Z4m Coupe vs E46 m3 vS 996 Carrera
Discussion
After now owning my '06 Z4m for a couple of months I thought it may be useful to do a comparison of the driving experience and ownership vs the '01 E46 M3 it replaced and the 2000 carrera 2 that I had before that. When looking at the Z4m I read through a number of posts, and something like this would have been ideal, so I hope its helps someone else out in the future.
Z4M coupe. Out of the 3 the one I have had least experience with having owned it for only 2 months and 1500 or so miles as opposed to 15,000 on the E46 M3 and 12,000 on the porker, but here is my initial experiences.
Mine is a 37,000 miler in iterlagos blue. It was unfortunately a CAT D write off back in 2007 and the service history is a bit sketchy, but that gave me the opportunity to pick it up for under £10k. I am quite happy DIY'ing most minor repairs on my cars, so was happy that for the price I paid unless the engine or gearbox let go I had most things covered on a budget. Initially, I've had to deal with a faulty Throttle sensor, water ingress in the passengers side, and a dodgy button on the end of the indicator stalk which meant the fuel computer wouldn't scroll through. All easy dealt with for under £100 an a bit of time.
The look: Looking at it and sitting in it, it looks different and "special" compared to most other cars in this price range. looking out the mirrors over the high rear haunches makes driving feel more of an event. The porsche felt this way too. As good a car as the M3 was I never felt that with it, and never felt the compultion to look back at it after parking up the same as I do with the ZM or did with the porsche.
Now driving the Z4M: The engine is absolutely epic! I knew this already from the M3, but it has a slightly deeper less raspy noise in the ZM that rises to a race car howl at the top end. Driveability of the engine is superb, happy also driving round town as well as the redline. The seating and controls are all supportive and exactly where you would expect them and the cabin feels fitted round you and well built. The gearbox is precise, but hard work and needs a firm hand to go into gear. This combined with a sharp clutch and aggressive throttle mapping mean making a smooth change at lower speeds is tricky and takes practice. At full attack the gear box comes into its own and shifting at high revs is easier.
Now an area which is quite subjective, the ride and handling. The ride quality is poor, not rock hard(I have a track prepped Mx5 with solid bushes which is hard as a comparison) but jittery and not composed. The car feels unsettled and just not planted when cornering. This almost spoiled the experience for me initially, as I was scared to push the car unsure of grip levels. Once you push past these fears and get experience with the car though, you realise that grip levels are much higher than expected, and the car is actually quite tame and controllable at the limit. There is a lean towards understeer when cornering hard, but slower in to the corner and more throttle from the apex through tucks the nose in a bit more and overcomes this. Very similar to the 911 in that way. Now that i'm starting to get used to it, is proving to be great fun and really rewarding, it's just not a car you can get in to and drive flat out straight away like an M3 or a quick Audi. Once you get use to this though, it rewards in bucket loads. I have a set of eibach springs in the garage to fit in the next few weeks, which may help improve the jittery ride and I may possibly go for coilovers in the future to sort it out totally. That combined with pulling the strut pins on the front for more negative camber and the 19" CSL's that ive already fitted should see it really well set up for the future. For the money its different than most other things out there and the performance is hard to beat. It just takes a bit of warming to before you learn to love it. I can't now think of what I would change it for under £20k.
E46 M3: I owned this for just under 3 years so had plenty of experience in it. Where the Z4M and 911 took time to work out the handling and get comfy with the car to drive it to its potential, the m3 flattered, rewarded and inspired confidence from the word go. The engine was an awesome bit of engineering with sharp throttle response and rasp at lower revs and the same glorious howl at high revs as the z4m. I often took it for the daily commute to work and regularly managed mid 20's to the gallon as well which was exceptional for the performance. The car was bulletproof, costing me no more than a couple of services, wear and tear items, some suspension bits and a wheel speed sensor in my time of ownership.
Driving the car, the gear change was notchy 1st to 2nd, but ok through the rest of the box and much easier to drive smoothly than the Z4m. The brakes were good, but fell way short of the Porsche which was brilliant and the Z4m which had the improved brakes from the CSL. The handling at the limit was composed and balanced, with lots of sideways action possible if provoked and it always felt very controllable.
My only issue with the car was the lack of occasion when driving it. The interior was like any other well specced 3 series. At full attack on the right road the car was brilliant, driving at 50% it just felt very much again like any other quick 3 series. It being so easy to drive also took away a little from how rewarding it was when driven hard as it didn't take the same concentration or skill to get the best out of it. That combined with the current drug dealer/ boy racer image was what made me sell it. Great car and with the prices now below £7.5k an absolute bargain for what you get.
911 Carrera 2
I was just 30 at the time when I bought it and owning a 911 was a dream. Every time getting behind the wheel was an occasion. The car sounded, felt and drove like a sports car and I enjoyed every time i took it out of the garage.
The engine pulled strongly to the redline, but I always felt it was a bit lacking in low down and mid range torque (coming from a 5L V8 Chimaera to it probably didn't help) and the redline was also a bit lower than that on the BMW straight 6. The noise was more sporty and throaty at lower to mid revs than the S54, but just couldn't match the howl of the straight 6 at the top end. The 0-60 times are similar to the M3 and Z4M, but it never felt as quick for in gear overtaking.
It took a while to get used to the handling with all the weight over the back wheels, it was very much slow in fast out with the huge 11" rear wheels rocketing the car out of the corner. Once learned however the mid corner grip was eye popping and very confidence inspiring. the turn in was precise and every control felt perfectly weighted. The light front end bobbing over bumps took a bit of getting used to, but that didn't take long. My favourite of the 3 to drive without a doubt and if this was the only consideration in the package, I would still have one, or better still a 997 carrera
Now here comes the limitation's of the porsche: The interior whilst solidly enough screwed together in mine, was very dated looking. It didn't bother me too much 7 years ago when I bought it, but it looks even more old fashioned now. The 996 (and now 997) engines have a poor reputation for reliabilty and ultimately a pretty high failure rate. This combined with a realistic replacement price of £7k- £8k for a good second hand engine that could equally go pop in another 10,000 miles was too much of a risk for me on a car that was only worth £14k when I sold it. I had a great independant porsche specialist that looked after the car who was relatively cheap for labour, but parts were eye watering in comparison to BMW. Consumables like brake discs and tyres were almost twice the price of any bits for an M3. One of the radiators had a small leak and I spent a few sleepless nights worrying that the coolant may have disappeared somewhere more sinister before it was diagnosed as the rad and replaced. I never felt sure about it after that and sold the car 2 or 3 months later.
Conclusion: If I were looking for a £40k second hand sports car that still had warranty on it, I wouldn't hesitate to have another 911. At the age and price range I am buying in however an "M" just makes more sense. For under £20k you are getting a newer car than the 911, one that is more reliable, cheaper to run(and repair if anything major does let go) and is 95% as good to drive. Find a good M3 or Z4M look after it and its the performance bargain of the decade!
Z4M coupe. Out of the 3 the one I have had least experience with having owned it for only 2 months and 1500 or so miles as opposed to 15,000 on the E46 M3 and 12,000 on the porker, but here is my initial experiences.
Mine is a 37,000 miler in iterlagos blue. It was unfortunately a CAT D write off back in 2007 and the service history is a bit sketchy, but that gave me the opportunity to pick it up for under £10k. I am quite happy DIY'ing most minor repairs on my cars, so was happy that for the price I paid unless the engine or gearbox let go I had most things covered on a budget. Initially, I've had to deal with a faulty Throttle sensor, water ingress in the passengers side, and a dodgy button on the end of the indicator stalk which meant the fuel computer wouldn't scroll through. All easy dealt with for under £100 an a bit of time.
The look: Looking at it and sitting in it, it looks different and "special" compared to most other cars in this price range. looking out the mirrors over the high rear haunches makes driving feel more of an event. The porsche felt this way too. As good a car as the M3 was I never felt that with it, and never felt the compultion to look back at it after parking up the same as I do with the ZM or did with the porsche.
Now driving the Z4M: The engine is absolutely epic! I knew this already from the M3, but it has a slightly deeper less raspy noise in the ZM that rises to a race car howl at the top end. Driveability of the engine is superb, happy also driving round town as well as the redline. The seating and controls are all supportive and exactly where you would expect them and the cabin feels fitted round you and well built. The gearbox is precise, but hard work and needs a firm hand to go into gear. This combined with a sharp clutch and aggressive throttle mapping mean making a smooth change at lower speeds is tricky and takes practice. At full attack the gear box comes into its own and shifting at high revs is easier.
Now an area which is quite subjective, the ride and handling. The ride quality is poor, not rock hard(I have a track prepped Mx5 with solid bushes which is hard as a comparison) but jittery and not composed. The car feels unsettled and just not planted when cornering. This almost spoiled the experience for me initially, as I was scared to push the car unsure of grip levels. Once you push past these fears and get experience with the car though, you realise that grip levels are much higher than expected, and the car is actually quite tame and controllable at the limit. There is a lean towards understeer when cornering hard, but slower in to the corner and more throttle from the apex through tucks the nose in a bit more and overcomes this. Very similar to the 911 in that way. Now that i'm starting to get used to it, is proving to be great fun and really rewarding, it's just not a car you can get in to and drive flat out straight away like an M3 or a quick Audi. Once you get use to this though, it rewards in bucket loads. I have a set of eibach springs in the garage to fit in the next few weeks, which may help improve the jittery ride and I may possibly go for coilovers in the future to sort it out totally. That combined with pulling the strut pins on the front for more negative camber and the 19" CSL's that ive already fitted should see it really well set up for the future. For the money its different than most other things out there and the performance is hard to beat. It just takes a bit of warming to before you learn to love it. I can't now think of what I would change it for under £20k.
E46 M3: I owned this for just under 3 years so had plenty of experience in it. Where the Z4M and 911 took time to work out the handling and get comfy with the car to drive it to its potential, the m3 flattered, rewarded and inspired confidence from the word go. The engine was an awesome bit of engineering with sharp throttle response and rasp at lower revs and the same glorious howl at high revs as the z4m. I often took it for the daily commute to work and regularly managed mid 20's to the gallon as well which was exceptional for the performance. The car was bulletproof, costing me no more than a couple of services, wear and tear items, some suspension bits and a wheel speed sensor in my time of ownership.
Driving the car, the gear change was notchy 1st to 2nd, but ok through the rest of the box and much easier to drive smoothly than the Z4m. The brakes were good, but fell way short of the Porsche which was brilliant and the Z4m which had the improved brakes from the CSL. The handling at the limit was composed and balanced, with lots of sideways action possible if provoked and it always felt very controllable.
My only issue with the car was the lack of occasion when driving it. The interior was like any other well specced 3 series. At full attack on the right road the car was brilliant, driving at 50% it just felt very much again like any other quick 3 series. It being so easy to drive also took away a little from how rewarding it was when driven hard as it didn't take the same concentration or skill to get the best out of it. That combined with the current drug dealer/ boy racer image was what made me sell it. Great car and with the prices now below £7.5k an absolute bargain for what you get.
911 Carrera 2
I was just 30 at the time when I bought it and owning a 911 was a dream. Every time getting behind the wheel was an occasion. The car sounded, felt and drove like a sports car and I enjoyed every time i took it out of the garage.
The engine pulled strongly to the redline, but I always felt it was a bit lacking in low down and mid range torque (coming from a 5L V8 Chimaera to it probably didn't help) and the redline was also a bit lower than that on the BMW straight 6. The noise was more sporty and throaty at lower to mid revs than the S54, but just couldn't match the howl of the straight 6 at the top end. The 0-60 times are similar to the M3 and Z4M, but it never felt as quick for in gear overtaking.
It took a while to get used to the handling with all the weight over the back wheels, it was very much slow in fast out with the huge 11" rear wheels rocketing the car out of the corner. Once learned however the mid corner grip was eye popping and very confidence inspiring. the turn in was precise and every control felt perfectly weighted. The light front end bobbing over bumps took a bit of getting used to, but that didn't take long. My favourite of the 3 to drive without a doubt and if this was the only consideration in the package, I would still have one, or better still a 997 carrera
Now here comes the limitation's of the porsche: The interior whilst solidly enough screwed together in mine, was very dated looking. It didn't bother me too much 7 years ago when I bought it, but it looks even more old fashioned now. The 996 (and now 997) engines have a poor reputation for reliabilty and ultimately a pretty high failure rate. This combined with a realistic replacement price of £7k- £8k for a good second hand engine that could equally go pop in another 10,000 miles was too much of a risk for me on a car that was only worth £14k when I sold it. I had a great independant porsche specialist that looked after the car who was relatively cheap for labour, but parts were eye watering in comparison to BMW. Consumables like brake discs and tyres were almost twice the price of any bits for an M3. One of the radiators had a small leak and I spent a few sleepless nights worrying that the coolant may have disappeared somewhere more sinister before it was diagnosed as the rad and replaced. I never felt sure about it after that and sold the car 2 or 3 months later.
Conclusion: If I were looking for a £40k second hand sports car that still had warranty on it, I wouldn't hesitate to have another 911. At the age and price range I am buying in however an "M" just makes more sense. For under £20k you are getting a newer car than the 911, one that is more reliable, cheaper to run(and repair if anything major does let go) and is 95% as good to drive. Find a good M3 or Z4M look after it and its the performance bargain of the decade!
Thanks for the positive comments guys. Good points on the early bearing issues on the s54, however they have been mostly dealt with by a BMW recall and only applied to early 2001-2002 models iirc. Rear sub frames cracking on the e46 can also be an issue, however £1500 or so for repair is still significantly better than the cost of a 996 engine. I belive the 997 failures are less, with an improved ims however the failure rate still seems to be high particularly on the carrera s. Google "997 engine failure or bore scoring" and you'll see the issues. great cars if you go into them with your eyes open to the potential pitfalls. Now a 996 turbo. Get over the dated interior and put aside a bit of cash each year for consumables and you have a genuine reliable super car (bulletproof race derived engine rather than the chocolate ones in the non turbo) that will hang on to most modern cars under £100k. Not in my price range at the moment though I'm afraid.
I Also agree with the comments on Cat D/C write offs. I've had 3 now over the years, and my way of looking at it is as long as it has been properly repaired, it is a good way to run a better/newer car than you would otherwise be able to afford.
My Z4M coupe for example would have been in the £16k range for the same age mileage and spec. I got mine for £9,600. Drive the non Cat D one for a couple of years it depreciates say 25%. Sell it in 2 years time for £12k. Drive the Cat D write off for 2 years, it depreciates the same 25%(or possibly even less as the lower priced end on performance cars tends not to drop as much) sell it for £7200- £7500. Similar running costs over the piece and you have saved over £1500 in depreciation.
I managed to trace back the history of mine. It was a BMW fleet car written off at just under a year old. it looks to have been shunted from behind into a car in front. It had light rear end damage requiring a bumper, PDC sensor, left rear taillight, left rear quarter repair, passengers door repair. fairly light front end damage requiring a bumper, air con rad, front right wing repair, front drivers headlight, drivers airbag. No apparent chassis or structural damage, but more than enough with BMW parts prices and labour to write the car off.
As an example, when someone shunted the back of my wife's bmw X5, the total bill for just a new bumper and new twin exhausts was over £4500
The garage was waiting on BMW parts arriving so my wife had a brand new X5 courtesy car for 2 1/2 weeks at inflated insurance lease prices. The car was only worth circa £8k at the time and the insurance company would have probably sold it on for £5.5k- £6k in its damaged state. Were they to have been aware of the total bill at the outset, i'm sure the car would have been written off for nothing more than a bumper and exhaust.
My Z4M coupe for example would have been in the £16k range for the same age mileage and spec. I got mine for £9,600. Drive the non Cat D one for a couple of years it depreciates say 25%. Sell it in 2 years time for £12k. Drive the Cat D write off for 2 years, it depreciates the same 25%(or possibly even less as the lower priced end on performance cars tends not to drop as much) sell it for £7200- £7500. Similar running costs over the piece and you have saved over £1500 in depreciation.
I managed to trace back the history of mine. It was a BMW fleet car written off at just under a year old. it looks to have been shunted from behind into a car in front. It had light rear end damage requiring a bumper, PDC sensor, left rear taillight, left rear quarter repair, passengers door repair. fairly light front end damage requiring a bumper, air con rad, front right wing repair, front drivers headlight, drivers airbag. No apparent chassis or structural damage, but more than enough with BMW parts prices and labour to write the car off.
As an example, when someone shunted the back of my wife's bmw X5, the total bill for just a new bumper and new twin exhausts was over £4500
The garage was waiting on BMW parts arriving so my wife had a brand new X5 courtesy car for 2 1/2 weeks at inflated insurance lease prices. The car was only worth circa £8k at the time and the insurance company would have probably sold it on for £5.5k- £6k in its damaged state. Were they to have been aware of the total bill at the outset, i'm sure the car would have been written off for nothing more than a bumper and exhaust. The change fto the 19" csl replicas( duck for as someone has a go at me putting replicas on an "m") has netted just under 3kg saving per corner over the standard alloys and I'm sure improved the unsettled ride as well as given a bit more grip. Hopefully that combined with the eibach springs I have waiting to go on will see it better still.
Now after 2 months of ownership I genuinely think the early negative reviews the z4m was given were from journalists jumping in and writing on a one off short test. Give them more wheel time and time to learn the cars characteristics and I'm sure they would learn to love it too.
every time i drive the car I get more comfortable, appreciate it a bit more and push closer to the limits. It's a much twitcher, unsettled, rawer and harder work experience than an m3 will ever be. Given the right frame of mind though, it's all the better for that. We're it my only car, it would still be an m3, but with an e90 330d as my everyday runner, the experience of the z4m makes so much more sense as a second car.
Now after 2 months of ownership I genuinely think the early negative reviews the z4m was given were from journalists jumping in and writing on a one off short test. Give them more wheel time and time to learn the cars characteristics and I'm sure they would learn to love it too.
every time i drive the car I get more comfortable, appreciate it a bit more and push closer to the limits. It's a much twitcher, unsettled, rawer and harder work experience than an m3 will ever be. Given the right frame of mind though, it's all the better for that. We're it my only car, it would still be an m3, but with an e90 330d as my everyday runner, the experience of the z4m makes so much more sense as a second car.
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