Joining the Civil Service, what to look out for?

[V 02]

I’ve just accepted an offer for an entry level role at UKHSA as I would like to step into Public Health, which is what I am currently studying at University. I have no prior experience in the Civil Service and I am jumping ship from an insurance consultancy which has little progression prospects and has an overworked, high turnover team with little morale.

I had to fight my way into getting flexible hours at my current employer, in fact I actually resigned and was then rehired when they finally accepted my terms, but I am now on a rolling contract which gives me no sick pay, no annual leave and no benefits. To me it is just paying the bills, I don’t dislike my role and my colleagues but its clearly poorly managed and growing too quickly. I’m seeing new faces every week and familiar faces dropping like flies.

I have no idea of what to expect as an AO in a massive campus. Currently I am working in a team of 30-40 at best in a tiny office, UKHSA has around 2,000+ at the last report.

Is it a good place to work? Am I going to be a dogsbody? I know there’s good progression which attracted me in the first place.

Lastly, when do you think I should give my intention to resign? They’re telling me they want to keep me on for another 3-4 months after Christmas, which is when I intended to resign (by refusing an extension). Or do I tell them as soon as I sign the contract for the new role? As a 20 year old student I have very little experience with office etiquette.

[V 02]

MYOB said:

An AO with a degree? You will be doing boring admin work but progression is achievable (you can move to other Departments too). But it will be a fair number of years before you reach the levels that graduate enter into the Civil Service.

Surely you should apply to join via the Civil Service graduate scheme?

I haven’t got a degree yet. I am working towards one, but one of the reasons that swayed me was the possibility of having the rest of my degree funded + a funded master’s

I am on a flexible online degree, the only reason I’m working here is because even on a max student loan there just isn’t enough money to live comfortably, I’ve always been working. In the past I was a delivery driver before moving in to insurance. I could gain valuable skills in this role.

UKHSA know I’m on a degree, they’re happy to offer me flexible working around my study. One benefit being remote working and the offer of compressed hours

[V 02]

E63eeeeee... said:

It's generally polite to let your current employer know you're leaving as soon as possible, unless you think they'll dick you around in some way, in which case it should really depend on your notice period and/or your conscience.

UKHSA is, in my limited experience in the NHS/ health space, not hugely representative of the civil service as a whole, but it will depend massively on what job you're actually doing. An AO could be managing casework, or providing admin support for other people, depending on the complexity of the work. You're probably not going to be doing filing.

It was either this or using my existing skills to be working for a solutions firm as junior Loss Adjuster/Adjusting Technician, there’s far more money in Loss Adjusting for now but I thought this would be more beneficial for my future career prospects. That and the adjusting firms seem to be dreadful places to work. I’ve interviewed for about 4 roles and declined 2 on the basis of contracts, the other 2 I was turned down.

All they’ve really told me is that I’m going to be using something called Q-Pulse and supporting more senior members as a administrator/technician. They have been quite vague about the whole thing.


As per leaving my current role, I imagine it would be relatively painless.

[V 02]

MYOB said:

In that case, as long as you’re prepared to starting at the bottom of the food chain, go for it as it seems to suit your needs for studying.

If you broaden your horizon and are prepared to move around the Civil Service, there’s no reasons why you can’t expect to apply for promotion to the next level every 2 years until you reach the more senior levels.

But this is location specific. For instance, it’s much easier in Whitehall to bounce around various departments to get promotions and experience. Outside of London, opportunities are more limited but not necessarily impossible.

You should be on flexible working pattern and can normally agree (with line manager) to work to a mutually acceptable pattern. This will depend on your area of work and if there are external factors that dictate your working pattern.

If I graduate and gain a master’s in the relevant discipline while still an AO or EO, am I able to jump several levels into a senior role (the equivalent of what I would be able to get as a professional in the private sector?)

I feel like I am destined to be either a civil servant, a scientist, or a private consultant in the Public Health field. The biggest employers are UKHSA, local authorities, pharma/biotech, and the UN.

[V 02]

Thanks for all your responses, it has been very helpful.

My contract has come through, the pay is better than I was expecting

The salary is more than the starting salary for an EO, which is a pleasant surprise considering I am an AO

Around £3,500 more than I was expecting.

What’s no good is how useless the outsourced recruitment team is….


I haven’t heard anything back since I signed the contract. And no one from UKHSA itself has actually contacted me since I did the interview (when I started this thread)

[V 02]

xx99xx said:

Sounds about right. It usually takes around 2 months from point of offer to starting in the job. And some of that depends on how quickly the candidate returns all the paperwork. Bit crap that the line manager hasn't been in touch though. Very strange.

Why I ask if it’s weird is because I want to leave my current role sooner than expected. Since I handed in my notice, my time at my current role has quickly become stressful. The MD (it’s a small company) was pleased for me but my line managers have taken a dim view of it. Bear in mind I am a contractor and have no notice period so I was being nice giving 2.5 months notice.

Since I handed in my notice I have become subject to micro-aggressions from the managers which include

1) being placed on restricted duties (which started this past Monday)

2) having my work constantly monitored by the managers

3) moved to an isolated area of the office surrounded completely by managers and away from the team

4) Not being offered overtime or greeted by the managers.

5) I was given a verbal warning in an arranged private meeting for “distracting” another member of staff when providing them technical support with a case. This was explained but not accepted.


My morale has sunk through the floor in a matter of weeks. I was previously very happy in the job.

But I need the money and want to stay for the Christmas event. Do I jump ship as soon as I’m done?

It’s not clear to me what I have done to deserve this suddenly. I am naturally a outgoing and chatty person but I was doing well in the role and they offered me another contract extension days before I got this contract in.


Is there any way to speed up the process with the new role?

Edited by V 02 on Friday 17th November 10:25

[V 02]

I’m now nearly one month in, but it’s not been the smoothest of starts.

The recruitment process was abysmal.

Wondering what everyone thinks and what I should be doing.


Turns out:

1) my entire JD was wrong. I have a set of completely different tasks which I only found out on day 1, with little transferable knowledge from my previous role.


2) My line manager is inexperienced, but friendly. When i say inexperienced she started after me and has no managerial experience.

3) I was told by the hiring managers (the line manager’s line manager(, that I could start any time between 7:30-9:30am, up to me. This is wrong. I can only start at 9am, which is disappointing because I now commute for 1hr 20 mins trawling through London at rush hour, which is horrible.

In addition I did very little for 2 weeks because nobody trained me properly or knew what I was supposed to do.

4) The above would have been fine if I was allowed the work-from-home, my line manager had set this for me. Today is my first work from home day. I made 2 minor mistakes due to my inexperience (as my job role is not what I expected).

One of the other business managers, who is not my manager but works in another team, has complained and wrote an e-mail copying in my manager, and some other members of staff expressing her displeasure at me working from home and thus making mistakes.

I had already had a private conversation with her where I expressed my disappointment about her being against my work from home (she says she wants me to work 6 months, which I believe is insane). I spoke about my commute but she shot it down saying people drive further than me. I was internally frustrated as my situation is not the same as everyone else’s, I am a full time university student.

She also complained that I go for my 30 minute lunch at 14:00. I explained to her that I suffer from a chronic illness, which is true, and the medications I take suppress my appetite to where it is best for me to eat at 14:00 for its course. She didn’t like this/believe this and I heard her talking behind my back as I left the room. To reiterate she is not my manager. She is actually a nice person TBF. Personally I don’t see why I need to give any more information than this, as it is a private and embarrassing topic to me.


5) It is completely fair to undergo training before being allowed to work from home, but to be denied it for 6 months (after being initially told I can take it within a week) makes commuting expensive - I wouldn’t have bothered signing up for the job, as like I said I am a student, and it is even more draining than my previous job now. Working from home allows me to skip the commute and feel more relaxed. My own line manager has started my WFH from today, I can choose to against the other person but I risk pissing her off which might just cause more trouble.


I have scheduled a meeting with all of these staff’s manager - the big boss (the person who initially hired me) tomorrow. I want to know what I should say to alleviate the situation. I don’t want to quit - it’s too early to do that and I want to work for this department in the future, as the top employer or my degree role. But the mismanagement is starting to grate already.


Let me finish that by saying I have sought out all of my own training to even get me started

Edited by V 02 on Monday 22 January 16:58

[V 02]

Realised I might have got overly worked up, as I am a bit of a hothead (runs in my family)

I guess its not their problem if I live far away, but I should be entitled to flexible working, even if it is just for 1 day to begin with, surely?

[V 02]

I had my meeting with the hiring manager, who was very pleasant as usual. Just to clarify again, the hiring manager is also the other managers’ line manager.


She summarised it for me.

Her assistant business manager put in a complaint about “my behaviour”, and the performance of my line manager, and her criticisms of my training. (She didn’t agree with the complaint)

I explained I have been here 3 weeks and I’ve only just started, I don’t know what I’m really doing yet because no one has been training me properly (but said in a neutral tone without criticising anybody). She then said it doesn’t matter if the business manager complains, because they’re not my line manager.

But then she went on to say I shouldn’t have been given WFH yet until the probation period is over. She said they would be able to accept a possible compromise of a staggered transition into 1 day, but only after discussions with the line manager.

The line manager is chilled and accepted my proposal of coming into work 30-45mins early and doing 5 days a week to save me valuable commuting times (much to the fury of the business manager).

The hiring manager’s response was basically its not the business manager’s problem what you do so you can kindly tell her to FO.

[V 02]

I left the meeting content rather than happy. The WFH thing sorted, following the rulebook now, can’t complain if that’s the rules. They made reasonable adjustments by allowing me to come in earlier, to me that is the end of that matter they have done their job.

But I got in the office and my colleagues told me about how the business manager (but not my LM or the ones I had a meeting with)had called me “cheeky” and “disrespectful” numerous times.

Luckily I have a line manager and a team who supports me, people have been told they are being too harsh.

This is the only e-mail I sent to be accused of being cheeky:

For context, I had sent an e-mail to a general team, rather than a specific dept, as that was the e-mail on the training manual to speak to the dept.




Following the training manual as my response to a rude email.


So already within 1 month I have been ostracised and do not have good working relationships outside my team.


My colleagues advised me to just take it on the chin , for now. But everyone can see I am the new person to be kicked around.

Edited by V 02 on Tuesday 23 January 16:41

[V 02]

CraigyMc said:

Interesting email.

If you'd literally writen "is there a more up to date X?" rather than "send me X", you might have made a different impression.

YMMV.

To be fair, I think my wording was bad, whereas it wasn’t my intention to look rude. That was an email sent to another team.

I think I still need to learn a lot about the world of work. Maybe this is how it is for everyone lol

Edited by V 02 on Tuesday 23 January 15:08

[V 02]

I had another meeting, I was surprised to hear from the line manager and the hiring manager that they agreed with “my assertive but polite tone” in the above email (which I admit does appear quite badly worded and rude). I did mention that I was not trying to be assertive but that made me feel better nonetheless.

They came to get me like I was in trouble so I was thinking Oh st

It was then recommended to me that I no longer speak to that member of staff (the business manager) other than for pleasantries, and to stand up for myself, and to report any workplace political issues to the line manager.

And they’ve agreed to make an exception and allow me 1 WFH day after 3 months, rising to the official 2 after the completion of 6. All completely fair. I am happy with their decision.


I then had numerous people who were copied into emails come up to me and tell me not to worry, it’s almost if I was bereaved or something (I didn’t really think it was that big of a deal)

Edited by V 02 on Tuesday 23 January 16:38

Edited by V 02 on Tuesday 23 January 16:39

[V 02]

shtu said:

Classic response to having their processes shown as being incorrect\lacking - criticise the manner and tone of the person who raised it.

Rise above it, and in a couple of years you'll be far beyond where you are now, while that person remains exactly where they are, maybe with additional paperclip-supervision duties.

Thanks

Also I got myself corrected by the LM - the person I am referring to is the Support Officer to the Business Manager, so not actually a “Manager” at all.

Apparently she has been here a while, well before the CS moved to hybrid, and disagrees with the idea of flexible working as she thinks it’s unproductive.

[V 02]

Langweilig said:

"n addition I did very little for 2 weeks because nobody trained me properly or knew what I was supposed to do".

As a former civil servant of AA grade, that surprises me. When I started in the DHSS and CRU, I was given what's known as a "job shadow". That's another member of staff of a similar grade, to train you up to standard. It usually takes a couple of weeks and you could be placed on "training hours" - temporarily meaning a shorter working day .

I also had to attend training days and seminars in other government offices. That encompasses things like fraud prevention, IT security and manual handling training.

One more thing, Have a word with your line manager or EO and make sure you have your payroll number allocated to you.

Edited by Langweilig on Tuesday 23 January 20:10

What actually happened for me was all the people I was supposed to shadow were on AL for the first 2 weeks.
I work in a small team of 6, with only 2 in the office at any 1 time, the buddies were from different depts, my team were simply too busy to train me so printed off some work sheets for me to read which is the best they could do.
I only met my manager for the first time last week.

All training is online now, so I spent the whole time knocking through online e-learning.