale or return for £15.
The rest of your suggestions might as well be in Swahili for all I understood, but that's my failing and I will do the reading you suggest and test everything. I assume these things relate to my oil usage issues. Even the breakers yard geezer doubted my turbo was the cause.
I have been getting the P1312 coil pack fault code (plugs 1&2) about every fifth journey, always on start-up. The plugs are nice and clean, so I will try a different coil pack. I was going to borrow the coil pack off my wife's 9-5, but I was at a breakers yard this afternoon getting a 5p Ford spring clip for my TVR (you have to buy the entire wiring loom from a Ford dealer), and he happened to have a 9-5 in stock, so I acquired a coil pack, correct part number, on sale or return for £15.
The rest of your suggestions might as well be in Swahili for all I understood, but that's my failing and I will do the reading you suggest and test everything. I assume these things relate to my oil usage issues. Even the breakers yard geezer doubted my turbo was the cause.
Merci Monsieur Moustache.
I looked at the bolt mod and can see how to do it, but thought I would check the vacuum pipes first. I found the top direct pipe from the throttle to the bulkhead valve had popped off at the valve end. Pushed it back on, reset the ECU codes, changed over the coil pack unit for the breakers yard one, started it up and went for a blast.
In conclusion, the third battallion of the Household Cavalry are back where they belong, stabled under the Saab's bonnet, and it now gets up and goes like someone has queried its parentage and run off down the road laughing in a 911.
Couple more questions if I may -
1. does the collective think that this will also cure my oil usage problem? 500 mainly motorway miles in the last two days, driving like Miss Daisy's great aunt, and about 2/3 of a litre has vanished. Not on the ground or visible out of the exhaust.
2. My coil pack has a small crack in the underside, between plugs 3 & 4, but my fault code is a misfire on 1 & 2. The replacement coil pack has the same crack. I have sealed it with a decent strong glue. So far no fault code. Does the crack matter?
3. My fuel consumption, mainly on cruise control on the A1, has been 30.5 mpg. Should I see this improve?
Thanks
Edited to add - P1312 fault code back this morning on start up. Either I have two coil packs with the same fault, or perhaps a set of new plugs are called for? Even though they look fine, I think that's a good place to start.
I looked at the bolt mod and can see how to do it, but thought I would check the vacuum pipes first. I found the top direct pipe from the throttle to the bulkhead valve had popped off at the valve end. Pushed it back on, reset the ECU codes, changed over the coil pack unit for the breakers yard one, started it up and went for a blast.
In conclusion, the third battallion of the Household Cavalry are back where they belong, stabled under the Saab's bonnet, and it now gets up and goes like someone has queried its parentage and run off down the road laughing in a 911.
Couple more questions if I may -
1. does the collective think that this will also cure my oil usage problem? 500 mainly motorway miles in the last two days, driving like Miss Daisy's great aunt, and about 2/3 of a litre has vanished. Not on the ground or visible out of the exhaust.
2. My coil pack has a small crack in the underside, between plugs 3 & 4, but my fault code is a misfire on 1 & 2. The replacement coil pack has the same crack. I have sealed it with a decent strong glue. So far no fault code. Does the crack matter?
3. My fuel consumption, mainly on cruise control on the A1, has been 30.5 mpg. Should I see this improve?
Thanks
Edited to add - P1312 fault code back this morning on start up. Either I have two coil packs with the same fault, or perhaps a set of new plugs are called for? Even though they look fine, I think that's a good place to start.
Edited by QBee on Friday 3rd July 08:48
Thanks for your comments and info.
I have changed the plugs this morning for platinum ones. I take your point about plug type, but I have always fitted the best plugs possible as they are still cheap compared with wasted fuel and problem finding, and anyway they need changing far less often.
I have sealed up the crack on the second coil pack (only about an inch long) and will see what happens. I have tracked down the ad for the after market supplier and he is currently £140. The Saab dealer in Cambridge sells genuine saab parts for £225 delivered, so at least i have a choice, but I will see if my cheap fix has worked first. I only get the code on cold start-up, and not every time either, and just the P1312 code, so I should know pretty soon if I have a problem. The first time the EMU light comes on, a coil pack (DIC unit) goes on order. It might be of interest that the code is for plugs 1&2, and when I took the plugs out to change them all four were good and pale beige, but the number 1 plug looked slightly blacker around the edges than the other three.
I will track down the valves etc you mention re my oil loss and see if i have an issue there. I couldn't see how the oil and vacuum issues could be connected, but the vacuum pipe has made a serious difference to the running, so if I cannot see any issues where you suggest I will have to see next week what the oil consumption is like post-vacuum-repair. The first thing I did when I got the car was change the oil and filter for the best grade. I am using Mobil 0w40 and Castrol 5w30 (as that's what the petrol station had when i spotted the oil was low the first time). Both fully synthetic. If anything I am a little concerned that the hot end seems low - I use 10w60 in my TVR, but that gets a regular thrashing around race tracks, whereas the Saab's use is mainly Miss Daisy-like.
Mine is a manual Aero estate (after 20 years of driving autos, my TVR has inspired me to try manual again), and my normal driving is up and down the A1/A14/M11 on cruise control at 70. I go at 5 am to avoid the hideous 7-9 am holdups around Cambridge, so keep a pretty constant speed despite the elephant racers. My previous car, a 3.0 TDI Audi A8, was managing close to 45 mpg, and I had hoped the Saab might manage 35. But I guess the pipe off will have damaged fuel economy, so lets see.
Thanks again for all your help, I am grateful and am enjoying working through the issues.
It feels slightly strange being on the receiving end of advice for once - I am usually dishing it out on the TVR Chimaera forum.
I have changed the plugs this morning for platinum ones. I take your point about plug type, but I have always fitted the best plugs possible as they are still cheap compared with wasted fuel and problem finding, and anyway they need changing far less often.
I have sealed up the crack on the second coil pack (only about an inch long) and will see what happens. I have tracked down the ad for the after market supplier and he is currently £140. The Saab dealer in Cambridge sells genuine saab parts for £225 delivered, so at least i have a choice, but I will see if my cheap fix has worked first. I only get the code on cold start-up, and not every time either, and just the P1312 code, so I should know pretty soon if I have a problem. The first time the EMU light comes on, a coil pack (DIC unit) goes on order. It might be of interest that the code is for plugs 1&2, and when I took the plugs out to change them all four were good and pale beige, but the number 1 plug looked slightly blacker around the edges than the other three.
I will track down the valves etc you mention re my oil loss and see if i have an issue there. I couldn't see how the oil and vacuum issues could be connected, but the vacuum pipe has made a serious difference to the running, so if I cannot see any issues where you suggest I will have to see next week what the oil consumption is like post-vacuum-repair. The first thing I did when I got the car was change the oil and filter for the best grade. I am using Mobil 0w40 and Castrol 5w30 (as that's what the petrol station had when i spotted the oil was low the first time). Both fully synthetic. If anything I am a little concerned that the hot end seems low - I use 10w60 in my TVR, but that gets a regular thrashing around race tracks, whereas the Saab's use is mainly Miss Daisy-like.
Mine is a manual Aero estate (after 20 years of driving autos, my TVR has inspired me to try manual again), and my normal driving is up and down the A1/A14/M11 on cruise control at 70. I go at 5 am to avoid the hideous 7-9 am holdups around Cambridge, so keep a pretty constant speed despite the elephant racers. My previous car, a 3.0 TDI Audi A8, was managing close to 45 mpg, and I had hoped the Saab might manage 35. But I guess the pipe off will have damaged fuel economy, so lets see.
Thanks again for all your help, I am grateful and am enjoying working through the issues.
It feels slightly strange being on the receiving end of advice for once - I am usually dishing it out on the TVR Chimaera forum.
Edited by QBee on Friday 3rd July 15:57
Thanks both.
On the DI front, I have so far started the car five times since fitting the new plugs, and as yet the warning, which only comes on start up, is absent. More driving will tell me for certain if that is fixed.
Oil consumption - i am trying a week's driving before looking for turbo seal and valve issues, to see if it might have been solved by re-attaching the vacuum pipe. I will be doing 700 mainly motorway miles next week, which should give me some answers. I did pop into my local garage this afternoon and ask the proprietor if he thought I could be right. He said I stood a chance, as the lack of vacuum could have affected pressures elsewhere.
I did look at the oil pressure sensor thingy by the starter, but there was no serious oil leaking there.
I will report progress if there is any!
On the DI front, I have so far started the car five times since fitting the new plugs, and as yet the warning, which only comes on start up, is absent. More driving will tell me for certain if that is fixed.
Oil consumption - i am trying a week's driving before looking for turbo seal and valve issues, to see if it might have been solved by re-attaching the vacuum pipe. I will be doing 700 mainly motorway miles next week, which should give me some answers. I did pop into my local garage this afternoon and ask the proprietor if he thought I could be right. He said I stood a chance, as the lack of vacuum could have affected pressures elsewhere.
I did look at the oil pressure sensor thingy by the starter, but there was no serious oil leaking there.
I will report progress if there is any!
UPDATE
After 20 starts with no ECU light I was getting cocky about my £15 fix.......then the bloody thing came back on again last night. GRRRR! Guess a new one is called for. Do I do it now, or wait until I get more than just the P1312 warning? Tax and VAT to pay at the beginning of next month is the reason for my question.
And it is still using oil - over half a litre in the last 450 miles. No smoke whatsoever as far as I am aware. Time to take pipes off and investigate......if only I knew which pipes and WTF I was looking at!
On the positive side, having found the vacuum pipe on the bulkhead off, and pushed it back on, car now goes like a Saab Aero should go. Fuel consumption hasn't improved, mainly because I am driving it like a Saab Aero should go.....
After 20 starts with no ECU light I was getting cocky about my £15 fix.......then the bloody thing came back on again last night. GRRRR! Guess a new one is called for. Do I do it now, or wait until I get more than just the P1312 warning? Tax and VAT to pay at the beginning of next month is the reason for my question.
And it is still using oil - over half a litre in the last 450 miles. No smoke whatsoever as far as I am aware. Time to take pipes off and investigate......if only I knew which pipes and WTF I was looking at!
On the positive side, having found the vacuum pipe on the bulkhead off, and pushed it back on, car now goes like a Saab Aero should go. Fuel consumption hasn't improved, mainly because I am driving it like a Saab Aero should go.....
Follow up post, by way of a thank you.
Car presently sitting, engine in pieces, at the garage.
I had cappuccino in the coolant header tank, so took it in to be investigated.
Garage found that the head gasket had failed, timing chains were stretched and worn, that I had a leaking valve on number 4 cylinder, and that my piston rings were the cause of the heavy oil usage.
We are now undergoing the "while we are in there" exercise.
Complete head gasket kit, head skimmed, valves reseated, valve stem seals replaced, piston rings replaced, all 18 crankshaft shells replaced.
I get it back this week or next, will report again once it is run in and I have some idea how it is running on proper oil.
The guy doing the work is a friend who I trust completely, runs his own operation and has over 20 years experience. So while it will cost four figures (parts alone £540), I know it is all required.
Car presently sitting, engine in pieces, at the garage.
I had cappuccino in the coolant header tank, so took it in to be investigated.
Garage found that the head gasket had failed, timing chains were stretched and worn, that I had a leaking valve on number 4 cylinder, and that my piston rings were the cause of the heavy oil usage.
We are now undergoing the "while we are in there" exercise.
Complete head gasket kit, head skimmed, valves reseated, valve stem seals replaced, piston rings replaced, all 18 crankshaft shells replaced.
I get it back this week or next, will report again once it is run in and I have some idea how it is running on proper oil.
The guy doing the work is a friend who I trust completely, runs his own operation and has over 20 years experience. So while it will cost four figures (parts alone £540), I know it is all required.
Got it back today. Total cost, including parts, was £1904.
It had the head skimmed, valves removed, refaced and lapped back in, valve seals replaced.
New head gaskets kit, piston rings replaced, bores all de-glazed, crankshaft shells (all 18) replaced, timing chain, pulleys, guides and tensioners replaced, complete new breather system, new thermostat, new head bolts, new rad cap, water pump, temp sensor, oil separator, oil pressure sensor and oil and filter.
Presently running it on on 20w50 mineral oil, and it feels wonderful to drive. Even restricted to 2000-4000 rpm it pulls like a train without stressing and overtakes like the trucks are standing still. Just a total joy to drive. 700-1000 miles and it will go back in for an oil and filter change, to 5-w40 fully synthetic.
I agree with the sentiments of the last poster. I know the guy who re-built it, he has built race engines and sports car engines for years, races his own self-built TVR and has a real eye to detail. The car cost me £1500 as a 9 year old Aero, and has now, including the purchase price, a service, new quality tyres, new front brakes and a new aircon compressor, cost me £5,000 in total. Hopefully I will get another 80-100,000 miles from it - mostly motorway miles - without much further hassle over and above service costs. Fingers crossed.
Is it worth it? It was that, or sell it for parts and start again. And fix the next one. I buy old executive cars for comfort and safety, as I know I do 30,000 miles a year on business. I try to minimise depreciation, and hope I get away without too much wallet pain apart from service items and tyres. I have had all the pain at the start this time, and will take more care buying next time, but with a modicum of good fortune I won't have too much more trouble, and this car is a joy to drive and gives my clients (I am an accountant) exactly the right mix of message that I am reliable, not totally boring, and am not running my car at their expense.
Thanks for all your advice and support on the Saab forum - much appreciated.
It had the head skimmed, valves removed, refaced and lapped back in, valve seals replaced.
New head gaskets kit, piston rings replaced, bores all de-glazed, crankshaft shells (all 18) replaced, timing chain, pulleys, guides and tensioners replaced, complete new breather system, new thermostat, new head bolts, new rad cap, water pump, temp sensor, oil separator, oil pressure sensor and oil and filter.
Presently running it on on 20w50 mineral oil, and it feels wonderful to drive. Even restricted to 2000-4000 rpm it pulls like a train without stressing and overtakes like the trucks are standing still. Just a total joy to drive. 700-1000 miles and it will go back in for an oil and filter change, to 5-w40 fully synthetic.
I agree with the sentiments of the last poster. I know the guy who re-built it, he has built race engines and sports car engines for years, races his own self-built TVR and has a real eye to detail. The car cost me £1500 as a 9 year old Aero, and has now, including the purchase price, a service, new quality tyres, new front brakes and a new aircon compressor, cost me £5,000 in total. Hopefully I will get another 80-100,000 miles from it - mostly motorway miles - without much further hassle over and above service costs. Fingers crossed.
Is it worth it? It was that, or sell it for parts and start again. And fix the next one. I buy old executive cars for comfort and safety, as I know I do 30,000 miles a year on business. I try to minimise depreciation, and hope I get away without too much wallet pain apart from service items and tyres. I have had all the pain at the start this time, and will take more care buying next time, but with a modicum of good fortune I won't have too much more trouble, and this car is a joy to drive and gives my clients (I am an accountant) exactly the right mix of message that I am reliable, not totally boring, and am not running my car at their expense.
Thanks for all your advice and support on the Saab forum - much appreciated.
lewis328 said:
Qbee I see back in your first post you mention you fixed the A/C on your car. Can I ask what symptoms you had apart from the obvious, and how you fixed them. Mine has a leak but garage haven't been able to source where from. System has been run for an hr without gas levels dropping.
Thanks
Errr....I bought my car from a lying Yorkshiremen (other liars are available). Thanks
He knew why the aircon didn't work, but said "yes mate, it's working fine, probably just needs a re-gas". Regas didn't solve it.
Took it to an expert, who pointed out that the compressor was siezed and a shorter auxiliary belt had been fitted to bypass it completely.
Bought a recon compressor off Ebay and a longer belt, fitted, regassed, worked ever since.
So that doesn't help you.
Presumably the operative who regassed checked that the compressor is actually working? It's down the front left corner as you stand in front of the car, and can be heard clicking on and off as the car idles with the aircon switched on and at 16 degrees.The revs fluctuate at the same time, if that helps.
To depress you a bit more, I owned an Audi A8 for three years and never managed to find the reason why the aircon didn't work. In the end it had to be a pipe leak somewhere deep in the bowels of the engine bay or dash. If you've ever seen the engine bay of an A8 you will know why we couldn't find it.
The aircon on my wife's Saab 9-5 gets re-gassed every year, no visible leaks, works for about 6 months and then seems to lose all its gas. All I can say is "good luck".
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