F10 M5 Windscreen Replacement

[W8PMC]

Managed to pick up a not insignificant stone chip on the top left of my windscreen, thrown up by a cheese eating surrender monkeys Renault banger en route home from Le Mans. Was a tad pi$$ed off as the car is only a few weeks old & only covered 2k miles, however i assumed a repair would be straight forward & thought nothing more of it until turning up at my local Autoglass last Thursday.

The Engineer stated that due to the location of said chip it was possible a repair attempt could cause a stress crack & low & behold that's exactly what happened. Now a little annoyed but not overly i stated that a replacement would naturally be needed & could they sort this ASAP.

This is where for a few days things took a severe downward turn. Without boring you with the full details, basically Tesco Insurance didn't want to assist as they have a dedicated Windscreen repair/replacement service managed through National Windscreens (used to be Autoglass) & as i'd not followed the correct procedure i was only able to claim £175 towards the screen cost & this with an excess of £75 so net £100. A new OEM M5 screen fitted is just shy of £1000 so i was facing a big hit now. I kicked off with Autoglass for not stating this & therefore exposing me to a potential huge bill as they should have told me to ring my Insurer before they cracked my screen (knowingly) during the repair attempt. I also kicked off at Tesco Insurance for not being clearer in NOT using the obvious choice for a windscreen repair as per Autoglass's advertising & this compounded by the fact the Autoglass ARE an approved Tesco Windscreen repairer, but no longer their preferred.

After many calls & quite a bit of shouting, Tesco backed down & stated they would cover the cost of a NON OEM screen replacement by Autoglass. It's worth noting the little BMW stamp on the glass actually equates to £240 but i'm lead to believe the BMW stamp is the only difference between an OEM & non OEM screen. I then spoke to BMW & they stated that having a non OEM screen fitted could invalidate the cars warranty on technology linked/associated to the windscreen such as the various sensors, HUD & cameras. Getting more & more frustrated i then get back in touch with my Insurer to really this info & initially they were totally unconcerned & confirmed the actual screens are identical other than this bloody BMW logo stamped on the bottom corner.

After more calls i got this overruled & a new OEM screen is en route to Autoglass which will hopefully be fitted 1st thing Saturday.

Quick question, has anyone had a replacement screen fitted & if so did everything work as it should post replacement?

[W8PMC]

TheAngryDog said:

^^^ What? I had to recently claim for a new windscreen for my E39. Before I did anything I checked my documentation. If people cannot be bothered to check theirs, why is that the fault of the insurer / glass fitting company?

Because i was initially dealing with a stone chip (have you not seen the Autoglass adverts?). I DID read my Policy prior to calling Autoglass & no mention anywhere of National Windscreens. However i was later (once the chip became a full replacement) directed by Tesco Insurance to the 'policy handbook' that i allegedly should have downloaded when i took out the Policy. I had naturally downloaded the Policy document pack when cover was taken out, but hadn't spotted the link at the bottom of the welcome email to the 'policy handbook'

Perhaps you are the one person who reads the policy handbook in full, but i like most concentrate on the actual Policy, Schedule & Proposal etc. & these made no reference to National Windscreen & anyhow, Autoglass (as i said in my op) confirmed that if the windscreen cracked during repair then not to worry as i'd be covered by my policy which i think you'll find was incorrect.

[W8PMC]

Schermerhorn said:

I got a chip in my M6's windscreen a few months ago. Had to wait 3 weeks for a replacement but OEM screen.

Life shouldn't have to be so difficult with insurance and windscreen companies.

I feel for you OP.

Could the chip not be repaired? Autoglass had no issue trying a repair on mine & i was happy with that as the chip was well out of sight, however due to the screen being bonded i was told a stress crack was likely to occur during repair.

Any idea why you had to wait 3 weeks?

[W8PMC]

Schermerhorn said:

Mine looked like a person had shot it with a very accurate BB gun. The cracks with neatly positioned one on top of the other. I think it would have spread to be fair.

Re the 3 weeks, Autoglass offered to fit a standard E63 6 series windscreen which I declined. I told them it had HUD and that is what I wanted. Given that I used it so little at the time; March time, short days etc - I was happy to wait.

The original had to be imported in according to Autoglass. I don't know if that is true or not though.

Cheers. That's exactly why i pushed for an OEM screen as even BMW stated with a selection of sensors/systems relying on an OEM screen, i wasn't going to accept a standard screen even if they're both made by Pilkington. Now just need to hope Autoglass do a good job fitting it as am on track the day after;)

[W8PMC]

TheAngryDog said:

I only read it when I needed to make a claim.

Your failure to download the policy booklet is not your insurance companies fault.

I would never be naive enough to take the word of a 3rd party company without consulting with my insurance company first.

Anyway, at least you're getting it sorted. Lesson to be learned here.

Like i said, i read my policy documents (12 pages) fully before approaching Autoglass, however i didn't & saw no need to read my policy handbook as all the detail i needed appeared to be within the policy documents. A point Tesco Insurance obviously agreed with as why else would they now be paying out if as you say they were not at fault? That said & as you state, i will certainly always read the policy handbook in future years so a lesson most certainly learnt.

Also worth noting that had Tesco not been accepting some liability i would have been all over Autoglass as they at no point stated i might be at risk should the windscreen crack. They also had access to all my insurance details from Tesco so made it very clear they were fully approved but as it turned out not the preferred. Exact sentence from the Branch Manager was 'don't worry if the windscreen cracks as we'll replace this under my insurance policy' a statement that was clear incorrect & misguided.

[W8PMC]

Glassman said:

Much will depend on who you get on the day. IME, I would insist on OEM parts (and I mean, all the additional parts which the approved repairers tend not to fit to keep the expense down).

http://www.glasstecpaul.com/bmw-5-f10f11-windscree... is a brief guide and shows fitment of a genuine BMW windscreen with all the associated parts. Note the seal on the inside of the glass; not everyone will replace it - what you don't know won't hurt you etc.

I think your situation is a good example of why it is so important to make sure these things are thrashed out BEFORE policy inception. Personally, I'd rather pay for the screen myself, or pay the extra/supplement to have the restriction/capping/limit removed. Also, this is a claim scenario and a salient point which IMHO, should be discussed in terms of what would happen in the event of.

ICOBS 6.1.5 is a requirement.

"A firm must take reasonable steps to ensure a customer is given appropriate information about a policy in good time and in a comprehensible form so that the customer can make an informed decision about the arrangements proposed".

6.1.7(2) is guidance (but usually followed) and "policy terms, including its main benefits, exclusions, limitations, conditions and its duration" should be shown.

Annex 2 suggests a Policy Summary to be included (it must for a life policy), and to show :-

Significant features and benefits.
Significant or unusual exclusions or limitations, and cross-references to the relevant policy document provisions.

They don't require the summary (i.e. not the small print) to show everything, just things that may not normally be found in comparable contracts.

i.e. enough information to allow them to make a informed decision.

Reading that booklet is key... but who wants to read 64 pages of stuff that makes no sense?

Thanks Glassman. I was fairly confident Autoglass & my Insurer were lying relative to OEM & non OEM screens being identical other than the BMW logo, which is why i pointed the same question to BMW & they said only OEM was acceptable & after much fighting that's now what i'm getting.

TBH, the Autoglass Engineer didn't give me much info relating to the chip/possible cracking, other than the chip being very close to the top right corner which being a bonded screen was quite likely to result in a stress crack during repair. In this he was correct as after scraping the chip a little to clean it, he applied the cup & within seconds the screen cracked.

Defo a lesson learnt, but the end result is acceptable so other than the hassle factor, all should be well. Just hoping all the connected systems work after the screen replacement & they don't cause any paintwork damage whilst fitting the new screen

[W8PMC]

chris56 said:

This is a direct consequence of poor research - firstly by not reading what you were buying when taking out Tesco Insurance - presumably you went for Tesco Insurance because they were one of the cheapest quotes and secondly not checking what you could claim for before allowing Autoglass to work on the car windscreen.
One of the most likely claims on your car insurance policy is a windscreen claim and insurers are trying to weasel out of paying for proper screens by imposing excess clauses if you do not use their chosen (cheapest) windscreen supplier.
Classic case of you get what you pay for.

A very unusual response.

Having owned many let's say many pleasant vehicles & having insured all of them, where would you class Tesco Insurance as any better worse than every other available motor insurer? As far as i'm concerned & i'm no expert but fairly well qualified, good value & reputable can be found easily & i'd put many of your Household name Car insurers in this camp & in fact many are basically umbrella companies for one physical insurer.

I'd eat my policy booklet if anyone chose an insurer purely due to their levels of windscreen cover & excess for the same. I'm fine in the knowledge i should have paid more attention to the handbook, whilst at the same time Tesco Insurance & Autoglass should have paid more attention in their levels of communication & customer service.

I doff my cap in you're being correct that Tesco were in fact the cheapest this year for my M5 (first time they've ever come close to a good quote), but i've been with Kwik Fit, Direct Line, CCI, Elephant, Admiral & many others over the years & i VERY MUCH check that i'm getting the correct cover for my needs & dealing with a reputable firm, however i don't pay a huge amount of attention to windscreen cover.

Pretty sure i did get what i expected from Tesco insurance as my OEM (BMW stamped) screen has arrived at Autoglass & will be fitted to my car tomorrow

Lastly & as said above, i approached Autoglass regarding the repair before speaking with my insurer & they (Autoglass) confirmed they were an approved Tesco windscreen repair/replacement company, had access to my policy details & assured me all was well even should the screen crack during the repair. Perhaps believing Autoglass was stupid of me, but i saw no reason to think they were lying which to be fair they were.

[W8PMC]

All sorted & am happy again, although i musty have the worst M5 luck as on my way to Autoglass in Preston on Saturday to get said screen fitted, some ar$ehole jumped a red light & hit the rear offside wheel/back bumper on my car & then proceeded to reverse back up the road & do one

Police were about as much use as an ashtray on an R1 so couldn't even be bothered to attend the scene. Turns out through good luck & good defensive driving, the only damage was a scuff on the rear bumper behind the wheel & some deep scratches on the wheel itself, no mechanical damage was suffered & no injury. I think a decent wheel refurb & smart repair will get the car looking perfect again.

Tracked her yesterday at Anglesey & WOW, she behaved beautifully & kept some tidy machinery very honest. Am now fully in love with this car.

A funny photo i took this morning of the twins:

[W8PMC]

forest172 said:

I don't believe it. On Sunday my defender got a bad stone chip on the passenger side of the screen and half an hour ago my m5. Smack in the line of vision. So Paul, what should I now do? I'm also with tesco insurance.

Is your troublesome m5 for sale now on a forecourt?

Edited by forest172 on Wednesday 9th July 16:37

Ring your Insurer (via the Windscreen Claim Line on your policy document). They'll advise you & should the screen need replacing, make sure you DEMAND on OEM screen. Only way i know you can tell is the OEM screen has the BMW logo stamped on it.

The rejected M5 is on it's way down South but it was being collected by BCA so it may be going to Auction.

[W8PMC]

tobybmw535i said:

Looks Good next to its Twin! Glad you are ok but you need to find the ahole who crashed into you!

Pretty sure all the damage can be rectified with smart repairs/wheel refurb so i'm less annoyed now than i was at the time. Had the car checked over & no mechanical damage whatsoever & also had the wheel alignment check via one of those fancy laser systems & that's also spot on so purely cosmetic & even that's now minimal after some diy polishing over the weekend.

[W8PMC]

Glassman said:

...which diverts the inbound call to the prevailing preferred repairer who will answer the call with something like, "Tesco Glassline", non?

Yes. As per earlier in this thread, it's National Windscreens but i'd not want anyone to suffer the same hassle i did so would suggest following the 'ring the insurer route'.

[W8PMC]

crossy67 said:

Good post Chris and one I'd have made my self. And good response Paul.

Tesco buy things cheaply and sell them cheaply for profit often at the expense of the producer, they have a reputation for it if you believe the media. Tesco policies used to be provided by Direct Line (UKI (RBS, iirc)) when I left the UK they were provided by Fortis (AGEAS).

As you said Paul, they are almost all the same insurance company masquerading behind a different front.

I have used the AG repair kit for 7 years whilst I worked there and a couple after. It's vacuum operated kit that is supposed to suck the air out of the chip prior to injecting it with Gavin's special sauce via a pig vacuum cup stuck to the outside of the glass. Think about that for a minute. You have a flaw in a piece of glass, would you press that flaw with your palm from the inside? That is in effect what that vacuum cup is doing on the outside.

Really glad you got it sorted and are happy with the outcome Paul. I would have said the best outcome would have come from genuine glass fitted by a proper glass fitter.

Which fortunately is what i ended up with, although i had to fight my corner to get it.

A lesson learnt by all as Tesco rightly admitted they should be far clearer in their requirements & not rely on the policy booklet which nobody reads. Autoglass agreed they should have informed me they're NOT Tesco's nominated supplier rather than pretending they were so i'd have been best checking my policy before they proceeded to crack my windscreen.

Edited by W8PMC on Thursday 10th July 09:05

[W8PMC]

crossy67 said:

One of the biggest causes of glass breakages are from tiny stone chips on the black line round the perimeter of the glass. This is for many reasons. They are not seen easily so left to crack, they are not as audible when they occur because they are on a part that is supported and not hollow as it were.

Lastly and by far the most common reason is because there is a stress concentration in this area due to it being where the bond is applied and even more importantly, the manufacturing process. When a screen is made it's cut out of flat float glass which is then sat on a metal jig. This is all then put through a kiln where the class sags to the shape of the jig, the glass is supported by a rim all the way round, this causes the glass to cool at different temps round it's edge leaving stress concentrations round the screens perimeter.

If like me you're an anorak take a look here, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fg3moEI9V5g . At 3.00 mins you can see this jig and at 4,15 you can see the stress concentrations.

As above. If you can't see any significant chip in the screen then the likely reason is it was badly fitted 5 days ago. Being bonded, the screen forms part of the structural integrity of the car so if fitted incorrectly it would soon develop stress cracks. Mine went during a chip repair & the glass company stated this could happen as the chip being repaired was at the top of the screen. New OEM screen fitted & no problems, even though a few further small chips have appeared due to as you'd assume, stones hitting the screen & a couple of impacts were fairly sizeable without cracks appearing.

Hold out for an OEM screen (with BMW logo).

[W8PMC]

I probably stated this in an earlier post on this thread, but MAKE sure you contact your insurer & use their nominated Windscreen company. Also inform said company that you MUST have an OEM screen due to the Auto lights/wipers/HUD as they'll likely fob you off with a suitable screen, but it won't have the BMW logo & this 'could' invalidate your BMW warranty on items that require an OEM screen.

[w8pmc]

Chamon_Lee said:

Another one bites the dust!

Driving home tonight and bang! Heard it like I had been shot. Got home to see the chip with a 30cm crack too.

I understand standing my ground with the bmw windscreen but anyone had trouble with fitting at all? Or will AG or national be fine to do it. If I need to pay more for bmw to do it I will. I just want it done right. This is on an m6 GC

No issue as the major Glass companies will happily fit the OEM screen, but will usually take a few days for them to get one into stock.

As above, just make sure you inform the insurers that your BMW warranty will be invalidated if an OEM screen isn't used.