E60 M5 Rod Bearing Failure! - Advice Really Appreciated
Discussion
Hello, I had my 2007 M5 for just over a month when the engine management light came on. I have a comprehensive Mondial warranty, so took it to the main dealer in Yeovil, who took the engine out and said that the rod bearings have failed and ruined the engine.
They've said its not worth even submitting to Mondial as it must have been driven very hard, and have charged me £2400 and left me with an M5 in pieces liberally spread over their workshop. I think it'll be at least another £8k to get back on the road with a recon engine!
I've now done a lot of reading and realised a lot of engines have this problem. Has anybody claimed through Mondial or can anybody suggest if i may have a case? I really appreciate any insight - been a very stressful couple of weeks!
They've said its not worth even submitting to Mondial as it must have been driven very hard, and have charged me £2400 and left me with an M5 in pieces liberally spread over their workshop. I think it'll be at least another £8k to get back on the road with a recon engine!
I've now done a lot of reading and realised a lot of engines have this problem. Has anybody claimed through Mondial or can anybody suggest if i may have a case? I really appreciate any insight - been a very stressful couple of weeks!
What the garage said was that they'd need to strip the engine further down before contacting warranty - the £2400 has got the engine out and sump off. They said they could go further into the engine, but my bill would go up at £130 an hour and warranty still wouldn't pay due to the worn bearings!
Really glad i checked the forums this weekend, looks like i have a busy day tomorrow on the phone!
Really glad i checked the forums this weekend, looks like i have a busy day tomorrow on the phone!
Thanks for all the advice so far, much appreciated. As pointed out, its felt like the dealer has tried their hardest to squeeze as much money out of me as possible.
The car has 81k, it has a full bmw history which the dealer (Westerly) checked before they took the engine out to make sure there were no gaps in case it was a warranty repair.
The last main dealer oil service was only 2000 miles ago with no problems reported and a clean health check. I'm really surprised there weren't any flecks of metal considering how bad the bearings are now.
I bought the car privately and put on 800 miles over the 5 weeks i had it before it died on me, plus the previous owner had just had a sensor changed at a main dealer a few days before he sold it and again there was a clear health check.
The dealer have said they very rarely deal with any M cars, so i'm sure their lack of experience hasn't helped.
I understood the risks of the V10, but thought a full history and comp Mondial warranty would cover me for the majority of scenarios.
I guess i'll find out in the morning when i start by calling Mondial.
The car has 81k, it has a full bmw history which the dealer (Westerly) checked before they took the engine out to make sure there were no gaps in case it was a warranty repair.
The last main dealer oil service was only 2000 miles ago with no problems reported and a clean health check. I'm really surprised there weren't any flecks of metal considering how bad the bearings are now.
I bought the car privately and put on 800 miles over the 5 weeks i had it before it died on me, plus the previous owner had just had a sensor changed at a main dealer a few days before he sold it and again there was a clear health check.
The dealer have said they very rarely deal with any M cars, so i'm sure their lack of experience hasn't helped.
I understood the risks of the V10, but thought a full history and comp Mondial warranty would cover me for the majority of scenarios.
I guess i'll find out in the morning when i start by calling Mondial.
I took the warranty out the day i bought the car, as I didn't want to risk running without one. Mondial have confirmed that the warranty is live and applicable for the date that the car first went into limp home mode and gave vanos faults, then got recovered to them by the AA.
I always let the car heat up before going over 3k rpm, as I have since owning turbo cars a long time ago.
I've spoken to Mondial, who have said they need a claim from the dealer before they can action or discuss anything.
I've spoken to the service dept in the dealer, where the only tech who worked on my car is away for 10 days on holiday and the warranty lady is away training until Thursday. The service receptionist restated that the tech said the worn bearings were likely caused by low oil or hard driving at some point in its life and not warranty work in his opinion. One of the first things the tech did when the car arrived was remove the oil, there was 8.5 litres in there, plus he said to me he thought the damage hadn't happened in the short time when i was using the car.
I think my next step is to speak to BMW direct, as I can see this being pushed into the long grass for a couple of weeks by the dealer, especially since i've already paid the £2400.
I always let the car heat up before going over 3k rpm, as I have since owning turbo cars a long time ago.
I've spoken to Mondial, who have said they need a claim from the dealer before they can action or discuss anything.
I've spoken to the service dept in the dealer, where the only tech who worked on my car is away for 10 days on holiday and the warranty lady is away training until Thursday. The service receptionist restated that the tech said the worn bearings were likely caused by low oil or hard driving at some point in its life and not warranty work in his opinion. One of the first things the tech did when the car arrived was remove the oil, there was 8.5 litres in there, plus he said to me he thought the damage hadn't happened in the short time when i was using the car.
I think my next step is to speak to BMW direct, as I can see this being pushed into the long grass for a couple of weeks by the dealer, especially since i've already paid the £2400.
When the sump was taken off and they pulled the bearing the tech then decided it wasn't a warranty job and i was left to pay the £2400. Up to that point they had said if it was a warranty job then i would only need to pay the £250 excess.
As i said, the car had literally just come out of a main dealer 2 days before I bought it with a clean bill of health, it had a main dealer oil service 2000 miles ago, plus i still have the ebay ad i bought the car from, where the car is sold in good health etc. I guess they can also see on the computer when the codes first started, which should clear up any confusion about whether this is a new fault or one carried over from a previous owner.
I'm in the process of writing an email to Jane Noble and Tim Abbott at BMW UK, to make them aware of the situation and ensure i'm ready for the dealerships next move when the warranty lady returns
As i said, the car had literally just come out of a main dealer 2 days before I bought it with a clean bill of health, it had a main dealer oil service 2000 miles ago, plus i still have the ebay ad i bought the car from, where the car is sold in good health etc. I guess they can also see on the computer when the codes first started, which should clear up any confusion about whether this is a new fault or one carried over from a previous owner.
I'm in the process of writing an email to Jane Noble and Tim Abbott at BMW UK, to make them aware of the situation and ensure i'm ready for the dealerships next move when the warranty lady returns
The repair just before I bought it was at a different dealership - Bowker in Preston. It had an engine management light come on, they replaced a throttle actuator and a crankshaft speed sensor and then gave it a clean bill of health and a standard inspection i assume they do on all cars. Could this be related??
The seller of the car did sell it privately as his own car for cash, from his home address. I also was driving it for over 5 weeks and 800 miles, so i assumed the Mondial warranty was my first port of call.
I sent an email today to Richard Price, the aftersales director at BMW UK, and was pleasantly surprised to receive a response within 2 hours. He will look into the situation and come back to me tomorrow. I attach the text of my email below - fingers crossed he'll 'motivate' the dealership into sorting themselves out.
I sent an email today to Richard Price, the aftersales director at BMW UK, and was pleasantly surprised to receive a response within 2 hours. He will look into the situation and come back to me tomorrow. I attach the text of my email below - fingers crossed he'll 'motivate' the dealership into sorting themselves out.
Hello, I am writing as I am experiencing some difficulties with one of your dealerships - Westerly in Yeovil.
I have recently privately bought a 2007 E60 M5 (MD57 YCZ). On the day I bought it I paid for a Mondial comprehensive warranty to ensure I was covered for all eventualities. The car has a full BMW service history and has 81000 miles. It had an oil service at a main dealer at 79000 miles and received a clean health check.
I was driving the car when the engine management light came on and advised me to go to a garage to seek advice. I had the car recovered to Westerly in Yeovil. They took the engine out and diagnosed rod bearing failure. The technician stated this was not a warranty issue and they declined to even contact Mondial to check if this was the case. I was then presented with a bill for £2400 of labour to take the car apart, plus an estimate of £20k+ to replace the engine.
I have since done a lot of research which has determined rod bearing failure to be extremely common in these S85 engines, and that they should certainly not be failing at 81k when the service requirements have been followed exactly.
I have now got my M5 in pieces with no engine at one of your garages, i'm out of pocket by £2400, plus i'm still paying for a very expensive 'comprehensive' warranty which has let me down badly on something i could never have allowed for nor be expected to service myself. I am feeling really let down by the experience, and I am reaching out in the hope you may be able to offer advice or help me. I feel the dealership is not on my side or attempting to assist me, and i'm hoping you can.
Thank you for your time
I have recently privately bought a 2007 E60 M5 (MD57 YCZ). On the day I bought it I paid for a Mondial comprehensive warranty to ensure I was covered for all eventualities. The car has a full BMW service history and has 81000 miles. It had an oil service at a main dealer at 79000 miles and received a clean health check.
I was driving the car when the engine management light came on and advised me to go to a garage to seek advice. I had the car recovered to Westerly in Yeovil. They took the engine out and diagnosed rod bearing failure. The technician stated this was not a warranty issue and they declined to even contact Mondial to check if this was the case. I was then presented with a bill for £2400 of labour to take the car apart, plus an estimate of £20k+ to replace the engine.
I have since done a lot of research which has determined rod bearing failure to be extremely common in these S85 engines, and that they should certainly not be failing at 81k when the service requirements have been followed exactly.
I have now got my M5 in pieces with no engine at one of your garages, i'm out of pocket by £2400, plus i'm still paying for a very expensive 'comprehensive' warranty which has let me down badly on something i could never have allowed for nor be expected to service myself. I am feeling really let down by the experience, and I am reaching out in the hope you may be able to offer advice or help me. I feel the dealership is not on my side or attempting to assist me, and i'm hoping you can.
Thank you for your time
Thank you for all the advice and support. I've now been assigned a customer service manager, Myra Gray. She is reporting back to me today or tomorrow after speaking to the dealership and Mondial. I've forwarded her a few links to the largest forum threads regarding rod bearing failures, so she is aware this is far from an isolated incident.
Hello again. Well, the warranty declined the claim. Here is the last couple of pages of the technicians report they based it on. Little wonder it was declined when the dealership stated it was due to low oil or hard driving. I've started a thread on M5board to ask if anybody has or knows someone who has had a similar job done under warranty, to give me an easy appeal.
Spoken to BMW, seems like i am in quite a pickle! The warranty company have revealed car does not have a full service history, it had a minor service done when it should have been a major.
Plus there were low oil warning logs dating back from before i owned the car.
Its unfortunate the dealer didn't pick up on either of these key facts before i authorised the engine removal, but i need to take stock of the situation before i decide what to do next.
Thanks for all the help, i feel i need a holiday.
Plus there were low oil warning logs dating back from before i owned the car.
Its unfortunate the dealer didn't pick up on either of these key facts before i authorised the engine removal, but i need to take stock of the situation before i decide what to do next.
Thanks for all the help, i feel i need a holiday.
Thepaperboy said:
I think the 2 comments made regarding running on low oil or driving too hard are not valid.
As you know if the oil level drops on an M5 you get warnings on the dashboard and the idrive every time you start the engine and the warning light doesn't go out until you top it up so I am not sure how this could be missed unless there was a fault with the sensor.
As regarding driving the car excessively hard..... it's an M5 which is what it is designed for!!!
If you need anybody to rebuild this engine I know a BMW specialist in the southwest who have rebuilt these engines before and he is brilliant.
Please can you let me know the details of the specialist? Working out my list of options and want a full picture. Thank youAs you know if the oil level drops on an M5 you get warnings on the dashboard and the idrive every time you start the engine and the warning light doesn't go out until you top it up so I am not sure how this could be missed unless there was a fault with the sensor.
As regarding driving the car excessively hard..... it's an M5 which is what it is designed for!!!
If you need anybody to rebuild this engine I know a BMW specialist in the southwest who have rebuilt these engines before and he is brilliant.
I did ask them to check the logs and history before, they said they had done as far as possible.......not far enough obviously.
Made the decision that life is too short, i've spent enough time and money worrying and stressing about this car. I'm going to list it on ebay as is, include engineers report and link to this thread and original ad.
See if i can recoup 8 or 9k, take the 12k hit and move on with my life. Hopefully there will be someone out there who fancies a project rebuild or put in a recon engine.
I'll post the link to the ebay thread when i list it.
Time for a break from M Power - it was a fun but very expensive 5 weeks of driving.
Made the decision that life is too short, i've spent enough time and money worrying and stressing about this car. I'm going to list it on ebay as is, include engineers report and link to this thread and original ad.
See if i can recoup 8 or 9k, take the 12k hit and move on with my life. Hopefully there will be someone out there who fancies a project rebuild or put in a recon engine.
I'll post the link to the ebay thread when i list it.
Time for a break from M Power - it was a fun but very expensive 5 weeks of driving.
Hello again, had some sleep and a run, feeling much better now. I've spoken to Jason at the Paddock garage (thank you for the info). I'm dropping the engine in to them on Tuesday, they are going to have a look and establish the extent of the damage.
I've sent a message to Myra at BMW to ask about the details of the problem with the service history and find out at how many miles the oil warning(s) were and whether they were asking for a top up, or a full stop warning.
As previously pointed out, not time to throw it away just yet - amazing the difference a good nights sleep makes
Also, BMW UK have offered to refund all the money i've spent on the warranty - very decent of them comsidering there was no prompting from me.
I'll report back as soon as i hear about the warranty and the state of the engine.
Thanks again, would have given up a long time ago without the forum.
I've sent a message to Myra at BMW to ask about the details of the problem with the service history and find out at how many miles the oil warning(s) were and whether they were asking for a top up, or a full stop warning.
As previously pointed out, not time to throw it away just yet - amazing the difference a good nights sleep makes
Also, BMW UK have offered to refund all the money i've spent on the warranty - very decent of them comsidering there was no prompting from me.
I'll report back as soon as i hear about the warranty and the state of the engine.
Thanks again, would have given up a long time ago without the forum.
Hello again, sorry for the delay but been away on holiday. The engine is still with Paddock Motors - their M power specialist was away on holiday and is looking at it this week.
I've decided to get it back on the road, whether that will be a rebuild with Paddock, or importing an engine from Troy Jeup in the US. He rebuilds engines with strengthened internals and ships them over for $10k.
I'm off on holiday to Peru for 2 months next week, so decided not to pursue the warranty route as life is too short and spent too much time and stress on this already. I'm happy to put the experience behind me, move on and look forward to actually enjoying the car when i get back.
I'll report back when Paddock have diagnosed the damage to the engine, plus given me the quote for a rebuild.
Looking forward to being an M5 driver again soon! Thanks again for all the advice and support
I've decided to get it back on the road, whether that will be a rebuild with Paddock, or importing an engine from Troy Jeup in the US. He rebuilds engines with strengthened internals and ships them over for $10k.
I'm off on holiday to Peru for 2 months next week, so decided not to pursue the warranty route as life is too short and spent too much time and stress on this already. I'm happy to put the experience behind me, move on and look forward to actually enjoying the car when i get back.
I'll report back when Paddock have diagnosed the damage to the engine, plus given me the quote for a rebuild.
Looking forward to being an M5 driver again soon! Thanks again for all the advice and support
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