E30 M3 standalone upgrade?

[e21Mark]

I'm at a point with my E30 M3 where all I want now is a bit more power and better throttle response, so am looking at replacing my Alpha N set-up with standalone from the likes of DTA-fast. I figured that if I did the ECU swap first, I could then fit lumpier cams, flow the head etc, once I've saved some more cash?

My most immediate problem with the Alpha N is how poor the throttle response can be (especially with heel & toe) and how sensitive it can be to weather and elevation. It can literally feel like a different car sometimes. I have replaced every relevant sensor, wiring etc and it runs a map and chip from a well respected supplier via s14power.net, yet it just doesn't have any immediacy to throttle input.

So, my thinking is that in an effort to get close to a reliable 250 brake I will replace the cams, have the head flowed, run bigger injectors and install DTA or similar and do this over the coming winter.

Currently I run a stock 2.3 with carbon air box and Alpha N as previously mentioned. Power is circa 210 - 215 brake. I guess I just wanted to get some opinions regarding my proposed next move, or is there a better option for similar budget?

[e21Mark]

Thanks for the reply. If honest I had to go through it a couple of times to really get a handle on what you're saying. I'm learning as I go.

I've been looking at running something along the lines of DTA S40 Pro as the chap who looks after my car uses DTA himself.

http://www.simtekuk.co.uk/product.php/dta_s40_pro/...

I've had a look around and there appears to be a few E30 M3 running them.

[e21Mark]

houlbt said:

Car looks fantastic Mark.... Who looks after your car and who will map it?

I don't have a lot to add to the excellent post from Steve except to say that the problems you have are really down to the current map and the limitations of what can be done with the existing setup as discussed. That said even with a proper ECU setup it is as Steve said only as good as the guy who maps it and imho there are few people who can really get these cars right.

Hi, Joe @ ARM BMW & Motorsport look after my cars and can't recommend him highly enough. That said, I know there's a knack to mapping s14's on AN his mapping will obviously be limited by the chip.

Jim M3 said:

Just got in from having mine mapped Mark.
Similar spec to where you intend going but still running A-N. I have to say as good as standalone can be, there is nothing wrong with the A-N IF it is mapped correctly with a custom chip. I had been running around on closed loop with one of John's (s14power) maps/chips installed and the difference to how it is now is quite frankly unbelievable.
There is certainly no lack of throttle response.
I know you are in Cornwall which means traveling a long way to anywhere but it is well worth the effort.
I use Wayne Schofield (Chip Wizards) in Warrington and you only have to talk to the guy and see the cars he is working on to realize he is incredibly knowledgable and superb at what he does. Have heard good things about Paul Shepherd also who is a bit closer to you near Castle Coombe.
Jim.

To add. Car felt exactly as you describe yours beforehand. Flat spots all over the place down low, no urgency etc. drove fine one day then different on another. Wayne actually started to try and map using the s14power chip but the car kept going lean for no reason so he started from scratch.

My plot:

Edited by Jim M3 on Thursday 11th August 11:53

Edited by Jim M3 on Thursday 11th August 11:56

Edited by Jim M3 on Thursday 11th August 11:59

Thanks for taking the time to post those Jim. I've also heard a lot of positive stuff about Wayne and have had many an email with Paul, but as I am sure you know, both are in demand and very busy. I've just messaged Paul though and will email Wayne this afternoon, to see if either will take a look at my car before I spend out on standalone. I know Paul asked me previously why I was thinking of removing AN as he was confident it just needed setting up correctly.

Can I ask what you've done to your engine? Those are some pretty impressive figures! I know people often talk about s14's with 300+ brake but they seldom seem to have the dyno sheets to prove it.

[e21Mark]

Unfortunately not, as I have to work unexpectedly. I was supposed to be doing a track day at Landau tomorrow too, so not a happy bunny. I'll drop you a mail now though.

Nice looking car by the way.

[e21Mark]

Well a weep of oil from the head gasket has brought about a change in plan. I figured that if the head is coming off anyway, I may as well fit new cams and have some mild flowing done, along with new tensioner, ARP studs etc. I just need to keep a reign on things as I know how expensive it can be to rebuild an s14! I'll most likely take the engine out next month and rebuild it over the coming autumn/winter.

[e21Mark]

Thanks. I've mailed a couple of people for advice re the porting (Marcus Moufang or Grant Motorsport) but I think my engine is a 195? The last 7 are AE41511 if that helps to confirm?

[e21Mark]

E30M3SE said:

215PS according to the VIN check I jut ran.

Thanks.

So I can swap my inlet cam to exhaust and just buy a Schrick for the inlet?

Is there any point looking at Cat Cams (or others) or should I just keep to Schrick?

Edited by e21Mark on Friday 26th August 19:52

[e21Mark]

Thanks Steve.

I have been talking to Graham Bahr and he is happy to do my head, install cams and re shim etc. I've followed his online posts for a while and he's certainly built some terrific m10 and s14 engines. Once my engine is done, I am intending on going to Wayne @ Chip Wizards for mapping.

Meanwhile, I have some serious overtime / saving to do!

[e21Mark]

Output Flange said:

Mark, do you have contact details for Graham Bahr? I've got an M88 head that needs some love...

I usually chat with him via Facebook but he now trades under Penguin Motors Ltd.

https://www.facebook.com/penguinmotorslimited

[e21Mark]

Well I went for the DTA (as came at a price I couldn't refuse) and am currently waiting on 284/276 cams from Schrick.

[e21Mark]

Same here!

I've also opted to go with Wössner forged pistons. The head is being flowed and the ports matched to the manifolds etc, so that should mean I get the best from the Schrick cams. A lighter flywheel is also going on. Mapping is being done by Sandy Brown (who can be found via google) and he's also making up the wiring loom. I'd like to get as close to 250bhp as I can but I'm unsure just how realistic that is?

Anyway, the head is due back anytime now and I can get polishing! My only question is this - Is it better to polish to a mirror finish (to aid gas flow) or is a textured (like brushed or satin aluminium) better to help air/fuel mix? I'm thinking the latter but have no sound knowledge or engineering skills to back that up!

Finally, do I need better injectors? I've been advised to go with some from a Vauxhall VXR as they benefit from a more modern design and spray pattern. Any thoughts?

[e21Mark]

Thanks Steve. Mine is a later 215 brake car.

[e21Mark]

Well the only thing not to have arrived yet are the ARP bolts and the head is off being ported. Sandy Brown is doing the mapping but also fabricating the wiring loom.

So spec' is as foolows -

Ported head
Schrick 284/276
New injectors (Vauxhall VXR)
Ligher flywheel
Wossner forged pistons

Obviously I couldn't drop a newly rebuilt s14 into a grubby looking engine bay could I?

[e21Mark]

stevesingo said:

If you are going with larger injectors I would revert to a stock FPR.

Hi Steve. I was wondering about that. I'm wondered if I might be better off just going with new OE instead? (Or at least having the current ones properly cleaned?)

[e21Mark]

Great, thank you.

[e21Mark]

Thanks Jim. Just bought a set new in the USA on special offer. £55!

Long shot but does anyone have (or know of) an s14 timing chain kit as they're on German back order, with no date in sight.

[e21Mark]

By 'kit' I was just referring to the bits needed, i.e guides, chain, sprockets etc. Most aren't available at the moment (from BMW) but have just mailed and asked for update.

Injectors from here - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232087100426?euid=3d309f...

[e21Mark]

Nice one. I'll mail today hopefully.

Thanks for heads up too Mark.

Got some rods as well.

[e21Mark]

ZRP. I've done a bit of online research and made a couple of calls where the general consensus seems to be that they're pretty good. I'm going to check weights, dimensions etc once they arrive. There are a few VAG turbo builds running them with no issues though,

[e21Mark]

ZRP. I've done a bit of online research and made a couple of calls where the general consensus seems to be that they're pretty good. I'm going to check weights, dimensions etc once they arrive. There are a few VAG turbo builds running them with no issues though,