Employers taking the ****.....

[surveyor]

18 Year old step-lad has started his first job today. I'm waiting for the call to pick him up...

13 hours, and he will have earned £34. £2.68 per hour.

Apparently he can be paid this low because he's been taken on an apprenticeship.

The skill that he is acquiring.... Waiting on tables.

I'm absolutely livid, but can't fight his battles for him. But it seems that what was to enable young workers to lean a trade/skill is now being used to take the piss.

Had to share - I certainly had no idea the minimum wage was so easy to side step.

[surveyor]

He's been under pressure to find something, and to his credit has. He has been well rewarded in a suitably PH way.

He also has a couple of irons in the fire that might lead to something better paid with decent prospects. I don't think his current employer can expect any loyalty.

Helpfully he was due to finish at 10. He has now missed the last bus. I will be very unimpressed if they don't put him in a taxi (and no doubt I'll be collecting him too!).

[surveyor]

Well just picked him up.

He enjoyed it, but I like nothing that i hear.

Bloke pays cash at the end of month. High staff turnover. Apparently hours go missing. Tip jars go nowhere near staff etc.... Staff who leave don't get paid...

He's had two bits of interest from national insurance companies today, so hopefully something will come out of that.

My blood is boiling.

[surveyor]

Jayessgee said:

surveyor said:

Well just picked him up.

He enjoyed it, but I like nothing that i hear.

Bloke pays cash at the end of month. High staff turnover. Apparently hours go missing. Tip jars go nowhere near staff etc.... Staff who leave don't get paid...

He's had two bits of interest from national insurance companies today, so hopefully something will come out of that.

My blood is boiling.

He sounds like a keen young man. This will just be a very temporary stop gap. Big respect to him. You must be one proud dad.

I am, and it's the first time in a longtime I've felt able to say that.

He has turned a corner... He knows we are pleased as I bought a third car at the weekend for him to learn to drive in that will become his once the test is passed...

[surveyor]

10penceparalyzed said:

Funkycoldribena said:

Rightly or wrongly,I'd seriously put my kids off working for someone like that.I would rather they sat at home than work for such a pisstake.

And maybe with attitudes like this, this is why there is such a poor work ethic among alot of people in society, as they believe the world owes them a living.

I have worked for next to nothing when times were tough, something is better than nothing, and even with situations with jobs that aren't great, you will always be able to bring something positive away from it. like you know what you don't want in life, life is about learning good and bad. as my grandfather would of said it builds character.

I've thought about telling him to forget it, but believe sticking with it until a better option is available is better. If he mucks around on paying I will deal with that firmly during their busy period....

What I have said is if a proper firm wants to interview him when he has a shift I'll support him when he considers the priorities.... At a young age I worked for a firm who misled and lied about the job, and to its customers, eventually featured on watchdog. I spotted this and jumped quickly, but missed a couple of interviews with good prospects. That was a mistake I'd like him not to make.

[surveyor]

hidetheelephants said:

surveyor said:

Well just picked him up.

He enjoyed it, but I like nothing that i hear.

Bloke pays cash at the end of month. High staff turnover. Apparently hours go missing. Tip jars go nowhere near staff etc.... Staff who leave don't get paid...

He's had two bits of interest from national insurance companies today, so hopefully something will come out of that.

My blood is boiling.

I think dobbing in this modern day Scrooge to HMRC would be a public spirited thing to do, although I'd understand if you wait until your boy's found alternative employment.

There's no law against being paid cash.... We'll see if he gets a payslip with it!

[surveyor]

It's the first thing since he came back to live with us that he's been offered. It's better than doing nothing basically.

He's looking already and fingers crossed will be moving on...

Like most young kids he did not ask important questions so only now is realising just how bad a deal this really is.

[surveyor]

Breadvan72 said:

There is a fair bit of abuse of apprenticeship schemes. Have a look at this for possible parallels and maybe contact HMRC, which is the enforcement agency for NMW.

http://www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/markup.cgi?doc=/uk/c...

Interesting, many thanks BV. I suspect HMRC could drive coach and horses through this arrangement. As far as I am aware there is nothing in writing, let alone a training agreement....

For those who credit me with supporting him... There is a reason. He's had a tough time over the years due to his dad who is a dhead. Unfortunately for quite a while the step-lad followed in his footsteps, and was not a particularly pleasant kid to know.

His dad has now left the country (without even a goodbye as far as I am aware), and step-lad has sorted his head out, and is really making an effort. On the basis that if he's trying so will I we are forging ahead and I'm pleased to say I'm proud of him. Hopefully he won't cock it up.

Edited by surveyor on Tuesday 8th July 21:23

[surveyor]

T5SOR said:

Apprenticeships work both ways. They are cheap labour for employers and great experience and qualification gainers for the apprentices.

I started as an apprentice on £6K a year about 10 years ago. If I hadn't have done it then who knows. I could've ended up doing minimum wage jobs for the next 20 years.

Now I run the company I started at 9 years ago as an apprentice and have had all training paid for (HNC, Degree, Masters etc.). I have also employed 4 apprentices since I finished, increased their base pay and given them a great platform to build a career.

Edited by T5SOR on Wednesday 9th July 20:26

Happy to go with that until it's an apprenticeship in waiting tables....

[surveyor]

An update...

Boss offered a step-son a promotion to trainee supervisor apprentice in a month if he kept his nose clean... This would mean more money (I'm guessing not much.

As it happens one of the other job applications that he had made came good during the week and he starts as a trainee insurance clerk on minimum wage on Monday.

While it's a poor position it's a damn sight better than what he had, and can hopefully lead to good things.

[surveyor]

Vaud said:

kev b said:

I don't like the scorn pouring down on waiters from this thread, it might not be rocket surgery but good waiters are a very valuable asset for a restaurant.

An expert waiter can increase sales and profit considerably and make the front of house run like a well oiled machine. If you learn the job properly then you have a skill for life, however most top waiters are foreign because abroad waiting on is a respected profession and not looked down on as we Brits tend to do.

I suspect a great many of those who sneer at waiting on would not last a day if they had a try.

BTW I am not a waiter.

Being a good waiter is very hard. I've been one in a high end pub/inn chain many years ago, and that was hard, but good fun. Not hard to spot opportunities to make a customer experience better, or to upsell, or to get good turnaround on a table under pressure for covers. All makes for good tips. But like all sales - it needs some empathy and savvy.

But it's not a profession which leads to a skilled rewarded vocation, typically. I'd have no issues if he was paid minimum wage, but an apprentice waiter is really just a piss take. He worked 36 hours finishing 11pm or later. Pay we worked out at about £90. Getting it will be interesting...

Ps. I don't think it's only the small firms using this wheeze to pay peanuts.....

[surveyor]

Have to bide my time. Daft lad has put restaurant boss down as for a reference.

Now bear in mind that he was supposed to work at the weekend, but as we were away and he knew he had a another job he did not bother turning up..... (Not something I agree with - albeit I can understand why - essentially too timid to say I'm off), this could be interesting.

[surveyor]

Blown2CV said:

hidetheelephants said:

surveyor said:

Have to bide my time. Daft lad has put restaurant boss down as for a reference.

Now bear in mind that he was supposed to work at the weekend, but as we were away and he knew he had a another job he did not bother turning up..... (Not something I agree with - albeit I can understand why - essentially too timid to say I'm off), this could be interesting.

WTF? He's putting someone he's worked for for a whole 5 minutes as a reference? Have a word with him; at that age character references are what most school leavers have to use, so school teachers/scout leaders/etc. Rather more sensible than some bozo he's known for a very short time who's a chiselling scrooge and is only interested in cheap labour.

well it's 2 errors, the choice of referee and also the not turning up for work which is a good idea 0% of the time. When you add those things together, not quite sure what he was thinking, youngster or no.

Not turning up I can understand. I'm not sure if have bothered in his situation, although I would have the guts to say so.... Putting his name down as a referee is bloody stupid, but that's not out of character...

Think of a spaniel... Lots of energy, fairly loveable, but never learns, is daft as a brush and just gets up again after being told off.....

[surveyor]

tighnamara said:

surveyor said:

Not turning up I can understand. I'm not sure if have bothered in his situation, although I would have the guts to say so.... Putting his name down as a referee is bloody stupid, but that's not out of character...

Think of a spaniel... Lots of energy, fairly loveable, but never learns, is daft as a brush and just gets up again after being told off.....

Please read what you have written.
Doesn't bode well for his future if you say he is daft as a brush, never learns and to think of a Spaniel.
Just as we'll he put down his "short term employer" as a reference and not yourself.

He's 18.... Plenty of time to mature, and the above was not intended to be a reference. He's enjoying his training which is half the battle....

Eta are you my sister in-law?

Edited by surveyor on Wednesday 16th July 23:51

[surveyor]

Feel for the lad this weekend...

Told Friday night that they did not feel comfortable with his knowledge and not the job for him....

He'd really been trying hard, and had been enjoying it. It's hit him hard.

I was away most of the week, but I suspect he's been treating it like school and asking too many questions. His SouthWest accent does not help and makes him sound dumber than he is.

Back to the drawing board....

[surveyor]

Blown2CV said:

OK so is this the second job you're talking about now?

Yes. I think they've been a little harsh in not giving him a few more days, but it's their business and they know what works.

What's important to me is that he put the effort in, and that he does not get demoralised and keeps looking.

[surveyor]

Blown2CV said:

Does seem harsh to tell them they don't feel comfortable with his knowledge when it's quite clearly an entry level job. What job was it again?

Trainee insurance clerk.

I get the feeling they wanted them up and running after five days (between 10am & 4pm) training. Bearing in mind he'd never really come across insurance himself before and it's a trainee position.

[surveyor]

mph1977 said:

surveyor said:

Blown2CV said:

Does seem harsh to tell them they don't feel comfortable with his knowledge when it's quite clearly an entry level job. What job was it again?

Trainee insurance clerk.

I get the feeling they wanted them up and running after five days (between 10am & 4pm) training. Bearing in mind he'd never really come across insurance himself before and it's a trainee position.

if by 'up and running' they meant able to sit on the front desk and welcome people to the office , answer phones intelligibly, take messages , transfer calls etc , do things like run a simple motor or home quote then that's a reasonable expectation ...

in the mid 1990s when i was at school my mum worked for an insurance brokers - and in the holidays if staffign was tight I 'd occasionally get roped in to bulk up numbers in the office so there was someone to do the front desk / answer phones and do simple walk in stuff like motor quotes , for that i had the grand total of about 3 hours training - most of that was on how to do motor and household quotes.

This place is a boiler house of around 30,000 sq ft.

[surveyor]

Time to update....

But before I do. There's chasing a pay packet being a mugs game and being taken for a mug....

He started last week on a apprenticeship with a broadband company in customer service. Said company have a big issue I that the network upon which there backbone was placed closed earlier this month, and their planned migration failed. They have a lot of pissed off customers who are having to be manually migrated individually.

It's a sink or swim situation in two ways. He's been chucked into the deep end and will either catch on quick or be gone. The company will either survive this or not. If he and the company survives it could be very good for him.

We are away and just speaking to him he's a little down, out of money and being shouted at all days when he does not yet know how to resolve... It would have been nice if he'd been told what a mac code was.... Sorted out the money, the rest can only come with time....

[surveyor]

VX Foxy said:

Is he still there?

He is and enjoying it. The tough times have gone and he's no longer being shouted at by customers so much, they seem happy with him.

He did have a small problem with being on time. They retorted by putting him on a 11am till 8pm shift that pretty much killed his social life in the week. He's learnt fast about ramifications and is now on time.
I'm shortly off to take him in as it's 8am start this week which is difficult on the bus, so I'll walk the dog early...

Edited by surveyor on Thursday 1st January 19:53